FlowerChild Posted January 5, 2015 Author Share Posted January 5, 2015 Regarding this: If the ammo-per-kill for rabbits is a problem, and they can't be modded down, perhaps a buff is in order? I believe they have like ten health and a pistol hits for twenty. If they had thirty or fifty health, it would take two or three shots to take 'em down.. You may have noticed I really hate tweaking hit points for balance in my various mods. With hp, I usually tend more towards what feels natural rather than what makes things harder or easier, and in this case I think having to shoot rabbits multiple times would feel distinctly unnatural Difficulty through hp is quite a pet-peeve of mine in general. -Farming is definitely too easy and fast. Especially corn gives so much for the effort. I've yet to really touch farming, and a balance pass for it is rather high priority on my todo list. Only thing I've done so far was amplify the changes the Pimps made in a recent release, as it was obvious to me while editing the files that they were far too timid, even for stock. As a general rule of thumb I hardly ever make balance changes that are less than double or half the existing values when something feels off, and if something feels *really* off (as it did with farming), I'll often opt for 4X or 10X multipliers. If I remember right, the Pimps applied a 1.25 to 1.5 multiplier to growth rate, which is in the realm of hardly noticeable balance adjustments, so I just upped the multiplier while porting the mod over to a new release. Will make much more extensive modifications in the future, but for something like blueberries, returning them to snow biomes is right off the table as I really dislike the all-you-can-eat effect that stuff like that and corn in plains biomes was having on the game. Especially with something like a snow biome that has an overall desolate vibe and where you were just finding food laying about everywhere. When push comes to shove, I'd much rather have a relatively useless plant than something like the above, but I do have some plans as to how to rebalance berries to make them worth farming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarudak Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 I definitely wasn't suggesting adding the plants back into the biomes. Finding food is already easy enough in the early game with those bird nests EVERYWHERE. I was just suggesting that blueberries and the pie needs something to make them shine but it sounds like you're already on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegrade Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 You may have noticed I really hate tweaking hit points for balance in my various mods. With hp, I usually tend more towards what feels natural rather than what makes things harder or easier, and in this case I think having to shoot rabbits multiple times would feel distinctly unnatural Yeah, it would be a little weird to have tank-rabbits... although, along this line of thought, I noticed that the ani-meals have the same health aside from the rabbit - 100. Plus most of the zombies. Would be nice if TFP could mix it up a little.. Difficulty through hp is quite a pet-peeve of mine in general. Not a big fan of it myself either, and difficulty-through-enemy-damage even less so. Anyhow, was just a thought I had whilst shuffling through the XML files. By the way - for my gag mod - is finding 7.62mm ammo in birds nests and being able to make the sniper rifle out of twigs laying it on too thick re: "#lolcrossbow"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlowerChild Posted January 6, 2015 Author Share Posted January 6, 2015 I noticed that the ani-meals have the same health aside from the rabbit - 100. Plus most of the zombies. Would be nice if TFP could mix it up a little.. I'll take a look at that. By the way - for my gag mod - is finding 7.62mm ammo in birds nests and being able to make the sniper rifle out of twigs laying it on too thick re: "#lolcrossbow"? If it replaces the crossbow recipe, you might actually be making things harder there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarudak Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 A couple more things. The sledghammer really feels lackluster. The thing is that it's really not a good weapon in comparison. The fireaxe headshots most zombies for the same amount (1 for regular and dog 3 for fatty) but the sledge swings slower and is more likely to end with you being hit. Plus the fact that it has no value as a tool is means I usually end up just scrapping them for iron. Which is lame cause it seems like I should be excited to get the sledge. To feel exciting either the sledge needs some use as a tool like if it was the only thing that could bust safes then you would really be motivated to go to the city and find one. Or if the fireaxe damage was nerfed or the sledge damage was buffed so it could one shot fattys then maybe I would use it. The other issue I'm having is antibiotics. I don't think I've found a single one off the nurses since the last patch. Maybe I've just been unlucky but it just feels too random. The infected debuff is really brutal especially when the only recourse is to loot houses and your stamina for running to POI or chopping down doors is in the toilet. If it were the case that there was a place I could go to stock up on antibiotics then it would be more interesting cause I would think 'I guess I got to make a trip to get cured' or even 'really wish I had stocked up on meds beforehand'. The closest thing is looting apartment buildings which I did once and think I got two antibiotics and even that felt lucky. As it is with