A21 Feedback: Focus less on water, more on food?

[Markus Reese]

Good day,

 

I was pointed to forums from steam for feedback on my A21 experience and suggestions so far.  I cannot find any dedicated threads for this.  If there is one, I apologize and can repost there if am directed.  Will try to keep it short and sweet.

 

First: Not having any bugs yet. So no comment there.  If are bugs, nothing really of note.

Second: Loving the POI reworks. Maps, paths and everything are fun and exciting with one exception:

Rivers: I made a somewhat hilly region and the rivers don't really exist. Just oxbow lakes peeking out in hills. I think map generator could benefit with some rework to help rivers become rivers. As it is, is more like the river are made, then over-written by the hills/mountains.

 

Skills: I do like having the books to unlock new builds over the perks. I feel less pressure to minmax specific perks and can more smoothly build and balance. It does feel odd having to sort and find so many books to get built up, but overall do not dislike it. Is essentially an experience system by RNG?

Now the meat and potatoes... or jars and water?

First: Jars or no jars are a bit of a McGuffin. The issue is more we can see water and oddly have no way to collect it. From my readings of blogs etc? The point is sound. They want survival to be more survival like. I think though the way it was implemented was poorly done. I can understand removal of jars just to keep stockpile sizes down, but it doesn't really work for fun gameplay as a way to bring more of the survival side.  Realistically, if we have a way to boil water, than the dysentery part of things are fairly moot. From an immersion standpoint, it feels very odd.

 

My idea is a bit more effort, but bear with me as I poorly explain.

 

I think the way it might have been better to go about it is still treat water as a crafting resource with jars just being the visual. Make it more like fuel for dirty water. Then instead as a player, you build water container that is not stackable. So you consume some water which is like a raw resource in a forge in order to 'fill' it. So you can build larger canteen to hold more water in a slot. Tea, etc also can be made at the fire with the pot like this. So essentially the campfire has stored water like storing at the forge. 

 

Survival: Not water... but food!

 

So this is where I think survival pressure can be better brought in. Food. It would be food in the apocalypse that would hit most people. It is actually a bit silly how much meat we can get so easily. I think that if we want more pressure, then encourage the eating of canned goods more. Require skill to harvest more meat and bones. Takes a lot of skill to butcher an animal, but as it stands can find more meat than can do with. Just need to get those few books to grill meat and are set for life if luck into a grill.

 

I feel focusing on the food side more than water as a limiter will create much more the intended experience, then treat water as a crafting resource. Non or limited stacked resource will bring it more balance and planning.

 

Anyways, sorry for the big post. If want to discuss it or feedback, will try to keep my eye on the thread here.

Have a good day all!

[Old Crow]

This was a really well-written and thought-out post. A shame TFP won't care, sadly.

[Scyris]

3 hours ago, Old Crow said:

This was a really well-written and thought-out post. A shame TFP won't care, sadly.

 

This.

 

I'll be real thou in a apoc situation I think water would be more of an issue than food, there are tons of food sources out there, but once the bottled water we can loot runs out, where do you get it? Yeah you can boil river water but that does not make it 100% safe. For all you know there could be a bunch of dead bodies in the water upstream you can't see, and even after boiling that water it is most likely still not going to be safe to drink. Food is everywhere if you know what to look for, might not be the most appetizing looking thing as you may have to eat bugs or something, but it WILL keep you alive. Overall I'd worry more about getting drinkable liquids than food. Even more so as you'll die of thirst a hell of alot faster than you do of hunger.

[Markus Reese]

True, but water can often naturally filter. In real live the survival aspect for water is usually just finding a source. Once can boil, usually are good. Moving bodies naturally filter more. It does mean more prone to pathogens, but animals have lived hundreds of millions of years without dying. Stagnant water is where risk comes in. Is why beer was so common because alcohol wont stagnate like barrels of water which got so many sick.

 

But to still play off concept, I figure it can work in that is fallout/toxins that need filtering.

 

You would be surprised how hard it can be to gather enough daily calories to sustain yourself enough to keel functioning unless well versed in survival.

 

Basic science, just a steam condensing and all water issues resolved with a bit of ingenuity.  It just overall seems silly that getting even murky water is so difficult in the future.

[Scyris]

11 minutes ago, Markus Reese said:

True, but water can often naturally filter. In real live the survival aspect for water is usually just finding a source. Once can boil, usually are good. Moving bodies naturally filter more. It does mean more prone to pathogens, but animals have lived hundreds of millions of years without dying. Stagnant water is where risk comes in. Is why beer was so common because alcohol wont stagnate like barrels of water which got so many sick.

 

But to still play off concept, I figure it can work in that is fallout/toxins that need filtering.

 

You would be surprised how hard it can be to gather enough daily calories to sustain yourself enough to keel functioning unless well versed in survival.

 

Basic science, just a steam condensing and all water issues resolved with a bit of ingenuity.  It just overall seems silly that getting even murky water is so difficult in the future.

 

Animals also have bodies and systems designed to filter/negate that sort of stuff out of the water naturally, Humans however, do not. I mean in some places people will fare better for example if your in a 3rd world country with poor water systems, the apoc will prob hurt you less, as your body is already used to the dirtier water. But take someone from a big city in the USA or Canada or any other 1st world country, and stick them into a 3rd world setting and make them drink the water, they going to get sick as hell as their body has no way to deal with the stuff in the water, while locals to the area will be fine as they are used to it.

[Old Crow]

2 hours ago, Markus Reese said:

It just overall seems silly that getting even murky water is so difficult in the future.

 

Right? I shouldn't be finding more paper than poo water in toilets.