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Developer Discussions: Alpha 17


Roland

Developer Discussions: Alpha 17  

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  1. 1. Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

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Yes, and your opinion was that late game was the biggest problem. Sorry, your opinion is wrong. If we were Gold? Sure, you would be 100% correct. Even just Beta you would be correct. But, while still in Alpha not only is missing end game NOT the biggest problem but if the end game was there at this point THAT would be a problem because it would constrain any radical changes to some underlying systems to try to fix actual issues.

 

I never said..END GAME..i said late game play has not been addressed ..that's all. Relax bro..its an opinion. Its an alpha opinion...better??

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I wouldn't know as we get extremely vague updates now....but since the behemoth was shot down

 

Since you mention the behemoth.

 

As far as I understand the behemoth would be big, lots of hit points and have massive block damage. Two out of those three qualities can be given to any zombie in the game with 2 simple xml changes. Actually a few mods for advanced players should have one or two zombies like that in it. Would they be enough or is the size of the behemoth indispensable for you as a late game threat?

 

If size doesn't matter, TFP could add more bullet-sponge, block-damaging zombies any day. But the result would mostly be that after horde night you would have to add another day of base repair. Is that what you want?

 

(And I'm of the opinion that we shouldn't talk about squishy opinions, we should talk about facts. Correction: And I'm of the fact that we....)

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You don't put a ton of work into end/late game until the basics are practically set in stone. That is game development, or at least good game development. It would be a huge waste of money and resources to completely flesh out late game and then change the underlying structures. According to what type of changes you put into something like AI or physics it is possible you would end up having to scrap almost your entire end game and start over.

 

I see this type of comment on here all the time and they all boil down to this, "We don't have a complete game yet. Where is xyz?" Welcome to EARLY access, early as in NOT complete. If you have a complete game, it wouldn't be called Alpha. It would be Beta or even Gold.

 

If you sign up for Early Access, you should expect that the further in the game you play the more things you will find missing or incomplete.

 

Sounds good on paper, but all evidence points to late game being "ADD MOAR HP" and quite frankly that's a lazy end game mechanic that most veteran players will see through immediately.

 

We are well enough into development that late game mechanics should start becoming SOME kind of a priority. They are building all of these great mid game things like Jeeps and Gyrocopters, yet all we have been hinted at thus far is raid boss zombies. Not much else in terms of late game challenges or obstacles. Eventually you add so much to early game that you create your OWN hurdle to late game.

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mid game things like Jeeps and Gyrocopters, yet all we have been hinted at thus far is raid boss zombies. Not much else in terms of late game challenges or obstacles.

 

Gyro is mid-game? Ok, what is your idea of a late game challenge not made out of bullet-sponge?

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Since you mention the behemoth.

 

As far as I understand the behemoth would be big, lots of hit points and have massive block damage. Two out of those three qualities can be given to any zombie in the game with 2 simple xml changes. Actually a few mods for advanced players should have one or two zombies like that in it. Would they be enough or is the size of the behemoth indispensable for you as a late game threat?

 

If size doesn't matter, TFP could add more bullet-sponge, block-damaging zombies any day. But the result would mostly be that after horde night you would have to add another day of base repair. Is that what you want?

 

(And I'm of the opinion that we shouldn't talk about squishy opinions, we should talk about facts. Correction: And I'm of the fact that we....)

 

I was never in favor of the Behemoth...never thought it fit the game....i have always said to add breacher type zombies...a scientist with a breaker of fuel...or a military guy with a rocket or a miner with a stick of dynamite. To clear the outer layer of base defenses and or breach walls...or at the least take a few levels off upgraded blocks.

So ok what's the answer...never to be challenged in late game...to have an indestructible unbreachable fortress where you just sit inside...sounds fun ! Its a survival game....shoulnt it be a challenge to survive??

So build it once and then what....keep it shiny. I personally don't build one huge base..i build multiple ones as I move and explore.

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You may have missed the following line item in the first post. Think again!

 

•Wainscotting Block added

 

You may have missed the lines above that where Madmole told us that things added to the list were things finished or being currently worked on. Wainscotting Block is not what they are aspiring to with A17. It was done months ago and listed in the changes for those who play this game with an enjoyment of building and designing interiors and/or creating prefabs.

 

Endgame content isn't going to show up on the list until it is done or currently being worked on. So the list is not a good indicator of where A17 is going, it is only an indicator of what has been accomplished so far.

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Gyro is mid-game? Ok, what is your idea of a late game challenge not made out of bullet-sponge?

 

Let's be honest, the Gyrocopter will be attainable by mid game. Read back on my posts, i am heavily against it. But que sera sera you know?

 

Ill be damned, a wainscoting block IS on the features list. And I was worried about late game goals :behindsofa:

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Sounds good on paper, but all evidence points to late game being "ADD MOAR HP" and quite frankly that's a lazy end game mechanic that most veteran players will see through immediately.

 

We are well enough into development that late game mechanics should start becoming SOME kind of a priority. They are building all of these great mid game things like Jeeps and Gyrocopters, yet all we have been hinted at thus far is raid boss zombies. Not much else in terms of late game challenges or obstacles. Eventually you add so much to early game that you create your OWN hurdle to late game.

 

Jax?

 

Why you wasting time on the developer forum? Get your virtual butt back over to RavenWhatTheHeck 3.0...

 

Oh!!!!

 

(Dude - massive kudos and appreciation - for so many things/reasons.)

