Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Roland

Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

Developer Discussions: Alpha 17  

1 member has voted

  1. 1. Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

    • Newly Updated
      1
    • Check out the newest reveals by Madmole
      0
    • Over 100 new perk books with set collecting and bonuses
      0


Recommended Posts

I like the idea of a BM but not every 7 Days, 7 DTD has to do with the Virus & finding an antidote. Maybe once a month or 3 months game time, just have the BM make the ZEDS go CRAZY & not make a bee line to your base to destroy it.

[...]

The PLAYER or his BASE can not be the magnet that draws a ZED, the actions of the player has to be the trigger to attract ZEDS.

I guess the intention behind BM is to force the player to fight. Something he has to prepare for. Somtehing that keeps a little pressure on the player.

 

I agree, that happening statically every 7th day makes it a bit boring because it's to predictable. I'd prefer a random occurence, configurable, default 3-10 days. For me an option to disable them would be completely fine for those who don't want to have BM.

 

But there is nothing challenging in the game besides of the BM. Wandering hordes are trivial and easy to avoid, even without using any glitches or bugs (like digging down to bedrock and just wait for the BM to be over). I just thought about that a dozen times and without any BM (or 3 Months, 90 Days, i sometimes don't even play a game that long!) it becomes boring. You don't even need to build a defense base, you don't need to prepare for anything. What is the goal than? Just leveling up building bases and getting better weapons for... nothing?

 

What actions of the player do you mean? Your actions are already causing consequenzes. That's what the heatmap deals with. Your base is part of your actions. If you constantly use 10 forges in your base, then the forges are the point which gain interest by the Zs, but it is still an action you the player triggered.

What should the consequenzes be, for whatever you are doing? Wandering hordes heading to the heatmap hotspots instead of the player? Even more screamers? Whats the differenze then to a BM, besids it is not happing constantly?

Edited by Liesel Weppen (see edit history)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Any chance we are going to have long range melee wepons, spears by any chance

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Is this the reality argument again or where does the "you shouldn't" come from? If yes,[irony on] don't forget stacking, you shouldn't be able to carry more than the material to make a tenth of a cobblestone block and definitely no 6000 pieces of iron.[irony off]

 

But the real answer to your implied question is: Because this is a game, not work, it should maximize the fun and interesting activities, not the tedium. It could be argued that small inventories make the game a bit more difficult or it might teach some people the art of throwing away things. But for the majority of players it is just a nuisance that makes you waste the more time with inventory mamagement the less space you have.

 

Naturally this is a matter of opinion and taste whether the backpack is too small, just right or too big.

My beef with the backpack at the moment is that I (as scavenger) have to waste lots of time with managing my inventory while I clearly see that the easy path would be to mine a few in-game hours, produce a stack of machete blades (or some other stackable item with trader value) and sell that to the trader with no inventory problems at all. Then buy the stuff I want instead of working with the stuff I find.

 

The Trader is ok as a game element but from ignored in A15 it became too important in A16. In my current co-op game 3 out of the 4 players are constantly touring traders. The small backpack is not the main reason for this but it encourages this degeneration of playstyles.

 

I disagree with pretty much all of this. Inventory management like time management nis an aspect of survival. This is very reminiscent of when people wanted to keep instant crafting in the game because waiting for a timer "added no difficulty to the game and just made things tedious".

 

Increasing the inventory to the point that you can carry everything you could possibly need and not ever have to make decisions about what to keep or leave behind is akin to just having the creative menu enabled. There's your infinite backpack size right there.

 

I think it is good enough that mods are available to have larger backpack sizes for those who have separation anxiety for their digital items. We already have additional mobile storage with the mini bike and will have more when taming a wolf companion is implemented.

 

There are certain elements of a survival game that if removed, even in the name of fun, cause the game to turn into something else. Perhaps you just don't think survival genre games are fun? To me, removing the choices that are inherent to limited inventory slots and limited stack sizes will take this game too far beyond the survival genre to be fun for me and to my mind those who can't stand having to make choices between keeping or tossing are probably just not fans of the genre.

