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A17 How Long Would You Wait For A Pre-Generated Map to Build?


SylenThunder

A17 How Long Would You Wait For A Pre-Generated Map to Build?  

216 members have voted

  1. 1. A17 How Long Would You Wait For A Pre-Generated Map to Build?

    • 8k x 8k 5-10 minutes
      27
    • 10k x 10k 8-16 minutes
      26
    • 12k x 12k 12-23 minutes
      28
    • 16k x 16k 20-40 minutes
      12
    • 17.73k x 17.73k 25-50 minutes
      2
    • 20k x 20k 32-63 minutes
      28
    • I don't care if it takes all day.
      93


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I'm not sure now is the right time to debate servers and multiplayer too seriously.

 

Discussions about it are good and provide inspiration but... we're just playing around here aren't we?

 

MM has mentioned that the very last they TFP will work on is multiplayer because it's such a huge project it will take the whole team.

We have no idea what that's going to look like.

 

Furthermore, before the game is "finished" there's a final sweep for efficiency.

We may very well see a smooth and speedy 7DTD that supports 12 people per server.

[i'm not saying that's likely but... it's definitely got a ...very slim... chance.]

 

 

~Lucky

Working-Castle-Tribute-to-A16-Plus-bonus-tips-video

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Hook players on what premise? It's never been intended to have 20-50 people playing on a server. Ever.

 

It has never been intended in Ark that flyers are the only way of transport, yet it happened.

 

Just imagine if they hard-capped servers to 8 players. What would you do then?

 

Mod it out and create a bad steam review (Ark temporarily fell down to 30%)

 

The point of the matter is that everyone hosting a server with over the supported player count is violating the feature of the game. (Guilty as charge too, because I set mine to 10 players.)

 

So just because we MIGHT experience a bug (personally never had a problem with 50 player+ servers) we should not be allowed to play that way? Why not simply create a warning "Warning: You exceed the max amount of players/mapsize. If you continue, the game might get buggy."

 

The backlash would only come from people who have no understanding of what the game is meant to be, and are trying to make it like all the other games they play. This isn't CoD, Battlefield, or Rust.

 

Players have their own minds. You cannot tell them how to play the game. If you want your game to be a certain way, but it has istablished its own rules on its own, then you can make "your way" the standart option and the "other way" a secondary option.

 

If you really think playing 7d2d on a big map with a lot of players makes it a "COD, rust whatever" clone... then you are blind.

7d2d is a great game. And I personally dont even interact with other players most of the time. I simply like the threat (and the possibility) of coming across others. I wanna show ppl my builds. I wanna be scared when looting a city because I dont know if I might get shot in the head...

 

How can you say that, because I like to play 7d2d like that, that I "dont understand how its meant to play".

Do you think Skyrim shopkeepers were meant to be blind when they had a bucket on their heads?

Do you think ANY gamedev writes on the cover: "PLAY IT THIS WAY OR YOU ARE JUST A COD FANBOY!"

 

No obviously not. Because that is not what a game is. Everyone plays it differently.

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Yes, well those types of servers are vastly exceeding what the game is designed for.

 

The game was originally single-player. Now it is multiplayer supporting 8-player co-op.

 

To do anything else is not supported or recommended.

 

Let's be honest. A lot of people play SP but the MP is what keeps servers and communities alive.

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Why on earth is the RWG in A17 that effin small? Is this offical? Or do i get that image in the first post wrong?

 

How about to let the player deceide how big they want it and how long they are willing to wait for, instead of just making it incredibly small?

 

Willing to wait for longer instead of having to play on small maps.

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Why on earth is the RWG in A17 that effin small? Is this offical? Or do i get that image in the first post wrong?

 

How about to let the player deceide how big they want it and how long they are willing to wait for, instead of just making it incredibly small?

 

Willing to wait for longer instead of having to play on small maps.

 

You just don't know how the game is supposed to be played! And if they say the map is only 10x10 blocks battle royal, if you complain then you are a COD fanboy!

(sorry I wouldnt be so salty if that wasn't coming from a community manager...)

 

to give something of worth:

yeah... player descicion is always a good thing.

Especially since in multiplayer only the host has to wait. And I dont CARE if the host waits 20 hours... as long as the map is huge I'm in. But for singleplayer I dont want to wait more then 1-2 minutes. And I dont need that big of a map... 2x2 km would probably be enough in singleplayer... BUT since a lot of us actually play multiplayer (because nearly everyone goes into multiplayer if they have the option... because playing all alone vs interacting with others (pve) nearly everyone would prefer to be with others on a server.) having an option is really a must...

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OR we could play on small maps while we wait for them to make them larger....

 

Thats the big question though, is this temporary ?

 

We all know not to panic over every little change in alpha but i cant seem to find any info if this is indeed temporary. Ofc im " assumeing " its for testing as a smaller area is easier to keep track of than a larger area. I also realize the devs dont need to tell us anything unless they see fit so i'll wait and not panic just yet.

