R0bb0b Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Just my opinion of changes that would allow for more freedom and bring this game back from kill 700 zombies to craft a forge and 1400 to craft a bicycle and 17,000 to craft steel playstyle. 1. Further divide the skill tree into more categories, but rather than intellect/strength etc.. use mining, construction, crafting, looting, science/electronics, running etc... 2. Go back to learning by doing but divide the experience amongst the skill tree in accordance to the current activity. Some activities may be divided into multiple categories like crafting electronics. 3. Go back to some key books laying around. It feels so strange to have no incentive to looting outside of finding weapons that I already have and cheesing sleeping zombies for experience so that I can learn to craft a chem station. 4. Distribute gated materials amongst some of the more difficult dungeon crawls. Doesn't have to be a lot but provide a little more incentive and lessen the impact of level gate. I know that the biggest gripe against learning while doing is spam crafting but that problem was solved in A16.4. Look, this game is the way it is. You can't make zombie killing in this game more interesting by forcing players to double down on it. This game should be about the freedom that it has always represented in my point of view. Just an opinion of a player who wants to continue liking your game in the way that he chooses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColdGate Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 A17 is dead. Keep calm and wait for A18. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostlight Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 I believe TFP have already said a definite no to (1) to (3). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R0bb0b Posted December 11, 2018 Author Share Posted December 11, 2018 I believe TFP have already said a definite no to (1) to (3). That's a bummer. 7DTD has lost its identity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja_Freak Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 I agree with R0bb0b. I actually dropped by the forum looking for understanding on how the new skill classes work and why I can't improve skills by "doing". A very simple post has confirmed what I already knew. I have to say that I honestly don't like it nor do I understand why the FP would change this aspect of the game? Now I need to kill to level up so I can then buy the skills I used to be able to learn. Instead of reading a book, I have to keep space in my backpack for schematics... The game is a grind as it is, why make it more difficult? It will take me days to dig out the footings for a base let alone construct it. I just don't get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feycat Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 A17 doesn't need to be "salvaged." In all ways that matter, it's a step up from A16, except for the bugs and balancing issues that will hopefully be fixed. Also, you do get xp from "doing." Not nearly as much as you used to - but in A16, the way you leveled up to buy skills to upgrade your rifle shooting and headshooting was mining. Now it's zombies. Nothing has changed with that except that you can't just ignore the zombies anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R0bb0b Posted December 11, 2018 Author Share Posted December 11, 2018 A17 doesn't need to be "salvaged." In all ways that matter, it's a step up from A16, except for the bugs and balancing issues that will hopefully be fixed. Also, you do get xp from "doing." Not nearly as much as you used to - but in A16, the way you leveled up to buy skills to upgrade your rifle shooting and headshooting was mining. Now it's zombies. Nothing has changed with that except that you can't just ignore the zombies anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spider Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 ROFL ....so true I agree with the OP and it is losing its identity for shore. TFP are choosing to lead with their lest impressive features and simplifying or removing their most unique game defining ones. When 7D2D competes with nearly any "zombie killing game" it loses plain and simple. Killing zombies is by far their worst performing game mechanic and now its their lead feature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feycat Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Ironic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckyStar Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Classic! Now I have to go watch that movie again. Still great after all these years! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowMoses1324 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 I wrote a huge post a few weeks back regarding most of this. I love a lot of alpha 17, but truthfully, I hate how the leveling system is now. Best I can say, and I know it doesn't help much, hold out hope that they either have plans to refine this dog turd of a leveling system, or they listen to the people that pay their bills and change it back. I keep seeing posts and videos about how they want to focus on immersion.. there aren't any skill points in life, and you only learn to do things by doing them. Spam crafting made sense, mining to level your mining, made sense. Having the ability to shoot something in the head and crit for high damage right out of the gate, made sense. Whatever they did, does not. It's stupid and no longer feels like the game I loved and put over a thousand hours of my time into. Not mentioning the 10+ copies of the game I bought for friends over the years. This build, while being fair, which is not full released, is a slap in the face. Especially after a year of waiting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ld-airgrafix Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 I dont play 7d2d anymore mainly because of their scripted difficulty, throwing unnecessary AI your way just so you die, then punishing that death behind timed skill reduction. 7d2d was never realistic or a simulation, but i liked having options. You could progress without killing a single zombie. The fact i have to go hunting zombies so i can unlock a cooking receipe, is not something i expected when i first bought 7d2d, that was 2000 something playing hours ago. Its completely understandable for players to be upset about current changes. I can see this game changing many more times before developers settle for a finished product, i just hope they arent as terrible as A17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopheles Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 The game is a grind as it is, why make it more difficult? It will take me days to dig out the footings for a base let alone construct it. I just don't get it. And they just made the grind 27% longer by reducing zombie XP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCrook1028 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 And they just made the grind 27% longer by reducing zombie XP. ....and A17 is still not released..... and Devs have already stated balancing for other xp is ongoing....... less time moaning and more time listening may help you follow what's actually happening....like miner 69 doesn't do what you said either........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InSanity Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 And they just made the grind 27% longer by reducing zombie XP. Everyone complained about the only way to level being killing zombies so when they nerf the xp zombies give and increase passive xp for all the other aspects of the game so that other playstyles besides the warrior can still reasonably progress you complain about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostlight Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 A17 doesn't need to be "salvaged." In all ways that matter, it's a step up from A16, except for the bugs and balancing issues that will hopefully be fixed. . So the fact that the perk system gives the player every item in the game and thus there is no need whatsoever to loot or explore after the first couple of weeks, plus the fact that the game's replayability has been destroyed because of that same system (gives same stuff, same level, every play-through) are simply bugs or balancing? I see. That'll be easy to fix then, phew! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sellsents Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 A17 doesn't need to be "salvaged." In all ways that matter, it's a step up from A16, except for the bugs and balancing issues that will hopefully be fixed. Also, you do get xp from "doing." Not nearly as much as you used to - but in A16, the way you leveled up to buy skills to upgrade your rifle shooting and headshooting was mining. Now it's zombies. Nothing has changed with that except that you can't just ignore the zombies anymore. In my opinion Alpha 17 is everything but a step up from A16. The game is loosing its focus. Some new nice looking textures alone does not make a good game and zombie grinding all day long to unlock perks isn´t an improvment at all to previous Alphas. I ask myself if TFP even knows what people like and don´t like about their game? And I don´t mean the couple of people hanging around in this board but in generall. I really don´t think so. Otherwise they would not try to force 7dtd to become a tower defense shooter after beeing something completly else for years. Like I said many times now in the last couple days. There will be people who like the new changes and there will others who does not. Happens every new alpha, totally normal. But this time the dig is deeper then before and this concerns me a lot. Because this game has brought gamers together over the years, no matter their prefered playstyle. Now the opposite happens. And this aint good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiana Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 I think this game is losing most of its playbase and focus with a17. The devs seem to try to turn it from a survival, crafting, basel-buidling game into a shooter, but they are forgetting some things: 1.) As a survival, crafting, base-building game with a voxel based tower defense, it was quite unique. 2.) But as a shooter, its quite.....bad. There are many other games, that do those things better, and with better graphics, or even mechanics tfp scrapped. (Destiny2 for example has a 0-600 quality system...) 3.) And they do forget, that shooters have other selling points, that most probably 7d2d will never have, as they are either: a.) pvp-games, which mean: a working, and fun PVP-Mode(or battle royale) and good graphics while maintaining high fps in the 90+ range on decent graphics-cards (1080 and up), even in near 4k (3440x1440 (ultrawide)) b.) single player shooters, which means: a good story line, rendered in-between-level sequences, meaningful leveldesign for the stage levels, even if the rest is open world, and good graphics while maintaining high fps in the 90+ range on decent graphics-cards (1080 and up), even in near 4k (3440x1440 (ultrawide)). Single player shooters are mostly played for the story and the render-sequences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr.devolver Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 That's a bummer. 7DTD has lost its identity. We've seen changing or even losing identity of things or even people so often nowadays, one would think you all have gotten used to that by now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalarro Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 The devs seem to try to turn it from a survival, crafting, basel-buidling game into a shooter, but they are forgetting some things: 1.) As a survival, crafting, base-building game with a voxel based tower defense, it was quite unique. 2.) But as a shooter, its quite.....bad. There are many other games, that do those things better, and with better graphics, or even mechanics tfp scrapped. (Destiny2 for example has a 0-600 quality system...) Exactly my thoughts. OFC, it's not that it suddenly became a bad game. It's the best survival game out there. It's just that focusing a patch so much on combat and even making building less desirable is a step in the wrong direction. OFC the new POis are better. OFC the combat is better now. But, I have other games with better combat and dungeons. But no other game with such good defense building. Why do they want us to spend so much time killing zombies. And I dont want to ONLY build. For example I also dont like the removal of recipes. That made me want to find more and more towns and buildings to explore them and unlock recipes. Now its just killing zombies for xp to unlock them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr.devolver Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Alpha 17 Experimental B221 is out Grind is dead long live the grind Changed Reduced zombie kill XP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piesy001 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 My issue was I used to spend hours underground with bases or mining or building stuff and joining. That has gone now. Are they trying to fix the frames or something by removing different resources like gravel and colours of resources underground. Also strange decisions like removing little things like different lights have been removed. They are changing it from a freedom to do what you want to getting you to play how they want. I can only guess removing all the freedom is due to limitations on the consoles. As you bring new things in, older other things have to go out.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalarro Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Reduced zombie kill XP What do you mean quoting that change? That you like it, that you dont? It's no surprise, it was asked for, and they told us they were going to make it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spider Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Alpha 17 Experimental B221 is out Grind is dead long live the grind Changed Reduced zombie kill XP This doesn't fix anything. Even if they nerfed zombie xp to 1xp per kill it would still be the best way to level. Why? Because its the only infinite xp sources that takes the lest work to get(it will come to you) and you can still kill zombies and learn to build a Jeep from it. This solves nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostlight Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 I think this game is losing most of its playbase and focus with a17. The devs seem to try to turn it from a survival, crafting, basel-buidling game into a shooter, but they are forgetting some things: 1.) As a survival, crafting, base-building game with a voxel based tower defense, it was quite unique. 2.) But as a shooter, its quite.....bad. On the other hand, the direction A17 is going means that A18 is ripe for adding loot-boxes or some sort of in-game micro-transaction that the players can waste their (real) money on. So, $2.99 for a "Forge Pack" that gives the player a Forge on day 1. - - - Updated - - - What do you mean quoting that change? That you like it, that you dont? It's no surprise, it was asked for, and they told us they were going to make it. No. What was asked for was that zombie XP be reduced and all other XP sources buffed, so the player was not impelled to kill zombies over all other activities. They only did the first part. This is probably a reaction to the complaint that the player is OP at level 100 (~day 30) and has everything there is to have. Instead of fixing that properly, they have made it take longer to get to level 100. Ahahahahahahahahah. Typical half-assed fixed that shows no understanding in the core playerbase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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