 

"I want to carry 100% of what I own instead of having to make choices"

"I want to instantly craft everything instead of having to make choices"

"I want 100% skills and perks instead of having to make choices"

"I want to be 100% safe instead of having to make choices"

"I want animals available 100% of the time instead of having to make choices"

 

Survival is about making good and smart choices and I feel that changes that remove those tough choices from the game should be limited to mods. Having those choices is what defines a lot of the fun for those who like survival games.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I think it is good enough that mods are available to have larger backpack sizes for those who have separation anxiety for their digital items.

Is it possible in A16 change backpack and minibike storage sizes on server side? I saw that possible to add new items, recipes, enemies etc on server side, without any local installation, but as I know in A15 changing backpack size was only possible with changing local files, and was detected with EAC protection as cheat.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I disagree with pretty much all of this. Inventory management like time management nis an aspect of survival. This is very reminiscent of when people wanted to keep instant crafting in the game because waiting for a timer "added no difficulty to the game and just made things tedious".

 

Increasing the inventory to the point that you can carry everything you could possibly need and not ever have to make decisions about what to keep or leave behind is akin to just having the creative menu enabled. There's your infinite backpack size right there.

 

I think it is good enough that mods are available to have larger backpack sizes for those who have separation anxiety for their digital items. We already have additional mobile storage with the mini bike and will have more when taming a wolf companion is implemented.

 

There are certain elements of a survival game that if removed, even in the name of fun, cause the game to turn into something else. Perhaps you just don't think survival genre games are fun? To me, removing the choices that are inherent to limited inventory slots and limited stack sizes will take this game too far beyond the survival genre to be fun for me and to my mind those who can't stand having to make choices between keeping or tossing are probably just not fans of the genre.

 

"I want to carry 100% of what I own instead of having to make choices"

"I want to instantly craft everything instead of having to make choices"

"I want 100% skills and perks instead of having to make choices"

"I want to be 100% safe instead of having to make choices"

"I want animals available 100% of the time instead of having to make choices"

 

Survival is about making good and smart choices and I feel that changes that remove those tough choices from the game should be limited to mods. Having those choices is what defines a lot of the fun for those who like survival games.

 

I agree with 100% of what Roland just posted. My number 1 argument has always been that the survival aspect of this game sometimes gets shelved for 'accessibility'. The choices are what keeps me coming back.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
.... it's a royal pain in the ass.

be my guest :strawberry:

 

-----------------------------------

 

Yup. At the end of the Alpha 16 developer's diary thread I posted that whoever posted first on the A17 developer diary's thread would win a free copy of 7 Days to Die. That's you. Congratulations.

 

/Game's in the Mail...

 

Thanks for the Gamecode Roland

Completly forget that as i saw the fresh A17 Post

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A good suggestion from the Steam forums.

I asked there for ideas for Wilderness Pois. and it come the wish for "Roadblocks" up.

Because i cant place them on the roads (with my actuall Knowledge) i think it would be a great addition if tfp look for a new nice kind of Poi´s

 

Imagine the roadblock from "28 Days Later" as a start. And yes i know that a roadblock makes less sense without real long walls, but still as "Standalone" they would be cool.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hi Guys, I just wanted open up discussion of Alpha 17. Sorry we have been tight lipped about it, but I wanted to try something different this time where we talk about finished or work in progress features rather than stuff we simply planned. This leads to less frustration because usually once something is started we finish it, where its easy to plan a bunch of stuff and have it slip through the cracks, which is disappointing for all of us.

 

I will say we're ramping up the team, we've hired two new senior programmers, a concept artist, an environment artist, a designer, and we have about 5 new full time world builders. I'll begin showing stuff on youtube real soon. I have two keyboards hooked up at the same time now so I can annoy people if I want, or use the quiet keyboard if I want :)

 

It's good to know you guys are still grinding the gears, when things slip through it's definitely disheartening, I remember in the past I had programmed a bunch of weapons (possibly 20 or more) in through trial and error for 1 person and in comparison with the other weapons they weren't very balanced so they got taken out anyway I actually saw you were looking for people to help out unfortunately I don't have very good communication skills (I can be seen as somewhat rude) and I've only up until now worked with 2-3 other people.

