Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

[Scyris]

Edit: Or, each zombie has a behavior:

 

-Nurses always target the player and always go for the easiest path.

-Bikers and lumberjacks will head straight for the player location and start attacking anything in there way.

-Spider zombies will quietly climb up the walls and only make a small sound when it sees the player.

 

This would give each zombie type some feel to them and no just a random, generic zed.

 

 

Opps! dang Internets not doing what I wanted!

 

I wish ALL zombies would only make a sound if they see the player, I never use guns because in a poi it wakes up the whole damned thing and then its zombie screech-a-thon. I'd rather them not make any voices but still try to destroy stuff.

 

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The tooth kraken demands A17 release lol.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]24488[/ATTACH]

 

If that is someones real pulled tooth man the pain must have been brutal once the freezing wore off.

[Scyris]

A17 cant be released yet!

 

I just started a new game, this time to test the shotgun perks, as I now know I can make a ton a shotgun shells consistently. This is truly a potential game changer for me and I want to make sure that using a skilled up shotgun wielding player is just as useful as a rifle expert.

 

Even if a maxed out shotgun player is slightly less than a rifle expert, it would still be a VERY strong choice!

 

Anyone ever do a shotgun focus and if so, what do you think?

 

I find the shotgun weak myself, its base damage is not to high when you factor in you bascally have to be kissing the zombie to do anything to it. Its headshot mult is low, and its per ray/pellet. Meanwhile the sniper hits almost as hard as a shotgun (with buckshot not slugs), at a much farther range with a 9x headshot bonus iirc. Add in the fact in a17 you can have a silenced sniper rifle, and well.... yeah.. I can't see ever using the shotgun unless it gets a silencer as well. Has too many demerits compared to any of the rifles. I find the pistol equally useless, as its range is ass, and it hits like a wet noodle. SMG is slightly better but not by much due to its lower headshot mult, but it does fix the range/sound issue. When a wooden bow with stone arrows hits as hard or harder at quality 25-50 than a 560 quality pistol, you know there is a balance issue there. You could argue clip size, but I find clip size moot, because of how much the zombies move after a headshot, its rare to be abel to double tap a zombie before its head moves way out of range.. They need to fix that tbh, they move way to much when shot.

[Aldranon]

I find the shotgun weak myself, its base damage is not to high when you factor in you bascally have to be kissing the zombie to do anything to it. Its headshot mult is low, and its per ray/pellet. Meanwhile the sniper hits almost as hard as a shotgun (with buckshot not slugs), at a much farther range with a 9x headshot bonus iirc. Add in the fact in a17 you can have a silenced sniper rifle, and well.... yeah.. I can't see ever using the shotgun unless it gets a silencer as well. Has too many demerits compared to any of the rifles. I find the pistol equally useless, as its range is ass, and it hits like a wet noodle. SMG is slightly better but not by much due to its lower headshot mult, but it does fix the range/sound issue. When a wooden bow with stone arrows hits as hard or harder at quality 25-50 than a 560 quality pistol, you know there is a balance issue there. You could argue clip size, but I find clip size moot, because of how much the zombies move after a headshot, its rare to be abel to double tap a zombie before its head moves way out of range.. They need to fix that tbh, they move way to much when shot.

 

Yeah, pistols are a waste of skill points (in A16 anyway) and I was completely turned off from the shotgun since A15.

 

Well, atleast the shotgun turrets for some reason do some epic damage. Balance issues, like you said.

[dhlmaster]

I havent commented on that because I was waiting until I see a high level player with skills and good mods.

 

If a max player/modded up Pistol cant one shot a normal zed in the head, then something is broken. We'll see.

 

Madmole stated clearly in that video more than once that no balancing had been done at that point. You're making a mountain out of a... wait for it... a MOLE hill

[dhlmaster]

I find the shotgun weak myself, its base damage is not to high when you factor in you bascally have to be kissing the zombie to do anything to it. Its headshot mult is low, and its per ray/pellet. Meanwhile the sniper hits almost as hard as a shotgun (with buckshot not slugs), at a much farther range with a 9x headshot bonus iirc. Add in the fact in a17 you can have a silenced sniper rifle, and well.... yeah.. I can't see ever using the shotgun unless it gets a silencer as well. Has too many demerits compared to any of the rifles. I find the pistol equally useless, as its range is ass, and it hits like a wet noodle. SMG is slightly better but not by much due to its lower headshot mult, but it does fix the range/sound issue. When a wooden bow with stone arrows hits as hard or harder at quality 25-50 than a 560 quality pistol, you know there is a balance issue there. You could argue clip size, but I find clip size moot, because of how much the zombies move after a headshot, its rare to be abel to double tap a zombie before its head moves way out of range.. They need to fix that tbh, they move way to much when shot.

