Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

[HerrKingsley]

OK I think i've got it. ...snip 4 space.

 

Both of this examples was terrible design ideas from the beginning.

(Not yours, but in a16)

 

IRL if you build a tool the most experience of quality you will get is by USING it. That's basically how every design process Is done!

So xp by using.

 

For the cactus example, Armor should be based on melee kills. Bc you have engaged in combat and won therefore you gain experience in melee and armor. Simple as that.

 

But the Learning-by-doing is as they say a dead horse.

 

 

[Royal Deluxe]

Yah, some players like playing the game, others like having played the game and enjoying an A16-style power fantasy.

Neither is bad but the 2nd group still has the option of giveselfxp while balancing has to concentrate on the 1st group.

 

I really guess my longer time away from the forum somthing must happened.

Anyone memorys about alien abductions ?

 

 

I really would like to play the game immersive without need to powerlevel to leave the valey of pain.

Sadly you are soo busy making everything painfull that you dont even see what you do there.

 

If i could play the game as a Lvl 1 player i would not even care if i level up. But thats impossible, the startchar is so severely disabled that if it would be a horse i wuld give him a coup de grâce.

[Ricowan]

To all of the "must have learn by doing" people, please name one popular multi-player game that has this kind of system.

 

The only game that I'm aware of that comes close is Wurm Online, and it's nowhere near being popular from a player count perspective. [Edit: And the leveling in WO completely sucks and isn't fun at all!]

 

Maybe the reason it hasn't been done well is that it can't be? There are aspects of game play that can be fun and realistic at the same time, but a leveling system isn't one of them.

 

The objective of a game is to be fun. Period. If it's only fun to 100 people, it's not a successful game with a potential target audience of hundreds of thousands.

[Royal Deluxe]

To all of the "must have learn by doing" people, please name one popular multi-player game that has this kind of system.

Scum

[Menace312]

heh heh fairly close actually. The trick of it is to _slowly_ heat the egg up.

 

Other hillbilly method is to 'stone soup' it. Water in a can, add hot rocks to boil the water, add egg.

 

But for some really good campfire cooking I wish they'd add in Heavy Duty Foil. The old, make a 'boat', fill w meat, veggies, spices, bury in embers for ~20 minutes. Don't know why, maybe no dish washing required, but I still routinely do that on trips

 

Uh, watch out for treehuggers! I bet that thick foil type, is worse for nature than the normal kind...

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

Scum

 

Empyrion.

[Gareee]

We are up to 35 on our mp server, and progression is pretty much fi. The only real issue I'm seeing is the mp gamestage multiplier putting us at a higher gamestage than we are ready for. We are getting quite a number of day ferals and irradiated, and are still mostly using melee and iron arrows. (We are usually saving ammo for horde nights, and jUST found a tool n die set on day 34.)

 

As far as kind of stupid questions about fixing rgw creation and having to recreate a new world, how could they fix the creation and you NOT using it to create a fixed world? If they change RGW creation, you HAVE to use it to make the improved world, period.

 

The zombie loot drops though DO need to be improved. If the percent is so low, they NEED to stay around longer so the player can get that rare reward, and the loot inside it should NOT be crap like a glass of water... it should be something significantly beneficial to the player, like a higher tier weapon or tool, a higher tier armor, or a mod. (Schematics are great later game, but are worthless if you are 20 game days from being able to utilize them.)

 

That loot quality can be tied to gamestages.. a level 1 iron pickaxe would be a great loot drop early game, but suck on day 30.

 

 

Getting on loot bag after a day 28 horde night though with a single jar of water is a bad joke.

 

The air drops need to be tweaked.. typically they have 6 cans of assorted food (Only a few can be used for higher tier recipes, and the rest just pile up unused because we are out hunting and farming) and maybe one weapon with a tiny amount of ammo for it. (a tier 2 shotgun and 3 shells were in the drop after day 28)

 

At our level the airdrops are almost pointless to bother with, because they are mostly just canned junk.

[Lonestarcanuck]

does the perk "The Huntsman" also apply to FireAxe? it does state bladed weapons/tools

[Snollygoster]

Will saves be wiped after new updates again? or can we start playing without that threat?

