34 minutes ago, meilodasreh said:When somebody says he wants to fetch water from a lake and doesn't like that this is gone,
just tell him: YES! In that aspect, that decision totally sucks! Basic survival logic was taken away from a game that claims to (also) be a survival game.
But it was for the good of other aspects that profit from that desicion. And yes it works smooth overall, despite the "stupidity" that...and many other things too if you think carefully.
This is a good point. The debate over immersion and realism relating to empty jars and/or getting water from lakes and similar sources isn't ever going to go anywhere because 1) It isn't realistic, and 2) It doesn't make sense (unless you focus only on whether or not it makes water more difficult). It is a change that is going to feel stupid to players. There's no way around that and no explaining how it is better just because all containers are now gone or that water is more difficult. That doesn't solve the core problem of it feeling stupid to players.
I am happy to have empty jars gone. And I have no interest in water from lakes and stuff. I'm also not at all interested in dew collectors; I think they are dumb and a poor choice for gathering water. Yet I still feel that preventing gathering water from a water source is stupid regardless of gameplay. The only way to fix that is to make that water deadly to drink and impossible to purify. This would require that you make it deadly to swim in as well for it to make sense, of course. You can't fix it by talking about making water more difficult or making all containers gone even if you want them gone like I do.
So, in short, there's no reason to get into these debates beyond simply saying something like you suggest - "Yes, it's stupid. Yes, it isn't immersive. But they don't want the jars and they don't want water to be so easy to get from water sources, so it's what we have." Then, just leave it at that. No one is going to change anyone's opinions, so debating isn't going to ever get anywhere. Besides, I don't think anyone who is on the side of being glad jars are gone and water is less easy to access doesn't agree that it really doesn't make any sense even if they like the change. 