Roland Posted November 18, 2017 Author Share Posted November 18, 2017 Clear what is intended here. No one ever said the old system was better. You're the only one trying to equate the natural ability to simply think for a second and determine if you are hungry with a magical GPS system that identifies friend/foe player/zombie/animal through wall moving or not. You are the one insisting those 2 are the same. Please let me know since you have the ability to think and determine if you are hungry, how is your magical GPS ability that lets you see things through walls and know if they are friend/foe (or are they not equivalent)? I really was done but since you asked..... I'm not equating the two. I'm drawing a parallel between them. I'll spell it out for you so you don't have an aneurysm trying to come to terms with how I could possible think the two are exactly the same. Short answer: I don't How the minimap and the food bar were different 1) The things you specified. I agree completely with the contrasts you drew. 2) Minimap was round. The food bar was rectangular 3) Minimap couldn't be modded back in. The food bar could. 4) You hated the minimap and modded it out. You loved the food bar and modded it in. How the minimap and the food bar were similar 1) Both were intended to compensate for or represent senses we have in the real world that don't translate well to a video game 2) Both were too much assistance. The minimap was WAY too much and the food bar just too much. 3) Both had proponents that disagreed with their removals and gave exactly the same arguments for why they shouldn't be removed. 4) Both resulted in players "playing the indicator" instead of "playing the game" 5) The game got better after both were removed. (Sorry, couldn't resist ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerfly Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Roland, you .. you piece of sanity Thank you for your effords to keep this thread up. Remember this track ? ? For all good old players and memories we had while this was the intro music of this game. P.S. Focus, HUD horde is still around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Necrophobic Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 https://twitter.com/7DaystoDie NOV 15 - "Tune in tomorrow for a preview of the new doe, stag and some other stuff!" So wheres the Video? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParaSyt Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Power Moves for Melee Combat: Mentioned by Madmole as part of the motion capture video. No details or video of it other than that. Weapon Overhaul: Talked about by Madmole here and there. Nothing visible shown yet. Replace Gun Parts With Attachable Modifications: Mentioned as part of the weapon overhaul. No specifics yet. HUD: Shown in the last video and seemingly contradictory to past statements by Madmole so.....drama. Since they were on that list I thought it was more than a mention. Hopefully we get to see some more deets on these soon. If something comes out in the next week, I will seriously say it is the thing I am most thankful for during turkey dinner next week with family. That will keep them from talking to me for another year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacoviz Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 https://twitter.com/7DaystoDie NOV 15 - "Tune in tomorrow for a preview of the new doe, stag and some other stuff!" So wheres the Video? Yes where is the video? He lie to us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerfly Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Video will show up when it`s ready. Maybe they wanna add more , or fix something. Noone like to be pushed. Stay around and we`ll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacoviz Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Video will show up when it`s ready. Maybe they wanna add more , or fix something. Noone like to be pushed. Stay around and we`ll see. Lyer lyer lyer !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odetta Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Lyer lyer lyer !!! Plants for hire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerfly Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Lyer lyer lyer !!! Wish I was Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacoviz Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Wish I was Sorry, Madmole video are like Christmas day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royal Deluxe Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 so long watch this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toores Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 You are giving me a whole lot of little technicalities, almost as if you didn't want to understand my point behind it. This isn't my argument for not having the food bar. This is my argument for why removing everything and playing with invisible HUD is so awesome. On the issue of popups, however, which one is it? Are they too distracting or too unnoticeable? Seems pro food bar people will say whatever they want. If the pop ups are more distracting then why are you missing the notification? As i said in the text you quoted, it's information at a time i don't look for it. That popup is just noise because i didn't want that information at that moment. Lets say i'm fighting a zombie horde and fullenss 50% pops up, i don't see it because i'm looking at the zombies i'm fighting. So, according to your logic, somehow my stomach f-ed up and in the midst of the adrenaline rush, when i shouldn't feel hunger at all, it told me i should start thinking about food soon. Bottom line - essential survival information is't clutter. Random popup that i have to catch at precise moment the game chooses is useless. It isn't players neglect. Let me clarify. You are correct that eating for the purpose of finding out if you are hungry is backwards and not intuitive. My point has always been that you are not actually starving until you are at 0%. There are zero penalties for any percentage of fullness and if you overeat you get the extra even though it the popup will only show 100% as the max. So if you think about it (as you would in real life) and wonder if you could eat something and you know its been at least a few hours since the last time you ate then the answer is that you can go ahead and eat and you don't have to check a bar for permission. I agree that 11% is a critical stat for needing to eat and its also literally only a few seconds away from the permanent indicator of 10% that will count down to 0% for you. The only time when eating at 11% vs eating at 10% is going to be a matter of life or death is.....never. So I'm not really saying to eat in order to know-- I'm saying that you can eat pretty much any time you are worried about it and want to check because from 11% to 