 

Agree that pistols should be stronger than bows, especially when the pistol is better quality

[Guppycur]

As for the walking dead comment.. I think the smell would have alot to do with it. Who would want to constantly coat themselves with putrid smelling rotting flesh everytime they go outside?

 

The whisperers, the next iteration of bad guys after negan. Well, they one up the guts, they literally wear the skin.

[meganoth]

As for the walking dead comment.. I think the smell would have alot to do with it. Who would want to constantly coat themselves with putrid smelling rotting flesh everytime they go outside?

 

I would use a raincoat with rotting flesh on it instead.

[meganoth]

Okay...I admit that people might eventually learn such zombie behavior -- IF -- the zombies actually will all go to the single layer side of the base and leave the double layer side alone-- which I still doubt will happen except for very small bases and once faatal is done it may not even uniformly and predictably happen for very small bases.

 

In another comment you admired the players ingenuity (to always find exploits once they know the behaviour of the zombies) and still you deny them the intelligence to find out the rules of the zombies from hours of observation. Even masked by randomness a player will see "habits" of the zombies emerge, for example after watching dozens of zombies on a horde night or watching a screamer horde.

 

Visitors of Italy soon find out that Italians talk with their hands, even if some of them don't.

[zWolfer]

Hey guys, hey devs. Hello everyone.

 

I have a question/suggestion for you..

 

Is there any chance to add an option to remove the random mines/bombs from Wasteland Biome?

 

I like the idea of random mines, but sometimes I just wanna run and have no time to focus where I'm walking..

Please? ^^

[Gnomaana]

Hey guys, hey devs. Hello everyone.

 

I have a question/suggestion for you..

 

Is there any chance to add an option to remove the random mines/bombs from Wasteland Biome?

 

I like the idea of random mines, but sometimes I just wanna run and have no time to focus where I'm walking..

Please? ^^

 

That sounds moddable in the XML files but it would take someone with more knowledge to tell you where.

[zWolfer]

That sounds moddable in the XML files but it would take someone with more knowledge to tell you where.

 

That does not work for me.

 

Its just sometimes I want to remove them. Like when im going to dig a treasure. So after it, i want them back. This way I would just have to back to menu and change it. Modding xml everytime will make me lose more time than looking for the mines in game. :/

[Scyris]

Yeah, pistols are a waste of skill points (in A16 anyway) and I was completely turned off from the shotgun since A15.

 

Well, atleast the shotgun turrets for some reason do some epic damage. Balance issues, like you said.

 

Pistol should have lower base dmg than say xbow/rifle, but it should be somewhere in between bow/xbow. Maybe a high qual one should be at 20-22 dmg or so? without perks. Insted of my 588 qual one that is at 12.xx dmg on survivalist diffculty.

[emarat]

That does not work for me.

 

Its just sometimes I want to remove them. Like when im going to dig a treasure. So after it, i want them back. This way I would just have to back to menu and change it. Modding xml everytime will make me lose more time than looking for the mines in game. :/

 

I understand what you want but i am not sure if that is even possible to do. If it is it probably will not done till Beta or Post Launch.

 

Also instead of constantly editing the xml you could just have a modded and a normal one and switch them out but that would be the only way to do it right now.

[art1336]

I would use a raincoat with rotting flesh on it instead.

 

Much better idea.

[qprophet]

Guys. You are 'fighting' over something which hasn't even come out yet. Let's see how it works when A17 is released around Halloween.

 

 

 

Hmm. That felt weird. That's usually one of the arguments used against me.

 

Ps. No matter how difficult the developers will make the AI, players will always find a way to exploit it.

 

Who are you? ...and what have you done with the REAL DaVega?!

[Tin]

That does not work for me.

 

Its just sometimes I want to remove them. Like when im going to dig a treasure. So after it, i want them back. This way I would just have to back to menu and change it. Modding xml everytime will make me lose more time than looking for the mines in game. :/

 

Just enable "god mod" every time you get into those moods, so you don't die when one explodes.

F1 to bring up the command line.

dm [enter]

[esc][esc] tick "god mode".

Continue game.

 

Then [esc] untick "god mode" to Continue game when you want to go back to normal mode. No edits involved.

[Armstrrong]

That does not work for me.

