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I solved the underground base exploit!!!!


Vomkat

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who cares what xml tweaks the OP uses?

 

Wait, so are you saying the thread shouldn't have been made in the first place?

Or that calling something an exploit is not clear trolling and the OP should be censured?

Or that acting as though you've solved an exploit doesn't imply that the dev's should change the game in such a manner to satisfy your control issues?

 

Just wondering.

 

But if you're saying the thread should never have been started and should be deleted, you're absolutely right.

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How you can call a day one on-demand "god mode" a realistic survival strategy in a game which is, among others, tagged as survival, takes the cake when it comes to thinking processes.

 

He is obviously talking about the fact that underground would be a good idea if this really happens. (considering you are alone, with more than a few people the idea might not be so good anymre) All Z´s we know from different movies, series or games wouldn´t bother you underground. At least i can´t recall any digging zombie so far.

 

You can have a stone axe and a stone shovel in the first 2 minutes and you have enough time until evening to dig a safe hole even with a short day setting. Even the bottom of the dirt layer can provide safety and you certainly have time to dig several stone blocks as well with the axe. Why would you use fists for anything else other than getting fibers and a couple of branches on the ground to build that stone axe?

 

Starting supplies can easily get you through the first day and beyond that, even if you scavenge with minimum loot settings and most importantly hunt, hunger is not an issue. Since there is no food spoilage, after a while you can be set with enough supplies to last for a "lifetime". At any point during that time, including day 1, your nights are spent safely in the hole, you do have to go out scavenge and hunt a bit, but any time you feel threatened you can return to your hole and be perfectly safe.

 

Am I missing something here?

 

It looks like if we want real survival we gotta play the long dark or other games. According to Roland it doesn´t look like we will ever really be in danger of starving to death or dying from dehydration. (Isn´t there a word for dying due to having no water? Or for starving to death? German nativespeaker here, we have one for both)

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He is obviously talking about the fact that underground would be a good idea if this really happens. (considering you are alone, with more than a few people the idea might not be so good anymre) All Z´s we know from different movies, series or games wouldn´t bother you underground. At least i can´t recall any digging zombie so far.

 

Yes, (I realize I don't have to tell you that because you understand the point, but just saying in general) zombies can't also break through everything. But a game needs some "suspension of belief" or else it won't be a game anymore. For example there wouldn't be any viable building if the player was able to carry realistic amounts of materials, there wouldn't be any crafting (or it would be absolutely boring and complicated), if tools took a realistic amount of time, effort and resources to be crafted. RPG elements would take an eternity to be utilized and so on.

 

In movies, considering there's a traditional zombie apocalypse you could be indefinitely safe behind a metal door or a one and a half meter high construction of sorts, but since the plot in a movie has to move on because it would be terribly boring, they always run out of food/need medicine at that point, find a hidden ninja zombie horde at the place where they are at, or realize too late that the person with them was secretly bitten and has turned in his sleep etc.

 

So in a game we need mechanisms to actually enable some kind of gameplay. Zombies are always a threat on the surface (well, that's also relevant since there needs to be some tuning for the "end-game", instead of them continuing to add special monsters imo) but the underground lacks those, except for the sandbox part of the game.

 

It looks like if we want real survival we gotta play the long dark or other games. According to Roland it doesn´t look like we will ever really be in danger of starving to death or dying from dehydration. (Isn´t there a word for dying due to having no water? Or for starving to death? German nativespeaker here, we have one for both)

 

I think it's "emaciated" for hunger since I've seen it used only for corpses, but I may be wrong. I don't think there's one for dehydration. I do still have hopes, that they will at some point tune the game that way or introduce spoilage, even if I don't recall any desire from them to do so.

 

 

Nice honeypot, OP.

 

ROFL

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Starting supplies can easily get you through the first day and beyond that, even if you scavenge with minimum loot settings and most importantly hunt, hunger is not an issue. Since there is no food spoilage, after a while you can be set with enough supplies to last for a "lifetime". At any point during that time, including day 1, your nights are spent safely in the hole, you do have to go out scavenge and hunt a bit, but any time you feel threatened you can return to your hole and be perfectly safe.

 

Am I missing something here?

 

I think the thing that you're missing is that "go out and scavenge/loot/hunt during the day, and retreat to safety at night (except for horde nights)" is a perfectly valid and enjoyable playstyle for many.

 

It's certainly the playstyle I prefer and the playstyle that all the people I play with prefer. It has verisimilitude in that it feels like what you should be doing during a zombie apocalypse (especially if the zombies are more active and more dangerous at night), and it matches the rhythm of the game.

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I think the thing that you're missing is that "go out and scavenge/loot/hunt during the day, and retreat to safety at night (except for horde nights)" is a perfectly valid and enjoyable playstyle for many.