 

I will say a few reassuring words would be nice though : ) But no matter the outcome the community will mod the game to whats desireable to its many different needs and play styles. I cant imagine all the devs want 8x8 maps to be the only option so we'll just have to wait to see what tye come up with as a final-ish solution.

 

As long as the dev team knows ppl are willing to wait and still request large if not massive maps then im happy to get that message across and see if it fits in with the devs direction and vision for this game upon release.

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Instead of temporary let’s call it baseline. They are going to start from a size that they can support and then go from there. If they can support a larger size after optimizations they will do that and the current size will turn out to have been temporary.

 

They have repeatedly said that after optimizations they will test a larger supported player count than 8.

 

It’s the same deal. It all depends on what they can do. When the game goes gold it has to be rock solid. All the stuff we forgive them for because it’s alpha will become unforgivable. They will go as large as they can.

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Instead of temporary let’s call it baseline. They are going to start from a size that they can support and then go from there. If they can support a larger size after optimizations they will do that and the current size will turn out to have been temporary.

 

They have repeatedly said that after optimizations they will test a larger supported player count than 8.

 

It’s the same deal. It all depends on what they can do. When the game goes gold it has to be rock solid. All the stuff we forgive them for because it’s alpha will become unforgivable. They will go as large as they can.

 

whew........... panic averted lol

 

I searched these forums for info but must have used the wrong keywords. Well hopefully knowing some of the community doesnt expect large maps to insta-load will lessen the preassure on the devs :p

 

thanks for setting me straight.

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Why on earth is the RWG in A17 that effin small? Is this offical? Or do i get that image in the first post wrong?

 

How about to let the player deceide how big they want it and how long they are willing to wait for, instead of just making it incredibly small?

 

Willing to wait for longer instead of having to play on small maps.

 

Well for one, the issue with 'letter players decide how big' is that TFP are the ones that have to support it and troubleshoot when things go wrong. A server owner hosting 50 players running into lag and then complaining or logging support requests isn't something TFP should have to deal with especially when there are limits in place to prevent that. Same with a server owner modding a map to 30k and running into the same issues. Yes it looks like 17 is going to have a much smaller map, but nothing to stop you from modding the xml (unless they shift to a hardcoded setting).

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OR we could play on small maps while we wait for them to make them larger....

 

OR we could NOT play on smaller maps and completly ruin everything multiplayer related and simply give us the option (with a warning) to have bigger maps.

Ill gladly lose a minibike once a week if I can go 10 kilometres away from the center.

Look this isn't really all that complicated. Its not like there is some sort of code that says "I will make your game stable but EVERYTHING bigger then now will crash the game"

 

Simple:

"Worldmap size: small (recommended) 8x8

medium 12x12 (previos alpha)

large (everything above medium might cause bugs and glitches and is not officially supported in this alpha) >12x>12"

 

Done. Everyone is happy, multiplayer isn't harmed and TFPs aren'T accountable for any bugs that occur.

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So... I'm not entirely clear on anything here! I just love confusion and it's reigning supreme for me at the moment! YAY!

 

So... What is being said is that it maybe possible to have a large map at the cost of waiting and have it pregenerate the map before you jump in and play?

 

Y'all killing me now! :)

 

It would be nice to be able to pregen a map on a server before hand!!! I or 'we' would wait a long time for that especially on a server! With a map at 20k - "we - in theory - could load a map of New York City!" That's what I'm talking about... But in reality I only meant 'parts of a city' :)

Washington DC could be done on many sizes, but a pregenerated map that would load fast would be a good thing! Increase the number to say like 5 or up to 10 pregen maps... There we go!!!

 

But yes - the point has been made that 'many new players' will not want to wait a long time and I'd say if you're nearing 5 minutes - that's pushing their limits HARD!

 

@Roland: I have looked for that command to pregen/display the map but can't find it :(

 

I do like Brian9824's idea:

https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?86081-A17-How-Long-Would-You-Wait-For-A-Pre-Generated-Map-to-Build&p=833879&viewfull=1#post833879

 

But on a server with 9 of us it can possibly lag the system since we almost always 'break to investigate' or do recon... Or one goes out to get wood, another goes out to the desert, one to the snow, etc.

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I guess I should step in and mention that the entire system is programmed with a Size variable and the code for generation scales.

 

8k is indeed the baseline as Roland put it. 8k is a good test to optimize as it is just a bit bigger than nav and I want it to take less than 10 minutes.

 

Generating larger sizes will work, will load, and will play. The variable for this will be exposed when you get a17. I'm doing testing on how long it takes things and putting together a semi-accurate timer so you know how long it's going to take total. The map generation is fully threaded aside from exporting to disk so you will be able to read messages on what is happening and how long is left, it will not lock up the game while generating. For dedi owners it will prevent joining until the map is generated and loaded.

