Roland Posted January 3, 2018 Author Share Posted January 3, 2018 The overhaul process (Ranged Weapons): Ranged weapons have always felt wrong to me. The crosshair spread didn't represent the cone of fire and on top of that the FOV/resolution would change accuracy. I implemented the same fire cone code that I put in for the turrets. With that the new events/effects allowed us to set up things like clip size, fire rate, accuracy kickback as well as many other things. You can basically simulate just about any weapon now via xml values. This right here is going to have an enormous effect on the game. When you are low level with a basic gun without any mods the crosshairs area is huge when you are moving. If you stop and aim then it shrinks down to a smaller size depending on the gun and mods/ skills/ perks/ events. Basically, bullets can hit ANYWHERE within the area marked out by the crosshairs so if you are backpedaling and firing, you might have the enemy’s head dead center in the crosshairs but if the hit area created by the points of the crosshairs extend past the head your bullets are as likely to miss as they are to hit. Skills, perks, mods, and events can cause changes to everything about this system from the initial size of the crosshairs to the shape of them as Madmole showed in the last clip to how rapidly they shrink when you aim, etc. The days of running and gunning from the hip before you have developed the right skill set to be able to do so are soon going to be over. Get ready to adapt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sillls Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 This right here is going to have an enormous effect on the game. When you are low level with a basic gun without any mods the crosshairs area is huge when you are moving. If you stop and aim then it shrinks down to a smaller size depending on the gun and mods/ skills/ perks/ events. Basically, bullets can hit ANYWHERE within the area marked out by the crosshairs so if you are backpedaling and firing, you might have the enemy’s head dead center in the crosshairs but if the hit area created by the points of the crosshairs extend past the head your bullets are as likely to miss as they are to hit. Skills, perks, mods, and events can cause changes to everything about this system from the initial size of the crosshairs to the shape of them as Madmole showed in the last clip to how rapidly they shrink when you aim, etc. The days of running and gunning from the hip before you have developed the right skill set to be able to do so are soon going to be over. Get ready to adapt. Oh so that's why your wearing that bandanna. Because your adapting??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maharin Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Oh so that's why your wearing that bandanna. Because your adapting??? It was a requirement for the liability insurance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaVegaNL Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 So, checking in after a few weeks of absence. I see A17 has been in development for 4 months now, and I was wondering what the status is on bandits and a potential AI-improvement? Given that these were apparently the major things in the upcoming Alpha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gronk Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 So, checking in after a few weeks of absence. I see A17 has been in development for 4 months now, and I was wondering what the status is on bandits and a potential AI-improvement? Given that these were apparently the major things in the upcoming Alpha. The only thing we've been told so far is that the animations look a lot better now, they're using the same blend-tree/mecanim system that was demonstrated in Mr Mole's last vid. No news on AI. Nothing, nada, zip, zilch... not even a hint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maharin Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 So, checking in after a few weeks of absence. I see A17 has been in development for 4 months now, and I was wondering what the status is on bandits and a potential AI-improvement? Given that these were apparently the major things in the upcoming Alpha. LazMan just quoted Kinyajuu's post above. There were a lot of underlying systems that had to be reconstructed and now that this is shaping up they can start using it to improve other factors of the system. Their AI system, I'm sure, will be rebuilt to take into account all of the additional information now available. I think it is still a little too early to ask for a status on the roof of the house when the foundation was just poured and is still drying. Or, if you prefer, BANDITS ARE GOING TO BE GREAT!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted January 3, 2018 Author Share Posted January 3, 2018 So, checking in after a few weeks of absence. I see A17 has been in development for 4 months now, and I was wondering what the status is on bandits and a potential AI-improvement? Given that these were apparently the major things in the upcoming Alpha. Right now they are working on animations for bandits. Everything that has been shown for players also applies to bandits. I know someone has been tasked with NPC AI but don’t know the progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pille Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 It's almost like I read the forums regularly. That's very unlikely since I cannot see any mental health issues. I mean, just have a look at Roland... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gronk Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 LazMan just quoted Kinyajuu's post above. There were a lot of underlying systems that had to be reconstructed and now that this is shaping up they can start using it to improve other factors of the system. Their AI system, I'm sure, will be rebuilt to take into account all of the additional information now available. I think it is still a little too early to ask for a status on the roof of the house when the foundation was just poured and is still drying. Or, if you prefer, BANDITS ARE GOING TO BE GREAT!!!! Pathfinding and behavior trees are the foundations of AI. There should be something demonstrable by now if it was being changed. We don't even know _if_ behavior trees are being used never mind what type of tree is being implemented. Most behavior trees can be built at runtime from xml (with a bit of boiler-plate code) and I'm hoping they've opened these up to modders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted January 3, 2018 Author Share Posted January 3, 2018 Oh so that's why your wearing that bandanna. Because your adapting??? That's very unlikely since I cannot see any mental health issues. I mean, just have a look at Roland... Sometimes it takes two independent posts to come to the truth... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gronk Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Right now they are working on animations for bandits. Everything that has been shown for players also applies to bandits. I know someone has been tasked with NPC AI but don’t know the progress. Good to know. Never mind progress, any idea on the systems being implemented? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted January 3, 2018 Author Share Posted January 3, 2018 Good to know. Never mind progress, any idea on the systems being implemented? I just commented on one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meganoth Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Everything that has been shown for players also applies to bandits. So bandits see an XP bar too. I wonder if they will complain as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blighte Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Zombie question I have read how deep A17 is reorganizing the system and it is obviously going to take time, but I was wondering what the plans are for the zombie population. Specifically, are there plans to add more diversity to the zombie population, i.e. more different types in stead of modified existing zombies (like the irradiated versions, feral, etc.)