 

Other than that I was wondering if we could get a huge POI mansion previously owned by some rich eccentric and very accomplished mayor complete with it's own courtyard hedge maze as for the inside, maybe it could be medieval looking with carpets and drapes? Would be nice especially if someone pays attention to most of the details IE the ones that could be recreated with current resources, just a suggestion.

Edited by NachtIntellect (see edit history)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

WooHoo page 10! @MM glad to see you are back and understand the new focus/approach.

 

With Christmas around the corner, I wanted to put my A17 wishlist together:

1. Fix gore block Duping

 

2. Fishing - would be nice to catch something or club fish or add string to crossbow and spear fish - you will need to add water predators as well like Gators

 

3. raft!

 

4. with all the rain, the ability to capture that water, must degrade so I need to repair it

 

5. Lightning that actually hits stuff and causes damage

 

6. Hatching eggs - need a Rooster!

 

7. Bouncing Betty (Claymore mine) with ability to use a trigger wire/cord.

 

8. Doors that close automatically - maybe a setting in serverconfig.xml?

 

9. more fog of war.

 

10. Peanut butter.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You lost me at Aluminum...

 

Nitrate is harder to find than a nonexistent ore in the game? Read the ingame journal for mining. I think it will help.

 

You mean there is info in the journal how to see Nitrate on the surface while riding a minibike? From what I have seen Aluminum(read:LEAD) is more common on the surface and usually can be found in more than 1 biome, Nitrate not so much, I found 1 surface node one time in the burning forest, the rest of the 20+ nodes in the same area were shale and coal, that was A16.1. I had heard that you might have to dig for it but even then its not a guarantee that it will be there to harvest. Sadly my 2?3? attempts at digging for it proved fruitless. So I am resigned to destroying endless boulders, but the bright side to that is that coal comes with it.

 

It used to be(previous alphas) you could ride around looking for caves, and find several of them, many would have some Nitrate in them, but caves were fixed several times now making them difficult to find if at all (rwg). I can say that on the last 3-4 rwg maps I played I havent found a single cave. I found 2 on a MP server map once. So my deduction here is, given the amount of effort it takes to find "easily accessible" Nitrate, it is harder to find now. But is all this just working as intended?

Edited by Death2gnomes (see edit history)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Increasing the inventory to the point that you can carry everything you could possibly need and not ever have to make decisions about what to keep or leave behind is akin to just having the creative menu enabled. There's your infinite backpack size right there.

 

May I, with a polite but stern voice, shout STRAWMAN!!. I never argued for increasing the size to that point or any point near it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You were but my muse Meganoth. I understand you were not wanting to carry your kitchen sink around with you. :)

 

But I do think the current backpack size is good for the basic unmodded game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You mean there is info in the journal how to see Nitrate on the surface while riding a minibike? From what I have seen Aluminum is more common on the surface and usually can be found in more than 1 biome, Nitrate not so much, I found 1 surface node one time in the burning forest, the rest of the 20+ nodes in the same area were shale and coal, that was A16.1. I had heard that you might have to dig for it but even then its not a guarantee that it will be there to harvest. Sadly my 2?3? attempts at digging for it proved fruitless. So I am resigned to destroying endless boulders, but the bright side to that is that coal comes with it.

 

It used to be(previous alphas) you could ride around looking for caves, and find several of them, many would have some Nitrate in them, but caves were fixed several times now making them difficult to find if at all (rwg). I can say that on the last 3-4 rwg maps I played I havent found a single cave. I found 2 on a MP server map once. So my deduction here is, given the amount of effort it takes to find "easily accessible" Nitrate, it is harder to find now. But is all this just working as intended?