 

So, 20k obviously takes a very long time to generate, the time goes up exponentially as the total km size does but the only technical limitation would be the hardware generating the map.

 

The reason we don't just load you in then generate as you go is that when making roads, placing towns, and generating other things; a lot of data has to exist. The map is put together in layers and that's done on a world level. It's not something that can be skipped around and is slower when done in such a manner. Now rwg maps run as fast as navezgane as far as chunk load times and that is something we've wanted for a long time. No special code during run time for random maps is a good thing.

 

The depth of editing that can be done to a randomly generated map after the fact now is awesome. You can change player spawns, move POIs, add new pois, add new roads, remove roads, edit the height map, etc. All things in rwg are accessible in the world folder just like with nav.

 

I wouldn't take away the ability to have large maps, that's something I also love. RWG is my baby after all. Don't panic and rest well in the fact that you won't be hard limited to 8k and that I've actually added more moddability with this change. ;)

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I wouldn't take away the ability to have large maps, that's something I also love. RWG is my baby after all. Don't panic and rest well in the fact that you won't be hard limited to 8k and that I've actually added more moddability with this change. ;)

 

I love you. You da man!

I was sweating in fear of A17 not only pretty much removing gunprogression (lets see how that turns out) and the nonsensicle attachment non detachment idea (which also has been partially discredited at least as far as "looking into it) but now also smaller maps.

 

 

THANK YOU SO MUCH!!! I don't know if you play multiplayer... if you know (or have read the comments) that large maps are an absolute must in multiplayer for the world to regenerate AND giving everyone enough space and their own traders.

 

I repeat myself but: THANKS <3

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Will the options above 8x8 force the server into the modded section on MP however since it's now an option?

 

It's not a game option per se, it's a generation option. The size variable is not tied to server stuff in that manner. Now if it's using custom pois it will still go to modded.

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I guess I should step in and mention that the entire system is programmed with a Size variable and the code for generation scales.

 

8k is indeed the baseline as Roland put it. 8k is a good test to optimize as it is just a bit bigger than nav and I want it to take less than 10 minutes.

 

Generating larger sizes will work, will load, and will play. The variable for this will be exposed when you get a17. I'm doing testing on how long it takes things and putting together a semi-accurate timer so you know how long it's going to take total. The map generation is fully threaded aside from exporting to disk so you will be able to read messages on what is happening and how long is left, it will not lock up the game while generating. For dedi owners it will prevent joining until the map is generated and loaded.

 

So, 20k obviously takes a very long time to generate, the time goes up exponentially as the total km size does but the only technical limitation would be the hardware generating the map.

 

The reason we don't just load you in then generate as you go is that when making roads, placing towns, and generating other things; a lot of data has to exist. The map is put together in layers and that's done on a world level. It's not something that can be skipped around and is slower when done in such a manner. Now rwg maps run as fast as navezgane as far as chunk load times and that is something we've wanted for a long time. No special code during run time for random maps is a good thing.

 

The depth of editing that can be done to a randomly generated map after the fact now is awesome. You can change player spawns, move POIs, add new pois, add new roads, remove roads, edit the height map, etc. All things in rwg are accessible in the world folder just like with nav.

 

I wouldn't take away the ability to have large maps, that's something I also love. RWG is my baby after all. Don't panic and rest well in the fact that you won't be hard limited to 8k and that I've actually added more moddability with this change. ;)

 

Do you ever see that variable being definable from within the game versus the xml? I think 99% of the issues people have is wanting to make the map size bigger WITHOUT making the server modded, and if it had say a dropdown for 8,12,16,20, etc as the options that would be perfect I think for nearly everyone.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

It's not a game option per se, it's a generation option. The size variable is not tied to server stuff in that manner. Now if it's using custom pois it will still go to modded.

 

So does that mean if you modify the size in the xml it won't flag your map as modded?

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It's not a game option per se, it's a generation option. The size variable is not tied to server stuff in that manner. Now if it's using custom pois it will still go to modded.

 

If the server is Vanilla using nothing but what you guys designed except for server size and lets say we went back to current 10x10 would it push to modded is basically what Im getting at?

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Do you ever see that variable being definable from within the game versus the xml? I think 99% of the issues people have is wanting to make the map size bigger WITHOUT making the server modded, and if it had say a dropdown for 8,12,16,20, etc as the options that would be perfect I think for nearly everyone.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

 

 

So does that mean if you modify the size in the xml it won't flag your map as modded?

 

There will not be an XML size as such. There will be one setting that won't affect the "modded" aspect of the server. It will be a game option that's only viable on newly generating maps. Nothing more, nothing less. After generation, you're loading a map that it spit out, not playing "Random Gen" as it is now.

 

Random Gen is now a World Map Generator, it's not ran during game time. You are quite simply generating a randomized Navezgane like map then it's automatically loaded up. At that point it's no different than Navezgane.

 

Also, yes, a dropdown of various sizes was already planned. Default of 8k.

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