ElDudorino

I wonder if it's an issue of trying to handle the AI of too many zombies pathfinding their way through the building and making decisions as they go? Maybe they could work around that by making the AI the thing that 'pops in.' Basically, set each zombie a really basic circular path or whatever and then once the player reaches the trigger point they could start running more complex AI. I get the impression something like this happens in a lot of open world games where entities don't seem very dynamic until they are in some way targeting you or another NPC. The game is still great regardless but as it is I find wandering through city streets to be much more dynamic and interesting gameplay... but with worse loot and no trader rewards.

I advocated for roaming zombies in this very thread and it seems like you're conveniently ignoring that. Unfortunately there *aren't* roaming zombies in PoIs, unless you count the ones on the street who come to investigate the PoI after you go in. You have sleepers in obvious places, and then you have sleepers set up for jump scares. And I expect that most players would never know that the jump scare zombies technically don't know you're there, because intuitively when a zombie jumps out of a closet at you the moment you pass by you're going to assume it knows you're there and you're going to react accordingly. But also, like BarryTGash says, when everything is an ambush, nothing is an ambush. The jump scare/ambush/whatever you want to call them are cheapened because they're constant. You don't get a break from them in PoIs and it just feels sloppy and messy, like the devs knew they wanted to put in some scares so they just took the paintbrush and swiped it all over everything.

That's just semantics. Maybe there's a better word to use than "ambush" but clearly we all understand the phenomenon that's being discussed. The zombies don't fall from the ceiling unless you step into the zone that triggers them falling, so it's obviously designed in the same way an ambush is designed, but you can call it a triggered physics event or whatever. In many cases the ceiling section the zombies are in is completely closed off so the player has no way to get the drop on them and shoot them first. In the case of closet ambushes (or whatever word is appropriate), you can often get the drop on them by just smashing every closet door you come across in case someone is there, but it's honestly silly that it's so common you basically have to assume every closet door has something behind it. Also, those rooftop zombies who are hidden behind a closed vent that doesn't open and they suddenly break through the metal when you get close... what is that all about? How did you get there, zombie? We're throwing any semblance of logic or common sense out the window in order to have a jump scare that's honestly predictable after the first time but will be repeated on rooftop after rooftop.

I doubt you'll get a different result. Based on what you've already shared it's probably true that a zombie whose ambush has been triggered won't necessarily actually know where you are. The core issue is the same, though. Way too many zombies don't 'exist' until you trigger their spawn, or hide in ridiculous places to trigger a jump-scare so you have to be sure to trigger their ambush condition to clear them out. They will remain in the ambush position even if you shotgun blast somebody in the same room if you haven't stepped over their trigger, and if you expose them without triggering the ambush they can stare directly at you while you flash a light in their eyes and they won't react. That's just silly, and I think the insistence on having jump scares in every PoI (usually several) is weak.

Either is fine. What makes sense to me is kind of a combination of the two. It is, after all, the behavior I'd expect from the sleepers, instead of them staying dormant even when I shoot the wall next to them but getting up as soon as I cross an invisible line. For me, sleepers aren't necessary at all for a good stealth experience, though I think their existence is kind of cool and atmospheric. I'd be happy with a building full of zombies wandering around and I'd have to figure out their behavior or find a good hiding spot, or snipe them, to avoid notice. Maybe I peek in through a hole in the ceiling and pick a few off that way, get a few more through some open windows, etc.

My ideal would be like 10-20% sleeping in random but not sneaky spots, 77-87% moving around, and 3% hiding - in places a zombie (or someone soon to turn) could reach. This could include the occasional closet but not like all the closets. 0% hiding in unreachable ceiling tiles would be nice.

That sounds like two symptoms of the same problem, to be honest. If you don't trigger the "Drop from the ceiling" ambush you would never find those zombies. Running through making as much noise as possible seems to be the "correct" approach based on that. Here's one way to look at it: Are there any PoIs higher than tier 1 with *no* ambushes? Because the expectation is that ambushes would just be an occasional thing. But to be honest, I've been conditioned to expect a jump scare in every room now, so whether it's 11/12 spawns or not, I definitely feel like ambushes are extremely overdone.

Honestly, just run any Clear mission and the problem is glaringly obvious. Closets and ceiling zombies galore. Or ones that just pop in suddenly. Even if you don't trigger their attack, you still have to beat down the closet door, watch them stand there reactionless while you shine a light in their face, and then decapitate them. It might be a failed ambush but it's still an ambush. You know when you get the orange dots to indicate the last couple stragglers and one of them is just a floating dot when you reach it, but then the second you touch the dot suddenly 4 vultures dive bomb you out of nowhere? There's no way around triggering that if you're on a clear mission. And if you're not on a mission the ambush is still there, just not visible until you've triggered it. Questioning whether it's a good or bad decision is one thing but I don't see how you can question that the design exists.

I've had the same thought that I'd love to meet and hole up with other survivors even in singleplayer but the part I'm not so sure about is their survivability. Am I going to be able to keep an AI survivor alive? Probably not unless they're made immortal, which would be kind of unfair. Traitor Joel survives blood moons with absolutely pitiful defenses so maybe I'm just the one jerk the zombies swarm because the Duke is teaching me a lesson. I don't think a right-minded survivor would join up with me.

Not sure but I loaded my base up with torches and kept the forge running and started doing everything I could to raise the heat level starting maybe day 22 and finally saw my first screamer maybe day 30. In general my base just doesn't see any hot zombie action except during a blood moon.

You should hang out at the Bear Den. You drink for free if you fight the bears there! Ammo-wise, it surprises me that anybody runs through the game firing bullets at single enemies. I use a crossbow whenever I can, a club for when I have someone up close, and only switch to guns when it gets serious. I mean, in the zombie apocalypse would you really be trotting through the streets and buildings spending ammo on every weak shambler?

Yeah, this honestly is ridiculous. My approach to entering any fresh room in a PoI now is to run into the middle of the room and then run back out the way I came and kill whoever chases me, hoping that there isn't a collapsing floor trap. At first I was using quiet weapons but I switched to making as much noise as I want because the zombies don't attack until you trigger their spawn or wake condition anyway. I had planned to spec into stealth but that went out the window. It's especially ridiculous when the zombies wake and drop down from a ceiling that's completely inaccessible. Who put them there??