 

Aluminum doesn't exist in the game....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

are you kidding? nitrate is everywhere. one map I was on by day 3 i had mined 30 nodes. and it is dropped from rock, gravel, and underground ores like candy on Halloween. I find it mainly in the plains area. it super common there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Blood Moon is a NEW FEATURE & some of us prefer the WANDERING HORDES to constantly building & repairing a base because of a predetermined game clock that constantly gives you bigger & bigger Hordes that will destroy your base even more every 7 Days.

I don't want to play like that! I want to have time to explore, build & survive on my terms & not the Game Clock making me run back & defend my base. (Just like returning to the control room in COD Zombies)

I am not talking about other games I am talking about this one & its original concept of trying to survive a Zombie Future alone, in the woods, in my underwear.

 

Another problem with the BM is I run a server & I would not want to join a server on day 150 with maxed out 7 Day Hordes & try to survive, it would not be possible or fun.

A server needs to be like Day 1 for everyone that joins the server no matter what day count the server is on.

 

This is quite true and an issue that needs to be looked at at some point, not saying it has to be A17 but certainly before Beta. We are near Day 200 on ours and at this point even with 90 minute days our players are logging in ONLY to farm repair mats and do radiated, feral Blood Moons. The fun is almost gone and Im finding that we might need to mod them out or perhaps have them arrive every OTHER 7 days.

 

BM on an MP server CAN work but their frequency and high impact at later game stages has clearly become an issue for everyone save those players that spend hours every day on the server. Wandering hordes are much more fun to our community. While I wouldn't want BM removed completely or at the very least replaced by something else, the fact that time carries on for MP players means our players never get a full 6 days to prepare for the next one. And eventually that type of gameplay can drive away even the most hardcore of players as eventually they are faced with what seems to be a non stop BM fight.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Someone mentioned BM's?

 

...oh. Blood moons.

 

Um, they need work, but as many times as they've changed since they we're introduced, I've no doubt they'll change again.

 

Let's bitch about them in beta.

 

(Or will that be too late?)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You were but my muse Meganoth. I understand you were not wanting to carry your kitchen sink around with you. :)

 

But I do think the current backpack size is good for the basic unmodded game.

 

Depends...

will clothing be changed so that certain types can help you in cold and in warm conditions?

will it be possible to combine cloth items of same type and different colour to a default colour?

 

 

Currently constantly alternating Poncho and Winterjacket - taking up one slot; and carrying about 200% more looted clothes around than I would ever need because I can hardly remember what colour my highest quality Shirt has so I can combine it to 600 Q

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This is quite true and an issue that needs to be looked at at some point, not saying it has to be A17 but certainly before Beta. We are near Day 200 on ours and at this point even with 90 minute days our players are logging in ONLY to farm repair mats and do radiated, feral Blood Moons. The fun is almost gone and Im finding that we might need to mod them out or perhaps have them arrive every OTHER 7 days.

 

BM on an MP server CAN work but their frequency and high impact at later game stages has clearly become an issue for everyone save those players that spend hours every day on the server. Wandering hordes are much more fun to our community. While I wouldn't want BM removed completely or at the very least replaced by something else, the fact that time carries on for MP players means our players never get a full 6 days to prepare for the next one. And eventually that type of gameplay can drive away even the most hardcore of players as eventually they are faced with what seems to be a non stop BM fight.

 

I think the time in the game I enjoyed the most was on a multiplayer server, having the freedom to build and explore but the risk of running into a wondering horde and having it wonder into your base. I think that was probably Alpha 9 or 10 though, it felt a lot more like the walking dead kind of survival instead of Dawn of the Dead + 28 days lol. The clockwork attacks just ruin it for me, especially considering their extreme difficulty. At least to very casual players like myself. With the ability to configure/mod it easily I think the game would be a lot more fun for a larger range of people. To be honest on my server I used to host if it was an option I'd turn off BM entirely and ramp up wondering horde size and difficulty.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

what i would love to see in the game and i dont know if i could make modding.. blocks that look like flower pots that we can craft and grow food in.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...