 

It's certainly the playstyle I prefer and the playstyle that all the people I play with prefer. It has verisimilitude in that it feels like what you should be doing during a zombie apocalypse (especially if the zombies are more active and more dangerous at night), and it matches the rhythm of the game.

 

First of all, sorry for the long post. I am actually rooting for a similar kind of playstyle, when it comes to suggesting any kind of underground threats, because I like living underground as well. Most of my suggestions are along the lines of "make it harder to maintain/add more reasons to scavenge/add a hazard that can passively, up to a point, be countered". Give the player a well-weighted choice, between playstyles. Each with its different pros and cons.

 

Because the main principles of a survival game (like this one, among other genres), is for the player to overcome adversity in order to survive. Without a well-weighted choice, the player who has bought a survival game (among other genres yes, yes), will look for the optimal way to survive. Most people who bought the game, after my recomendation, actually refunded it for that reason.

 

If the player has to create adversity himself in order to survive (by effectively limiting himself to half the game's worldspace, which is tragic by itself), it can't possibly be considered a survival game.

It's like buying a generic RPG (in which you fight enemies at your leisure) and saying it is survival by pretending you died of hunger/thirst after an arbitary alarm-clock timer runs out. It amazes me every time I see a "then just don't dig" reply because not only do I consider it completely ridiculous, but insensitive/"douchey" as well, since it's like suggesting the other person to ignore the fact that the game is voxelized. A game with "survival at your leisure/on demand" is definitely not survival.

 

In other simpler words, the underground is a no-brainer for someone who *wants to survive* at the moment. What some people are doing is to ask the player to use his willpower, to stop seeking survival by ignoring parts of the game, in order to enjoy seeking survival, which is the point of someone who has bought a survival game. That's how non-sensical that is.

 

 

 

I do understand the concept of this "valid playstyle" you describe as I mentioned in the first paragraph. But it's far from valid in its current state. It WOULD be valid, if the game was tagged as an RPG or sandbox, but it is also tagged as a tower-defense/survival, which as explained above cannot be on demand because their very concept is negated by that. So if you want to call the playstyle "valid", you subsequently admit or claim that the game is being falsely advertised.

 

And let's not kid outselves, the underground being a safe-space any time you require, with horde nights not being an exception (why would they? I really hope you don't tell me because a player might choose so) is "god mode on demand" even if it is or may be a valid playstyle. Having to scavenge only adds the "on demand" part, because there would be no demand for a safe space if you never had to walk away from it. So how was what I said invalid?

 

In fact, without food spoilage or any kind of maintenance, this is not even the case after 1-2 weeks in the game. Resources are easily stockpiled with minimal loot settings and just like that you are set for the rest of the game.

 

Personally I am all for options, since I don't care much about the game's success anymore, I just want to play a good survival/rpg etc game.

 

 

 

No ..The thread should be :- I solved the underground base exploit!!!! FOR MYSELF....Total stupid idea..

Just let everyone play as they want to...there money..there game

 

I guess me telling you that him saying that, would be redundant, is also redudant considering the content of your post.

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I solved the underground problem a long time ago. I stopped digging myself security holes (somewhere around the time I showed a picture set with me crouched in a 3 deep hole with a wood stick killing off a horde as they walked over my head).

 

I still avoid the hordes like any survivor in a real apocalypse would, by using my mind to construct my bases, their entrances, and my traps (where/when necessary) to distract, deflect, and misdirect.

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I solved the underground problem a long time ago. I stopped digging myself security holes (somewhere around the time I showed a picture set with me crouched in a 3 deep hole with a wood stick killing off a horde as they walked over my head).

 

I still avoid the hordes like any survivor in a real apocalypse would, by using my mind to construct my bases, their entrances, and my traps (where/when necessary) to distract, deflect, and misdirect.

 

I also pretended that baldur's gate had survival elements when I was young, thirst/hunger/sleep and all, having manual timers for each. Truth is that now I feel more entitled and expect "a survival, voxel, rpg, TD, blah blah game" to be everything it says in the description, without one element negating the other and without having to pretend they are.

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I agree, construction and crafting is also in need of a major nerf. Players should live in the pre-existing buildings, and not be constructing their own fortresses.

 

In your game/server you can live in the pre-existing buildings, or don't dig... Don't be another annoying person that talks "the game is broken, ppl can dig"

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I dunno, I personally find it pretty immersion breaking as it is that zombies can punch thru concrete and steel walls as it is. I know its part of the game but I mean, I just think they would end up destroying their own arms long before they do any noticable damage to those walls.

 

I wish the polished steal was unbreakable, but make it a late game item and very, very rare.

 

I don't know about anyone else, but eventually (sometime after day 150) horde night is just a painful drudgery.

