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Developer Discussions: Alpha 17


Roland

Developer Discussions: Alpha 17  

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  1. 1. Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

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The story game is griever safe people. Select “1 player” and your story is your own. There is no need for convoluted safeguards. The most powerful safeguard is your own ability to select.....one.....friggin......player [Wilhelm Scream]!!!

 

Is my mic not on or something?

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Really?

From what you were saying last week. It seemed to indicate that Madmole was going to try to put a video out either last week or this one.

Since it did not happen last week. I am assuming this one.

 

My point was that I don’t know and that videos seem to be about 3-5 weeks apart. He was hoping to but then...Super Bowl. So maybe this weekend....

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Ok, but that answers my concern only partially!

 

My concern is that I can't really imagine how could the current multiplayer system work with a full story with quests, NPCs, followers and all the things that I mentioned in my previous post. I'm not in the mind of the developers and maybe they do know how to make it all happen so that both sp and mp can actually become one without any kind of issue.

 

It was just that this game is certainly not Dead Island where co-op worked because there was a story tailored for it. 7 Days To Die is a whole different game with some extra features like world destruction that could possibly make the same kind of story gameplay impossible!

 

For example, in Dead Island you couldn't shoot NPCs that were important for the game story, neither you could destroy the world like you can do in 7 Days To Die which would ultimately lead to some funny consequences for the story and possible multiplayer griefing that would ruin the game for those who would prefer to follow the story before some troll destroys their world making it impossible to finish the quest!

 

Therefore, unless the developers can magically make sure that these problems would never really happen, multiplayer aspect of the game will necessarily either hurt or limit the singleplayer experience to a great extent. That's why I was asking that question - are the things like singleplayer oriented story, quests, followers and all that not going to be a part of the final version of this game after all?

 

That's why quests should be from "Faction + Title" and not a specific NPC. So, if you get a quest from: "The Ranger's", Leader NPC, if the current leader is killed then another takes his place.

 

What would be interesting is to have them all wiped out and that triggers another quest: "The Angel of Death" - Kill them all! ("Them" could be any number of NPC's) OR "The Rise of the Phoenix!" YOU can be the leader who: makes the Rangers great again!

 

See, MP is no problem to a robust quest system.

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There's a podcast called "We're Alive" which I'm listening to which seems to use some of the same sounds for their zombies. Are the zombie sounds in 7DTD stock sounds bought as filler? Or are they the finished version?

 

Note: I'm not saying there's anything wrong with the sounds, I was just curious.

 

I think they are stock unity sounds or ones you can buy, I've heard the same zombie sounds in quite a few other zombie games. So my guess would be that they are filler for now. With proper ones maybe around beta time. Its just a guess though.

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On the subject of solo vs multiplayer gaming, someone asked awhile back if you could change it after a save has been created and the answer is yes. You can change the number of players and whether the game shows up publicly, is visible only to friends, or is private and invisible to everyone.

 

So if you start out solo and select "1 player" and "private" and then later a friend wants to join you, you can change the number to "2 players" and "friends only" and then a couple weeks later when your friend suggests letting random noobs to join so you guys can gank them you can change it to "8 players" and "public". Then when the guilt hits you and your figure your friends is kind of a douchebag for ever suggesting such a slimey plan, you can set it back to 1 player and private.

 

And best of all since they enabled pause for multiplayer you can always pause the game whenever you happen to be alone on the server.

 

Thanks for the answer - the SP -> MP sounds like a good change.

 

-A

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Could we please get a Search-Bar for Chests, that work the same as for Creative Menu and Crafting Menu?

 

 

Would make sorting the fresh loot a lot easier :)

 

Thanks and have a nice Weekend.

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Frankly, I would be ecstatic if they could get it to work like Portal Knights water but if not that then Minecraft water would be just fine especially if they can then add some underwater exploration and threats.

 

Hey Roland, it is not the first time that I see you mentioning Portal Knights. Since it is hard to find any video regarding the matter, can you please tell us a little bit of how water physics functions in that game? Im very curious

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If we have underground water can we have lava too.