99% the feeling of "I could probably eat something..." is the same. I actually thought about bringing time into consideration in my earlier post. Few hours translates to few minutes in a game and the food quantities hardly translate to something that is easily comparable to real life. Simply put, the the passing of time (which is changeable btw) and food consumption amount is so distorted that you can't rely on it. Thus the need for the bar. 11% being seconds away... well 12% will be twice as many seconds and 24% would be 14x as many seconds away. It is actually possible to run and swim out 14% and then discover i have only 10% worth time to get back. In real life i would never venture out so far that i have fear of hurting myself due to hunger. So i think about my fullness and assess if i need to run back to base and eat first. And when my stomach decides it's not time for a magic fullness update at this precise moment, i open up the menu and look. Guess what, it blocks more screen the a little bar at the bottom left would. No. It's more like that at 100% you can't eat another bite. From 11% - 99% you are satisfied and not really hungry at all but you also aren't full and you could eat something if you wanted to but its not really necessary. In other words, I don't really even think the pop ups at 75%, 50%, or 25% are even necessary. All you need is the tummy rumbling and and the permanent 10% icon. The other popups are just twinges. You can certainly think about whether you are wanting to eat something more often than those notifications and when you think about it you can eat instead of going to the character screen. The first sentence i just don't get at all. All in all though, 10% only indication would be just nonsense. I think i already said that i might not have food with me all the time to "test" my hunger level. And as i said in the "time section", since time and food amount don't transfer well to real life situations, it is unreliable for survival situations. I can't train my physical body to artificially feel that in so many game hours i will need to think about hunger. It is very possible to be so immersed in something that i don't think about food at all until something tells me to. 10% is way too late to bring up something i would have known long ago. IN A SURVIVAL GAME. Tummy rumbling is similar to the popup thing, it's great when you hear it. If you don't, i guess you are just unable to feel hunger. Better not be driving your minibike. The personal example was simply to show that in real life you can often not feel hungry when you are. People who say that they are always aware of how full or how hungry they would be in the environment depicted in the game are simply wrong. They would not. Three days of real life loss of appetite has nothing to do with proving a need for a bar. Your admitted profound unawareness when playing the game is actually the proof that perhaps you personally do need the crutch of an always visible bar although from your own description maybe you also need that bar to pulsate..... I don't need it or want it. At the moment it's other other way around in the game. You ONLY can feel you are hungry 3 brief moments (at 75, 50 and 25) before being critically low. With visible hunger bar you would not be aware of the hunger until you looked at it - which would simulate thinking about it, even maybe counting the hours so to speak... Three days in real life is a perfect example of having much bigger buffer before suffering such hard consequences. These are the same arguments that came up when the minimap was removed. "The game will suffer." "The map simulates our ability to be aware of our surroundings in a way that isn't possible in a first person perspective video game" "People will die having to go to a different screen to check their map and that is bad design" But the result is that it was great design and people got used to it. The only difference here is that most of the people who complain are those who never got used to it because they immediately modded bar back in. I played this game for almost 1000 hours while it had the food and water bars and I never looked back after they were removed. I like it a lot better without the bars. But I realize that its just my preference and I'm not against playing a modded game so if they put the bars back in I'll be fine. Hunger, thirst and feels like temperature are so very basic things. They are inherently felt. It is not comparable to minimap that tells you where zombies are around you (although when zombies had no proper sound, it had its place). Looking at the map is the same as in real life. You look at something, it takes your attention. Feeling cold does not require to cripple your seeing ability. NOT COMPARABLE. I don't remember exactly but i have played the game more then 1200 hours and i've never used mods before A16. I always play vanilla first to get to understand the changes TFP have made. I'm actually on my first modded game ever on 7days, and yes you guessed it, it's a UI mod. It seemed appropriate since after removing the hunger and thirst bar from the UI i started to visit my character page too often. It's been this way quite long already. At first i actually thought i'd wait til gold before using mods... oh well. I really don't get why not give an option for this incredibly simple thing. Please, Roland, if you argue anything, explain me why this basic UI option is a bad thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almightypmj Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Yes where is the video? He lie to us Here's your video of the new stag. That mocap is amazing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted November 18, 2017 Author Share Posted November 18, 2017 I really don't get why not give an option for this incredibly simple thing. Please, Roland, if you argue anything, explain me why this basic UI option is a bad thing. I've given my statement on this several times already. Click on my name and go look at my last several recent posts if you want to read my answer to this. If you haven't heard me or understood my point of view by now it just isn't worth it to repeat myself. We can agree to disagree. We see it differently and that is all there is to it. Probably stems from this.... It seemed appropriate since after removing the hunger and thirst bar from the UI i started to visit my character page too often. See, the thing is, I never feel the need to ever visit my character page and check my status bars even when I mod my HUD to make everything invisible. We are just wired differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stonx Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Make tin cans have a brass forge weight of around 10. Its not a freebee as tin cans are already valuable now in making oil. But you can always loot cans off of Zombies given a strong