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I wish the polished steal was unbreakable, but make it a late game item and very, very rare.

 

I don't know about anyone else, but eventually (sometime after day 150) horde night is just a painful drudgery.

 

Help me understand something because I don't get the long long term game scenario. What is it you are accomplishing at day 150? What is there left to do other than survive each bloodmoon horde and build back up for the next one? Don't you have everything and can kill everything and can craft everything and have explored everything by Day 150? Isn't starting over and trying new character builds more interesting? I've tried to do the long term game and once I'm at the top it gets boring and monotonous. I like the ascension so I keep doing that part. What keeps you interested once you're way up there?

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Help me understand something because I don't get the long long term game scenario. What is it you are accomplishing at day 150? What is there left to do other than survive each bloodmoon horde and build back up for the next one? Don't you have everything and can kill everything and can craft everything and have explored everything by Day 150? Isn't starting over and trying new character builds more interesting? I've tried to do the long term game and once I'm at the top it gets boring and monotonous. I like the ascension so I keep doing that part. What keeps you interested once you're way up there?

 

This is why I wish hordes got harder and harder with no cap. Then you eventually die, then start over and try to beat your previous record.

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Help me understand something because I don't get the long long term game scenario. What is it you are accomplishing at day 150? What is there left to do other than survive each bloodmoon horde and build back up for the next one? Don't you have everything and can kill everything and can craft everything and have explored everything by Day 150? Isn't starting over and trying new character builds more interesting? I've tried to do the long term game and once I'm at the top it gets boring and monotonous. I like the ascension so I keep doing that part. What keeps you interested once you're way up there?

 

Base building I imagine. I know my wife likes to "rebuild" the neighborhood.

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Help me understand something because I don't get the long long term game scenario. What is it you are accomplishing at day 150? What is there left to do other than survive each bloodmoon horde and build back up for the next one? Don't you have everything and can kill everything and can craft everything and have explored everything by Day 150? Isn't starting over and trying new character builds more interesting? I've tried to do the long term game and once I'm at the top it gets boring and monotonous. I like the ascension so I keep doing that part. What keeps you interested once you're way up there?

 

It´s building. At least for me. I have usually more than one savegame that i play at the same time. One or two for building and at least one "normal" save.

 

You can´t build a skyscraper in 100 days. Or renovate a whole town. Didn´t MM say he wants this to be a minecraft with zombies? Just wondering that you are surprised that people play this for building.

 

That´s why i need a spawnrate menu. Having to fight for you live is nice and all, until you get to a point where you wanna start your building project with a 100x100 3 story basement and like 5 upper floors. Ofc looking good and beeing horde proof. Can´t have them Z´s disturbing me all the time when going big.

 

There is a lot of people out there hoping for way more building and decoration options. Seeing the plans for the release i doubt that this is coming sadly.

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Vomkat, to answer your question from the first post, you can remove all of the 'radiated' zombies from the spawning xml file. You will have to remove them from groups. I think the spawning xml points to groups, so yeah, find the individual zeds in groups spawning xml. Do an alt-F for 'radiated'.

 

Yah, I'm just not sure of the specifics, one wrong error and I mess it all up. I wish the developers would just add a 'realism' button, like the opposite of creative mode. Zombies are a thing, but they don't glow, resources don't magically respawn, crops take a long time to grow, and you can't dig out an underground industrial zone using a stone axe.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

How you can call a day one on-demand "god mode" a realistic survival strategy in a game which is, among others, tagged as survival, takes the cake when it comes to thinking processes.

 

lol, these people get so upset. the guy with the chunnel post really blew my mind, it appears they actually think its realistic to dig down and create a giant subterranean factory. the walking dead should have an episode about mole people who dig into the dirt and pretend that salvation is waiting below.

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You play on creative mode, obviously. Otherwise you dig down and starve while taking hours to get a couple meters because you don't have resources to use anything but fists and constantly wait for stamina to refresh. But sure, let's pretend that there is such a thing as day one on-demand "god mode" just so you feel validated.

 

As a person complaining about underground bases being an exploit, as a person who knows tell how to dig straight down on day 1, let me clarify that it is NOT difficult or challenging.

 

During the first day you gather wood, clay, and stone. Only the wood is actually important, as you will want to use wood frames to magically jump upward at dawn, and you'll need to magically create some axes. Then you create a hole, surrounded by some spikes (more for roleplaying purposes, than any practical purpose). During the night you get about 12-15 blocks down. If you hear zombies you just get quiet. If they hear you, then you throw up some wood frames in the shaft. Even if they get in, they can't get to you, and with a bow you can easily dispatch them. At dawn, you emerge to find a deer to shoot, or maybe a can of pasta. Congratulations, you have passed the most difficult phase of the game.