 

Its just sometimes I want to remove them. Like when im going to dig a treasure. So after it, i want them back. This way I would just have to back to menu and change it. Modding xml everytime will make me lose more time than looking for the mines in game. :/

 

Only Tin and Hubcap mines in wasteland, and they can't kill you if you are at full health.

[Roland]

In another comment you admired the players ingenuity (to always find exploits once they know the behaviour of the zombies) and still you deny them the intelligence to find out the rules of the zombies from hours of observation. Even masked by randomness a player will see "habits" of the zombies emerge, for example after watching dozens of zombies on a horde night or watching a screamer horde.

 

Visitors of Italy soon find out that Italians talk with their hands, even if some of them don't.

 

Ya...And I do believe that in general. I guess that one specific example just seemed way out there to me and, as I have said, I really don’t believe that the zombies are going to run around to the weakest side of your base. That is not how it’s going to work—especially if you have a large base.

 

People are taking what faatal has written about the foundational work of pathing and block targeting and started poking holes in nonexistent problems because what he has described to us is not the whole of it but some are acting as if what he has described is the new AI.

 

But by all means poke away since it is on topic.

[qprophet]

TWD zombies wouldn't even be a threat without the ppl in the show consistently being stupid and not paying attention to their surroundings. Here lets walk into this room without even being halfway cautious and just walk in.. zombie food!. Hey! lets walk around this corner, as tight as possible, instead of as wide as possible.. zombie food!. Hey! lets go to the city where the highest population counts used to be at.. zombie food! on and on..

Really hope they don't base the zombies in 7D2D on TWD zombies.

 

I believe the mini horde zombies in 7D2D are based directly off of TWD zombies. Those...ninjas...manage to move through grass, debris, and crowded buildings without making a sound.

 

They can't just show up when I am visibly searching around....oh no. They have to appear when I have my inventory open, deep in thought about whether I should ditch the 22 bones I have in my inventory for the 3 turds I found in the toilet.

[RavenGMT]

Agree that pistols should be stronger than bows, especially when the pistol is better quality

 

The 9mm pistol is sadly nerfed in 7DTD. Balancing issues aside, there's no reason a 115 or 147gr projectile (the image shows regular ball projectile) flying over 1,000 FPS should be some lazy slouch when it comes to putting the undead down. As someone stated above, the range is oddly short and it seems that multiple hits aren't registered if the zombie is still doing it's "taking damage" routine. With pistol skills completely maxed out, it finally seems like an OK choice, but making some makeshift bow somehow more powerful seems wrong. I'm sure all this can be fixed with user editing but it seems like a fixable oversight to be honest. Not to mention that the shotguns seem to need tweaking too. I know I'm a stickler for the weapons system in the game, but it matters to me so why not say something, right?

[Xtrakicking]

[...] (In fact, it is inexplicable why the characters in TWD never routinely rubbed guts on themselves whenever going out since they learned early on that it worked...)

 

But in games, we don't want to be bored by predictable enemy behavior.

 

I would use a raincoat with rotting flesh on it instead.

 

Not sure if you guys have ever smelled rotting flesh before, but just one small whiff can easily make you instantly throw up and make you feel sick for a while. Imagine now wearing clothing that's been smeared in rotting flesh 24/7. It would be unbearable, not to mention all the diseases and infections you'd get from that.

[Armstrrong]

Not sure if you guys have ever smelled rotting flesh before, but just one small whiff can easily make you instantly throw up and make you feel sick for a while. Imagine now wearing clothing that's been smeared in rotting flesh 24/7. It would be unbearable, not to mention all the diseases and infections you'd get from that.

 

Just wear gas mask and you are safe.

[Xtrakicking]

Just wear gas mask and you are safe.

 

I hope you have enough O2 tanks for that.

[Roland]

They have to appear when I have my inventory open, deep in thought about whether I should ditch the 22 bones I have in my inventory for the 3 turds I found in the toilet.

 

And some people would rob you of important choices like this by increasing inventory size and allowing you to have it all...

[Gnomaana]

I understand what you want but i am not sure if that is even possible to do. If it is it probably will not done till Beta or Post Launch.

 

Also instead of constantly editing the xml you could just have a modded and a normal one and switch them out but that would be the only way to do it right now.

 

So, you want them there but be able to toggle them all off on the current map you are playing? XML wouldn't even help there. That is not now, and I am willing to bet will never be, an option. There would be zero reason for the Devs to waste time trying to code in such a nonsensical thing in game. God Mode is your only choice. But if you are going to do that then just make up a random list of items you think will be in the Treasure Chest and spawn them in.