 

Pimpos are gonna revisit underground some day in next alphas. And their new policy is talkig about something when they do it playable. Before that we can just speculate and scratch our heads just like monkey do.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

What about horses? :)

 

Wasn`t there a talk earlier in this thread that we talked about horses. With 3 new vehicles..well 2 and a half..a horse is not bad idea at all , but hell if the horses doesnt have armor.

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Wasn`t there a talk earlier in this thread that we talked about horses. With 3 new vehicles..well 2 and a half..a horse is not bad idea at all , but hell if the horses doesnt have armor.

 

I cant remember anyone offical saying that horses are planned. But if the horses are spawned as wild horses no doubt using the new system for guns and cars fitting armour to the horse I dont think would be a problem. lol fuel would be hay or grass fibers.

 

But it is something I would like to see in the game, dont know about training a wild horse however, maybe another skill/perk.

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Hey Roland, it is not the first time that I see you mentioning Portal Knights. Since it is hard to find any video regarding the matter, can you please tell us a little bit of how water physics functions in that game? Im very curious

 

Hi I dont know if it helps but I found a video featuring water for Portal Knights.

 

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The story game is griever safe people. Select “1 player” and your story is your own. There is no need for convoluted safeguards. The most powerful safeguard is your own ability to select.....one.....friggin......player [Wilhelm Scream]!!!

 

Is my mic not on or something?

 

Wait, what happens when people find out that Co-op and PVP mode have been unified to just one mode? There will be pitchforks and tar and feathers.

 

Oh wait, it gets worse: It is possible now to play PVP in single-player. In fact you can't avoid PVP at all. The least you have to do to be safe from grievers is consult a psychiatrist to make sure you don't have a split personality. Even mood swings could be a problem to you now.

 

And wait again, it gets worser than worse: Even a TIME MASCHINE can't help you because nothing changed really. Very appropriate for page 666, really.

 

PS: Diabolic scheme to always stay on page 666. Ask about the release date in every post from now on. Roland will move those posts to somewhere else and we will have a decent forum-cult going.

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Mine craft type water please.

 

0h YeS!!!

 

I have always asked for this as it would be way better than what it is now. (Broken).

 

 

Water plays such a major

Part (could do anyways) in construction and world deformation that to be honest it's been a crime to have ignored it for so long. With the scenery looking so dam good now then you come across water and at the moment. ....... well it looks and behaves like some 8 bit game.

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I had a dream last night where i was stuck in a rust / 7 days / pubg hybrid game, and it was awesome, and it made me realize something that would take this game 10000x over the top. Why cant we push? Push people into zombies, push zombies into traps / out of the way, off roofs, just for fun? it should be done with either empty hands or 2 handers like fire axe / sledgehammer. Just like, right click gives a little shove. Would make it much easier and realistic to escape the horde of zombies if you can shove the first one out of the way and run away screaming.

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Says you. Lets list just a few mechanics to tell a story in a destructible world full of grievers:

 

A) Anywhere in the world you find journals, quest or books telling you anything you need to know. Even though you find such stuff at random, it is for example very easy in principle to make certain that you get these journals, quests or books in the proper sequence if necessary. Or that you get specific papers only when certain preconditions are true. As long as you can scavenge anything, you can follow the story.

 

B) Radio messages could be introduced into the game. As soon as you build a simple transistor receiver (1 electronics, 1 wood, 1 battery) you can listen to whatever is on the waves, story, quests, cries for help, messages from the duke. Radio messages could even tell you where to meet specific NPCs necessary for a quest and should a griever kill him before you are there, the radio tells you where to find his replacement. As long as NPCs can be spawned, a griever can at most delay you for a bit.

 

C) NPCs can spawn as effortlessly as zombies. Don't ask how, but again, there is an endless supply of NPCs, and eventually you will talk to one who will give you information, quests... As long as TFP make sure that those NPCs are replaceable, no griever can really stop you.