 

You spend most of the next day chopping down wood for more spikes and wood frames, just in case (not because you need them). Or you get clay for cobblestone walls, just in case (not because you need them). You keep an eye out for toilets with pipes, and animals with hides. You train the most important skill: Miner 69er! Before long you have a forge, and iron bars. You find a wrench, or trade the metal for one at a trader. You make a concrete mixer. You make piles of cement. You magically run with tons of cement to the trader. You buy whatever you want, just like you are playing creative mode.

 

You literally never need to fight a zombie or even see one ever again. You have won the game! You can live at the bottom of the world and eat mushrooms, or you can build a thick wall and grow crops. Every now and again, you might hear a dog or a screamer, that's about the only difficulty you will have.

 

The underground mechanic is broken, and is amplified when combined with the broken trader and crafting mechanics.

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As a person complaining about underground bases being an exploit, as a person who knows tell how to dig straight down on day 1, let me clarify that it is NOT difficult or challenging.

 

During the first day you gather wood, clay, and stone. Then you create a hole, surrounded by some spikes (more for roleplaying purposes, than any practical purpose). During the night you get about 12-15 blocks down, then you emerge and shoot a deer or grab a can of pasta. If you hear zombies you just get quiet. If they hear you, then you throw up some wood frames in the shaft. Even if they get in, they can't get to you, and with a bow you can easily dispatch them.

 

You spend most of the next day chopping down wood for more spikes, just in case (not because you need them). Or you get clay for cobblestone walls, just in case (not because you need them). You keep an eye out for toilets with pipes, and animals with hides. Before long you have a forge, and iron bars. You find a wrench, or trade the metal for one at a trader. You make a concrete mixer. You make piles of cement. You magically carry tons of cement to the trader. You buy whatever you want, just like you are playing creative mode. You literally never need to fight a zombies, or even see one ever again. You can live at the bottom of the world and eat mushrooms, or you can build a thick wall and grow crops inside it. The underground mechanic is broken, and is amplified when combined with the broken trader and crafting mechanics.

 

btw you need to get rid of woodspikes. 4 rows around a base (no matter if wood or steel base) kill screamers before they call in a horde. EXPLOIT!!

 

And you can stand on a 2x2 tower with 2 rows of iron bars around, above 4 rows of spikes and just shoot down without ever getting in danger to be hurt by a zombie in a horde night. No more iron bars!!!!11elf!!11

 

And ofc let´s not forget the minibike. Wich allows you to avoid the horde completly. What a shame. We need to get rid of the minibike too.

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underground would be a good idea if this really happens. )

 

Anyone who thinks this way needs to go to the hardware store, buy a pick and a shovel, and go start digging a hole. Afterward, seriously think about whether this would be an effective way to defend against zombies. If you are still unsure, note that the hole really isn't deep enough, and keep digging. About this time you should either be hitting bedrock or the water table. Remember, you gotta keep digging!!

 

Good luck, and watch out for methane pockets!

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Ever heard of basements? And Z´s are dumb. No need to dig really deep. If you don´t have an obvious entrance they will not come for you. Ofc you don´t dig as fast in RL as in the game.

 

Who want´s to play a game where digging out a hole for a small base or just for having a save storage place actually takes a week of playtime? No one.

 

Talking of time: Do you have any idea how long it takes you to chop the wood, cut it in the right size and building a cabin with it? Not knowing anything about building or wood chopping. Especially with a stone axe. There is no way you would achieve that in time for the horde. Never. So pls stop comparing to RL when your idea of playing has nothing to do with RL either.

 

You wouldn´t even be able to build a stone axe in RL.

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Ever heard of basements? And Z´s are dumb. No need to dig really deep.

 

You don't understand the full exploit. You aren't digging to get away from zombies. You are digging to get rocks, for concrete, which you can turn into rocket launchers and automated machine-guns (none of which you will ever need).

 

You wouldn´t even be able to build a stone axe in RL.

 

Exactly, that's why in a zombie apocalypse survival game you shouldn't be able to smelt iron and build a steel skyscraper. At the very least, you should have to wait more than a few days before you begin construction.

 

Who want´s to play a game where having a save storage place actually takes a week of playtime?

 

I do! Who wants to play a game with no challenge?

 

Do you have any idea how long it takes you to chop the wood, cut it in the right size and building a cabin with it?

 

Which is why the developers need to add a 'realism' option which forces the player to live above ground, surviving within existing buildings and struggling to develop stone age technology. An effective stone axe should be like pro-level endgame technology.

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If you wanna dig for days and only getting out a tiny bit by it you got the wrong game. Not going to happen.

 

And again, all the goodies found underground are on the surface. Tons of it. And with a bit of caution you can also get them with a very low chance of having to fight.

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