reason to take on hordes with a melee weapon or x-bow. But you can also loot bullet casings, brass trophies and brass candlesticks directly from zombies which are a renewable supply even with no loot respawn. The brass sources also commonly show up in garbage piles, bins, dumpsters etc. In every 7dtd game I have played in my 1800 hours or so hours my bottleneck to bullet production is always gunpowder (specifically potassium nitrate) and never brass. I always have thousands of surplus brass compared with gunpowder. - - - Updated - - - I've given my statement on this several times already. Click on my name and go look at my last several recent posts if you want to read my answer to this. If you haven't heard me or understood my point of view by now it just isn't worth it to repeat myself. We can agree to disagree. We see it differently and that is all there is to it. Probably stems from this.... See, the thing is, I never feel the need to ever visit my character page and check my status bars even when I mod my HUD to make everything invisible. We are just wired differently. Yes, so have food and water bars selectable as an option and everyone is happy. Well, everyone that is apart from the control freaks that want to force everyone to play as they do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arma Rex Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 But you can also loot bullet casings, brass trophies and brass candlesticks directly from zombies which are a renewable supply even with no loot respawn. The brass sources also commonly show up in garbage piles, bins, dumpsters etc. In every 7dtd game I have played in my 1800 hours or so hours my bottleneck to bullet production is always gunpowder (specifically potassium nitrate) and never brass. I always have thousands of surplus brass compared with gunpowder. - - - Updated - - - Yes, so have food and water bars selectable as an option and everyone is happy. Well, everyone that is apart from the control freaks that want to force everyone to play as they do. I think that's a great idea. I really just don't like the idea of being forced to have a hunger bar and hydration bar. P.S. Nice profile pic - - - Updated - - - so long watch this What's up with that pain sound lol... It's sounds suggestive... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arma Rex Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Roland, you .. you piece of sanity Thank you for your effords to keep this thread up. Remember this track ? ? For all good old players and memories we had while this was the intro music of this game. P.S. Focus, HUD horde is still around. Holy moley... that was 7d2d's original theme? We need it back! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacoviz Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 So sad that we haven't received our video Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalex Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Roland, you .. you piece of sanity Thank you for your effords to keep this thread up. Remember this track ? ? For all good old players and memories we had while this was the intro music of this game. P.S. Focus, HUD horde is still around. Isn't that the one where the song author kept slapping the Let's Play Youtubers with DCMA notices? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenixshade35 Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 I have been thinking about a few things and from some of the other games I have played, I think some could come as a solution for some or a hindrance for others, allow me to say... 1. Backpack Size - There was a heated debate about backpack size and from playing a survival game called Fragmented I do have a type of solution, in that game when you unlocked the ability to make pouches in your inventory they took up 4 squares and when opened gave a varied amount of space, one pouch i found took up 4 squares and gave you 10 extra, sounds like a decent trade off, another game I played with a useful thing we could add is Miscreated, in that depending on the clothing you had on you would add a certain number of slots to fill, so jeans gave 4 slots and cargo shorts gave 6 slots, food for thought. 2. HUD Displays - I always wanted to play with the hunger and hydration on screen, and maybe we could make it a trigger to like F3 almost like the FPS on F8, so people could play with or without it? 3. Separate Bullet Casings - Honestly im all for it, would make looting more of a pain but that is why we scrap and have a forge, maybe the addition of a munitions workbench could be seen down the road as something else to add to our bases? 4. Traps - I have read some and thought of others and im hoping to see, Spring Spike Traps - spikes shoot out from a direction when triggered, Spear Launcher - Same idea as dart trap but you load it with wood spikes, Shrapnel Mine - No need to explain and its not like we dont find scrap metal everywhere in the game. 5. Rain Catcher - Why not let us build one of these and have it require like 10 Cloth, 5 Leather, 5 Short Iron Pipes, Brass or Steel Faucet, then we put the empty jars into it and it fills them over time? Those are all I have for right now, im sure when the slots change for the guns and bikes that we can mod clothes in game with extra pockets and stuff but these are my ideas, I hope some of them sound good to everyone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldranon Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Everyone take a break for a sec and check this article out, had me dying! http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5093015/Hilarious-T-shirts-mangled-English-language.html LOL. Almost knowing English can be very funny! My wife always wonders if people (here in Russia) actually KNOW what their T-shirt says. With some, I'd say no. I have a Putin T-shirt that I think says "Don't mess with me", but for all I know could say "I messed myself". Its like being almost sure you are right in a topic, when, maybe not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sillls Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Well I think we warn Roland out on that topic. For a moment I thought that Roland WAS the Forum. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tilleen Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Yes where is the video? He lie to us There is a difference between lying and being wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerfly Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Holy moley... that was 7d2d's original theme? We need it back! Ya, it was really good, indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arma Rex Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Ya, it was really good, indeed. What happened to it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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