 

D) Story-relevant NPCs could be indestructible. Sure, the world is destructible, but the traders are not.

 

E) There is a meta-method: If TFP decides that the story is not griever-safe, they could make story-relevant NPCs killable and declare the problem solved. Either you play cooperatively together with friends or alone and you simply don't kill NPCs that have something important to say. Or you play on a server with grievers and that's your own fault then.

 

Couple of things:

Right now traders are indestructible, but that doesn't mean anything relevant for the future of the game as that might change later and doesn't guarantee that there will be indestructible NPC bases at all which would have to be in game to give a real story a chance. NPCs must live somewhere too, you know? And if you destroy their base, well that's kinda the point where any story that involves their base ends. That's one of the obvious limitations you get for mixing sp and mp together.

 

As for radio messages, hints, notes etc...

 

You would really love the "well received multiplayer" in the No Man's Sky if you think the same concept would work in 7 Days to die with quests. In case you haven't figured out, it was sarcasm. Multiplayer in No Man's Sky practically doesn't exist as the game only gives you hints of where other players were at one point in time of their gameplay and what they did there and that's it. No direct interaction with them, nothing like that. So getting only hints / quests from loot containers is practically nothing new, we already have that in 7 Days to die and this kind of gameplay gets lonely in solo when there's no real interaction with NPC survivors.

 

Even now when playing solo the loot containers respawn loot to simulate that someone was there and left something inside. Perhaps it was one of those thousands zombies that I killed last night? No? Then maybe it was that trader who lives nearby.. oh wait he never moves his ass outside of his base, so it couldn't be him! Then who? That's a million dollar question. Who in the whole lonely procedurally generated world was that if I'm the only freaking survivor who actually moves his ass around the world and I'm pretty sure it wasn't me who left some stuff in that loot container?

 

Should I feel guilty now for that I was always hoping that 7 Days to die will one day evolve into a game where even in singleplayer playing alone you will feel like the world is actually still alive to a certain extent and surviving the apocalypse? Sure there are thousands of zombies trying to eat you, but there should also be many NPC survivors and bandits who actually SHOULD DO something more than just standing in one place all the freaking day.

 

Among the other activities, they should give you quests directly by talking to you, NPC survivors should also help you on your journey like companions / followers known from Skyrim or Fallout. You should be able to take sides, heck you should be able to join NPC factions in their own bases and NPC survivors should help you take down other NPCs like raiders / bandits. In other words the game should give you the impression that in that giant procedurally generated open world filled with brain dead zombies, it's not just you and couple of traders who never really move their ass from their base!

 

7 Days to die is already a good game in its multiplayer aspect, but while singleplayer had a great potential too, it was simply ditched or limited to the same gameplay features already offered by multiplayer. Is that what it ever will be? Won't there be anything more than that for solo play? Well that's a big disappointment then. That's not enough for a good singleplayer experience. You might as well just remove it entirely. But coming to think about it, removing singleplayer option from the menu even before singleplayer portion of the game ever evolved to something bigger is actually already the same like removing it entirely.

 

Sure you can still play solo by "freaking setting the amount of players to 1" as Roland says, but that's not my point. Being alone in an empty giant world tailored strictly for multiplayer isn't the same thing as playing alone in the world filled with NPC survivors that keep you company to make sure you don't feel lonely playing alone!

 

That's why quests should be from "Faction + Title" and not a specific NPC. So, if you get a quest from: "The Ranger's", Leader NPC, if the current leader is killed then another takes his place.

 

What would be interesting is to have them all wiped out and that triggers another quest: "The Angel of Death" - Kill them all! ("Them" could be any number of NPC's) OR "The Rise of the Phoenix!" YOU can be the leader who: makes the Rangers great again!

 

See, MP is no problem to a robust quest system.

 

It is a problem for finishing safely specific quests you personally want to finish. And this has nothing to do with the possibility to set the game to 1 player, obviously the argument is that since it's now going to be just one single environment, developers won't be able to make quests tailored for solo play and therefore you can't expect actual singleplayer story mode.

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