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Let's be honest, the Gyrocopter will be attainable by mid game. Read back on my posts, i am heavily against it. But que sera sera you know?

 

Ill be damned, a wainscoting block IS on the features list. And I was worried about late game goals :behindsofa:

 

Yeh but the game won't be complete without GUTTERS!

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I was never in favor of the Behemoth...never thought it fit the game....i have always said to add breacher type zombies...a scientist with a breaker of fuel...or a military guy with a rocket or a miner with a stick of dynamite. To clear the outer layer of base defenses and or breach walls...or at the least take a few levels off upgraded blocks.

 

Ok, that is basically just a zombie with massive block damage. Trivially to implement by changing a number in xml. Since TFP isn't doing it, they probably don't want that in the game. But it seems modders also don't include zombies with really massive block damage in the game (or I just haven't seen them yet).

 

Could it be that they are just not fun? Base building is done as a reaction to how zombies work. If zombies are too good at destroying bases I wouldn't waste my time with base building anymore. Not because of the danger but because base repair is the most boring grind I can imagine in 7D2D, even mining is less boring because you can do something else or turn off the brain. I would use connected POIs as one-use structures then and never build bases anymore.

 

So ok what's the answer...never to be challenged in late game...to have an indestructible unbreachable fortress where you just sit inside...sounds fun ! Its a survival game....shoulnt it be a challenge to survive??

So build it once and then what....keep it shiny. I personally don't build one huge base..i build multiple ones as I move and explore.

 

For you the answer is to either mod yourself or ask someone which value to change so that you have your late game base destroyer. Fits your style nicely but isn't a one-size-fits-them-all case.

 

I like bases I build once and then don't need to grind to rebuild every week. I also don't want to build a new base every week, that is as much work as repairing the old.

 

My ideal late-game zombie (for the challenge) would be a zombie that doesn't destroy structures but circumvents them. Jumping zombies, zombie-throwing zombies, ghost zombies, zombies growing out of the floor or ceiling,,...

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I just had an interesting Idea, We all love and hate screamers for what they obviously do, but what if you amped it up to a radiated screamer that summons more than 3 zombies a scream, higher tier zombies with higher chances for irradiated zombies? What do you all think? or even a feral screamer, i havent seen those ones yet.

 

Ummm... the zombies that we get off screamers at day 198+ right now are everything from normal zombies to feral everythings... even zombie bears with a few dogs in tow.

 

I don't know what level you are, but if you're at 200+ as I am and a few of our friends are, then you'll get killed pretty soon. But if you're still at level 60 and playing by yourself... well, yeah. You're not there yet.

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Ok, that is basically just a zombie with massive block damage. Trivially to implement by changing a number in xml. Since TFP isn't doing it, they probably don't want that in the game. But it seems modders also don't include zombies with really massive block damage in the game (or I just haven't seen them yet).

 

Could it be that they are just not fun? Base building is done as a reaction to how zombies work. If zombies are too good at destroying bases I wouldn't waste my time with base building anymore. Not because of the danger but because base repair is the most boring grind I can imagine in 7D2D, even mining is less boring because you can do something else or turn off the brain. I would use connected POIs as one-use structures then and never build bases anymore.

 

Guppy had a modded server set up with Baby Boomers. They were green, baby-sized, baby-looking mobs which came at you as a herd, and exploded when they got within a certain distance of you.

 

We'd be playing and someone would spot them incoming, and people would just scramble to get out of the way. Think "GRENADE!". They'd go off and leave craters in their wake...

 

I definitely had a love-hate relationship with them. They added a serious level of challenge, pucker, and fun to the game.

 

-A

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In my humble opinion:

Early-Mid game: Done for the most part. NPC Factions needed.

 

Late game: The discovery that the Zombie virus was made to kill off most of mankind and let the elite of the world (Calling themselves The New World Order) live in luxury while their genetic modifications get stronger each year (approaching magical powers). A warrior sub-caste of genetically modified super humans do there bidding. (The Duke is a Tier 3 warrior of the NWO). The beginning struggle with the New World Order begins.

 

End Game:

The player finally discovers that he is a one in a billion, "freak of nature", who has no theoretical limits. A Part 2 would be needed to finish the global struggle and finally discover who and what the character really is.

 

Gear: The Gyrocopter and Airship are near end game items.

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Umm, structure prefabs are going to make it in A17 right?

 

Edit: I mean i've never seen them on video showcasing new Jeep™, gyrocopter and motorcycle.

 

I'm not sure if I understand you completely, but MM did have a video or two about some new prefabs coming in A17...

 

-A

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I'm sensing a marketing campaign for those neebs fellows going on... posts are everywhere.

 

I never heard of them before today. They are pretty fun to watch as they try to stay in character. Over 600K viewers is nothing to sneeze at.

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I never heard of them before today. They are pretty fun to watch as they try to stay in character. Over 600K viewers is nothing to sneeze at.

 

Lucky bastard....their vids are all fresh and new to you... I've watched all the 7DTD, ARK, Subnautica and GTA5 videos and now they can't put them out fast enough to feed my addiction.

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End Game:[/b]

The player finally discovers that he is a one in a billion, "freak of nature", who has no theoretical limits. A Part 2 would be needed to finish the global struggle and finally discover who and what the character really is.

.

 

One of his limitless powers is changing into a mindless zombie. Sadly the mindless zombie has only thoughts left for brains and doesn't want to change back anymore.

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