antibiotics so rare infection is the one thing that makes me consider suiciding. I understand you felt like they were too common before but it's just not an enjoyable mechanic when a string of bad luck can deplete your antibiotics and leave you praying to the RNG gods every time you open a medicine cabinet or dresser. Anyway again thanks for the work you've done with the mod. On day 7 of my second playthrough. Just looted my axe and shovel (and sledges that I scrapped) and heading home to face the first big horde. Good times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegrade Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 A couple more things. The sledghammer really feels lackluster. The thing is that it's really not a good weapon in comparison. The fireaxe headshots most zombies for the same amount (1 for regular and dog 3 for fatty) but the sledge swings slower and is more likely to end with you being hit. Plus the fact that it has no value as a tool is means I usually end up just scrapping them for iron. Which is lame cause it seems like I should be excited to get the sledge. To feel exciting either the sledge needs some use as a tool like if it was the only thing that could bust safes then you would really be motivated to go to the city and find one. Or if the fireaxe damage was nerfed or the sledge damage was buffed so it could one shot fattys then maybe I would use it. From a damage perspective, the sledge is a significantly better weapon - it's 2.14 hits to down a fattie for the sledge, and 3.00 for the fireaxe. Unfortunately, when damage multipliers take effect, weapon durability and stamina damage reductions don't seem to be working properly (or were dumbed down/away), so it's not a noticable distance in practice... If they did work properly, it would take four hits for a fireaxe to kill a fattie as the first shot would reduce it's damage output, whereas a sledge would only take three for a long time before it required four. Note that a fattie has 300 health, the fireaxe does 20*5 on a head shot and the sledge 35*4 (gotta love hidden multipliers). If that multiplier bug is a temporary thing (ex. a bug) and we'll have properly working stuff in A10.5 or A11, I'd say not worry about it. If it's a specific design choice (or it never worked properly in the past and I was just imagining that it did) by TFP or such, it might have to be looked at, especially since the fireaxe drains half the stamina.. (Note that in vanilla the fireaxe is actually a terrible weapon, as it's headshot multiplier is only two) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlowerChild Posted January 9, 2015 Author Share Posted January 9, 2015 Yeah, I'd say the sledge is definitely underpowered/useless both in stock and within the mod, especially considering its price. Honestly, I think it might be best to eliminate it as it's always felt like a dangling loose end to me, and there's just not much reason for higher power melee weapons beyond a certain point. I also feel it acts counter to progression in a certain sense as you go from having combined weapons/tools, to requiring a separate slot for them again, which winds up feeling like a step backwards. For the fireaxe, the lower damage always felt distinctly unnatural to me which is why I gave it a boost. Weapon progression is all well and good but if it winds up feeling counter intuitive when you're whacking stuff in the head with an axe and they aren't dying, that takes precedence for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegrade Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Yeah, I'd say the sledge is definitely underpowered/useless both in stock and within the mod, especially considering its price. Yeah, considering the price, and also the broken stamina/durability stuff. If damage reduction worked properly, it wouldn't fade as fast as the clubs in stock (although it would still be rather costly compared to a spiked club).. the funny thing is, the stock survival knife is actually still the best weapon for clearing out hordes, since it can two-shot a plain zombie for less stamina than it takes to one-shot a zombie with a spiked club or sledge (75 vs 130/145 head damage, but 3 vs 8 stamina loss).. kinda like the bone shiv was before you fixed it I also feel it acts counter to progression in a certain sense as you go from having combined weapons/tools, to requiring a separate slot for them again, which winds up feeling like a step backwards. Yeah, it does run counter to the "Soulforged Battleaxe/Mattock" design, but I don't think TFP have that as a goal, unfortunately. (guns take up more slots than the crossbow, for instance (and TFP *thinks* the guns are better), stone axe becomes fireaxe/pickaxe/shovel, etc). If the fireaxe is supposed to be a high tech, multi-use, soulforged-like tool in your vision, then I say, "go for it!". I always liked the soulforged tool multi-use thing Just one thing about the fireaxe - it feels significantly worse against wood than the pickaxe is against stone. Except for those green drywall-like blocks, it seems to be faster to cut through a brick/concrete wall with the pick than a multi-stage wood block with the fireaxe.. For the fireaxe, the lower damage always felt distinctly unnatural to me which is why I gave it a boost. Weapon progression is all well and good but if it winds up feeling counter intuitive when you're whacking stuff in the head with an axe and they aren't dying, that takes precedence for me. I think TFP's design here was that it was as effective as the pickaxe on headshots, but better for body damage. That's the effect their numbers have, anyways. Maybe they figured the pointy end of