? Don't get me wrong, there are several different zombies available to shoot, but the repetitive appearance does happen quite quickly. So, I was just curious what the plans are to increase the diversity of the zombie targets....err, I mean, populace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maharin Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Pathfinding and behavior trees are the foundations of AI. There should be something demonstrable by now if it was being changed. We don't even know _if_ behavior trees are being used never mind what type of tree is being implemented. Most behavior trees can be built at runtime from xml (with a bit of boiler-plate code) and I'm hoping they've opened these up to modders. Right... most of the new stuff put in could be used in the "behavior trees" or whatever form of decision making code used to drive the AI to make decisions. Remaking the AI before this point would have been pointless assuming they knew they were headed in this direction. Releasing bandits prior to doing all of this work would have been a horrible idea. It's bad enough that the zombies have all the issues they currently have. - - - Updated - - - So bandits see an XP bar too. I wonder if they will complain as well? Zombies and bandits should get experience for doing what they do and level accordingly (that would require them to be persistent once spawned, but still). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gronk Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Right... most of the new stuff put in could be used in the "behavior trees" or whatever form of decision making code used to drive the AI to make decisions. Remaking the AI before this point would have been pointless assuming they knew they were headed in this direction. Releasing bandits prior to doing all of this work would have been a horrible idea. It's bad enough that the zombies have all the issues they currently have. Most of the complaints about Z behavior are due to pathfinding. Things such as Z's spinning below the player, walking exactly on the voxel grid below them and failing to climb a single block causing them to carve paths through the floor. All of these are long-running complaints that have been going for years now. It would have been far easier to sort Z AI first, release it to the public, and fix bugs in the rudimentary behavior before trying to add the complex decision making and teamwork required by bandits. I'm just glad we finally have confirmation that it's being actively worked on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppycur Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Alls I know is that the new system of "don't know what you're doing 'cause you're new with a gun so the spread is big" is waaaaaaaaay better than "you found a brown pistol in the same box a higher level guy would have found a purple one". And I hope that this new system REPLACES the horrible leveled loot system rather than enhance it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted January 3, 2018 Author Share Posted January 3, 2018 So bandits see an XP bar too. I wonder if they will complain as well? They would if their voice over actors had known to do it. Maybe I’ll do a mixtape of my own voice overs bitching about this and that and send it in. If there’s one thing anyone can do without professional acting lessons it’s complaining... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted January 3, 2018 Author Share Posted January 3, 2018 Zombies and bandits should get experience for doing what they do and level accordingly (that would require them to be persistent once spawned, but still). They could apply the experience to the archetype and then all bandits of that type would gain in experience...but I think that is what gamestages is supposed to simulate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat0ut Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 i hate that auto turret sound. I dont understand why it is supposed to sound like pistol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maharin Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 i hate that auto turret sound. I dont understand why it is supposed to sound like pistol They should replace it with the turret sounds from Portal. I'll pitch in for the licensing costs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldranon Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 I hope the bandit AI is not too good: Bandit1: "Boss! The survivor is wearing iron armor and that reduces our gun fire by fifty three percent!" Boss: "All right boys, ROCKET LAUNCHERS READY! In three... two... " I'm not sure if the boss did or did not say "one"... I was running me arse off! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maharin Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Most of the complaints about Z behavior are due to pathfinding. Things such as Z's spinning below the player, walking exactly on the voxel grid below them and failing to climb a single block causing them to carve paths through the floor. All of these are long-running complaints that have been going for years now. It would have been far easier to sort Z AI first, release it to the public, and fix bugs in the rudimentary behavior before trying to add the complex decision making and teamwork required by bandits. I'm just glad we finally have confirmation that it's being actively worked on. While I agree about the path finding being buggy the biggest complaint I have about zombies is when they run. Somehow they get super agile and act like veteran football (American football, that is) players. /boggle As for the AI being actively worked on, I think the point is that they've intentionally delayed active work because they knew they were making huge low-level changes that would nuke any changes they made previously, making it wasted effort. The only reason this delay seems so long is that you are playing an unfinished game. This would never have been an issue for you or anyone else had you waited for release. - - - Updated - - - I hope the bandit AI is not too good: Bandit1: "Boss! The survivor is wearing iron armor and that reduces our gun fire by fifty three percent!" Boss: "All right boys, ROCKET LAUNCHERS READY! In three... two... " I'm not sure if the boss did or did not say "one"... I was running me arse off! Bandits with sniper rifles is a scary thought. BOOM! Head shot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gronk Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 While I agree about the path finding being buggy the biggest complaint I have about zombies is when they run. Somehow they get super agile and act like veteran football (American football, that is) players. /boggle As for the AI being actively worked on, I think the point is that they've intentionally delayed active work because they knew they were making huge low-level changes that would nuke any changes they made previously, making it wasted effort. The only reason this delay seems so long is that you are playing an unfinished game. This would never have been an issue for you or anyone else had you waited for release. - - - Updated - - - Bandits with sniper rifles is a scary thought. BOOM! Head shot! If I'm honest? I think the reason it hasn't been worked on is that the entire subject is frikkin' difficult and nobody wanted to do it. An attitude I can fully understand. That sounds like a great idea as long as someone else is writing the code :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppycur Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 While I agree about the path finding being buggy the biggest complaint I have about zombies is when they run. Somehow they get super agile and act like veteran football (American football, that is) players. /boggle Glad you clarified, 'cause I don't see any of them falling all the time, pretending to groan in pain, and a bunch of yellow flags being thrown on the field to stop the clock. =) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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