the pick wouldn't be enough damage to the body vs. the broad slashing head of the axe, but they were both equally good at caving skulls in? I definitely approve of using a fireaxe as a weapon, that's a mean lookin' axe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlowerChild Posted January 11, 2015 Author Share Posted January 11, 2015 Just one thing about the fireaxe - it feels significantly worse against wood than the pickaxe is against stone. Except for those green drywall-like blocks, it seems to be faster to cut through a brick/concrete wall with the pick than a multi-stage wood block with the fireaxe.. Fair point. I'll take a look at the numbers when I have a chance, as I remember feeling like the fireaxe wasn't as effective as it should have been vs wood. I think TFP's design here was that it was as effective as the pickaxe on headshots, but better for body damage. That's the effect their numbers have, anyways. Maybe they figured the pointy end of the pick wouldn't be enough damage to the body vs. the broad slashing head of the axe, but they were both equally good at caving skulls in? Maybe. I think a decent argument could be made for the pickaxe perhaps being the best weapon of all for head shotting a zombie though given the stabbie stabbie to the brain action. I definitely approve of using a fireaxe as a weapon, that's a mean lookin' axe Yeah, I think that's always been the thing for me. If presented the choice, I think I'd naturally lean towards the axe as the most effective looking weapon of the bunch. I also really don't want to get into varying the damage multiplier for headshots and stuff the way the Pimps do, as I find that's going too far in the hidden stats department, and it makes evaluating the effectiveness of the individual weapons more confusing than it needs to be. I could see the sledgehammer potentially being a cool rapid demolition tool if I could modify the drops that blocks produce based on tool used, say for example allowing you to bust down barricades super quick but not getting any drops for it, but since that's not currently possible I think it may just be best to remove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kannbaba Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 @flowerchild i appreciate to see a list of skillbooks and their unlocked abilities. some notes (and confessions) to your mod: after being owned by dogs continously, we decided to add airdrops. yet after a while, we see how it screws up the game. no one cares for airdops anymore. we "still" cant live without spawn on bed all our team had a greed berserk when it comes to finding books. nights, deaths, hunger did not stop us from the need to find the next book. it's addictive. we understand why crossbow should be banned. all because running away (if you can) from feral dogs is fun. besides without a ranged weapon when you are hungry, hunting a deer has never been that fun! we HAD TO make a plan to hunt one deer. your mod has made 7DtD playable for hardcore players who are bored to death with the normal game. thnx! though we are on day 20+, have reinforced concrete towers all across cities, tons of corn breads and liters of bottled water. it's kinda end game and we are sad ( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kannbaba Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 some other quesitons: Urban Terrorist and Urban Guerrilla are seperate books? reading metal working did not enable gardening hoe? hmm.. can it be because i did not install the files but played from a unpatched computer and my skill sets are screwed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarudak Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 I believe you need the farming book for the hoe. Urban terrorist is seperate and all it gives you is TNT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlowerChild Posted January 14, 2015 Author Share Posted January 14, 2015 your mod has made 7DtD playable for hardcore players who are bored to death with the normal game. thnx! Glad you're enjoying it man though we are on day 20+, have reinforced concrete towers all across cities, tons of corn breads and liters of bottled water. it's kinda end game and we are sad ( Yeah, it's an unfortunate reality that there's only so much to the progression in 7 Days right now (not very much), and I've stretched it about as thin as I can while still being an enjoyable experience. It's bound to run out eventually, and really, the only thing I think can be done for that is to add more end-game content, which I feel is what 7 Days is missing the most. My feeling is that what's there at present is essentially all "early game", maybe with a bit of mid-game once you have a full set of iron tools (but that basically becomes end game because there's nowhere else to go from there). It's missing both a mid and late game to really make it shine, and it's unfortunately beyond the game's current modding capabilities for me to start adding in additional content of that nature. Urban Terrorist and Urban Guerrilla are seperate books? Yeah, like Sarudak mentioned, terrorist is just the TNT recipe, found as a rare book primarily in safes. reading metal working did not enable gardening hoe? It should. The farming book that Sarudak mentioned is only used to unlock the seed recipes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarudak Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 My latest game I'm on day 37 and still haven't found the forge book and I've actually found that to be really enjoyable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arisilde Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Having a little trouble getting the mod installed. I copied the files to what I think is the correct place, F:\SteamLibrary\SteamApps\common\7 Days to Die Dedicated Server\Data\Config but nothing seems to happen. Still have all the normal options in the crafting menu. Any idea what I'm doing wrong? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puschpa Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Having a little trouble getting the mod installed. I copied the files to what I think is the correct place, F:\SteamLibrary\SteamApps\common\7 Days to Die Dedicated Server\Data\Config but nothing seems to happen. Still have all the normal options in the crafting menu. Any idea what I'm doing wrong? Thanks. Do you want to run a server from your PC, or use the mod for you local Singleplayer Game? In this case it should be in ...\SteamApps\common\7 Days to Die\Data\Config Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arisilde Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 I actually don't have that folder. the only one i have is the server one. That's what I thought was strange. http://gyazo.com/662c930ac04707119a987fd553a78ccd I do run a server for me and my wife sometimes however. EDIT: Actually I found the other folder in my C drive, even though the game was supposed to be installed on the F drive. Very odd. Trying to install the mod now. Will check back in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arisilde Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Ok, that seemed to be the problem. Got it all working correctly. Damn this mod is hard One final question, what value do you put into the config file to make containers not respawn? I tried 0 but it makes them infinitely respawn every time you search them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlowerChild Posted January 17, 2015 Author Share Posted January 17, 2015 One final question, what value do you put into the config file to make containers not respawn? I tried 0 but it makes them infinitely respawn every time you search them. Not sure to tell you the truth, as I always set that option through the in-game menu. Someone else might be able to help you out there though, or, you could always try setting it through the menu then look at what config file setting that produces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arisilde Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Does that actually make permanent updates to the file? hmm, I'll try that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arisilde Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Seems the settings from the ingame menu get saved into an .sdf file in the save folder that's unreadable. It doesn't edit the file that self-hosted servers use. I tried modifying it directly via console, -1 seems to have worked. Will check back after i put some days in to see how it goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlowerChild Posted January 18, 2015 Author Share Posted January 18, 2015 Seems the settings from the ingame menu get saved into an .sdf file in the save folder that's unreadable. It doesn't edit the file that self-hosted servers use. I tried modifying it directly via console, -1 seems to have worked. Will check back after i put some days in to see how it goes. Fair enough. Was going to suggest -1 or an obscenely high value next as possible solutions Let me know how it goes as I'm sure this will come up again in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarudak Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Well I finally found the forge book. At the end of day 52 in the very last bookshelf of a large town. I think pre forge is definitely the most fun. Once I get the forge it feels like there's not much to work for (like you said before it's the pinnacle of current in game progress). Some feedback. It felt odd to me that pre-forge I could make ammo for all the guns except the shotgun which seems like it would be the simplest to make and the easiest to jury rig. I don't know if you're aware but farming does no require water. Even worse it doesn't require a hoe. The actual important crops (corn and potatoe) can be planted on grass and un-tilled dirt respectively. Seems like at least one of them should require the hoe to make sure you need the hoe for a steady supply of stew. Both games I've played I found an intact sniper rifle in the beginning. This game I got a sniper rifle before I even got a hunting rifle. I wonder if it wouldn't be better if the rare guns simply could not be found intact and you had to find the components to construct them. I think I would appreciate them more if I had to spend longer with the lower tier guns. Tool repair feels about right. I never ran out of pipe/strips but i definitely felt pressure. Eventually I discovered I could loot the broken houses pieces in wastelands and especially in burnt forests. All the old sinks were a big boon and allowed me to keep using my axe. I also found an augur which took some of the pressure off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethinolicbob Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Fair enough. Was going to suggest -1 or an obscenely high value next as possible solutions Let me know how it goes as I'm sure this will come up again in the future. I came across the same situation. I just mimicked what you did for the animal respawn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kannbaba Posted April 6, 2015 Share Posted April 6, 2015 time to reanimate this thread. A11 is up and i'm looking right into your face Flowerchild when is your impossibru mod is up for A11? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.