[Lonestarcanuck]

Lets talk about Loot tables...

 

in B240 I have noticed the quantity/quality of loot is down a noticeable amount and clearing a building to get to the loot room and you just took down 20 zombies including radiated cops/wights to get to it only to find crap loot is just wrong. a "BOSS" or well protected loot room should have better loot tables.

[FileMachete]

does the perk "The Huntsman" also apply to FireAxe? it does state bladed weapons/tools

 

Not from what I see in items.xml Lonestar ;

 

<item name="meleeToolFireaxeIron">

<property name="Tags" value="knife,melee,medium,tool,perkDeepCuts,perkMotherLode"/>

---compared to---

<item name="meleeToolMachete">

<property name="Tags" value="knife,melee,light,weapon,meleeWeapon,perkDeepCuts,perkTheHuntsman"/>

[thepcwiz101]

Lets talk about Loot tables...

 

in B240 I have noticed the quantity/quality of loot is down a noticeable amount and clearing a building to get to the loot room and you just took down 20 zombies including radiated cops/wights to get to it only to find crap loot is just wrong. a "BOSS" or well protected loot room should have better loot tables.

 

mods in the future will fix this unless the devs make changes.

[Omega-Factor]

 

"weathersurvival off" does not seem to be working in debug mode...

 

Is this yet another attempt to force players to accept the "challenge", or simply a bug?

 

The mechanic is still broken and unfun, which is ironic because games are supposed to be fun, last time I checked. It's even in the devs name... And having to change clothes every 5 minutes is not challenging, it is annoying.

[FileMachete]

I gotta agree w both Gareee & Lonestarcanuck; early game loot is pretty disappointing.

 

Gamestage modifiers could really help. I know I'd -much- rather see a couple of Medicated Bandages in a zombie loot bag than the 2 pieces of Wood & an Empty Jar I got in one recently (day 10ish?).

 

There's a number of items that are really helpful/useful in early game that later on will become 'junk'; Clothing. Cooking Pot. Medicated Bandage. Claw Hammer. garden Hoe. 3-5 Cans -of-the-same-type!-of Food. As Gareee said, a t1 Iron Pickaxe would be mana from heaven.

 

Side note: storage space is killing you early game; it's just mean to fill an airdrop w 8 cans of food, and have all of them be different, taking up 8 slots.

[FileMachete]

 

"weathersurvival off" does not seem to be working in debug mode...

 

Is this yet another attempt to force players to accept the "challenge", or simply a bug?

 

The mechanic is still broken and unfun, which is ironic because games are supposed to be fun, last time I checked. It's even in the devs name... And having to change clothes every 5 minutes is not challenging, it is annoying.

 

I hear ya Omega. With the Yucca Juice Cooling Effect missing from the xml, the being 'wet' cooling effect not working & 'sheltered' check not appreantly working when underground, I can't seem to live in the desert without multiple levels of that perk that adds hyper/hypo points. Even w a leather trench cost, tank top & skirt, no armor.

 

If you feel like there's a magic poncho under the dev blocks that's worth +/-100 temp points.

[bluepharoh]

This forum has become the most depressing place on the internet with so much crying and whining about an Alpha that clearly needs and will be tweaked over the coming weeks. As some will proclaim, they've had it with TFP and will cease playing or go give a pathetic review on steam. I will do the opposite and cease reading the forum for a while because it seems hardly anything productive is truly accomplished here. I for one am glad to see Alpha 16 gone as it was my second least played alpha since Alpha 13. Why do we need to go back to it? Alpha 16 bored me to tears.

 

Everyone plays this game their own way, I truly doubt you can find some one who plays exactly the way you do. So, this is what makes balancing so tricky. How do you make a game play for player A and not ruin the experience for player B - Z? How does whining the developer into the ground to make your way of playing the priority help the process. I disagree with a lot of what is being posted here lately, but at least those that do it constructively and describe the reasons why they don't like some of the changes can be something that helps development and further discussion.

 

Anyway, I'm just frustrated with the tone lately and I'm just venting. As I wait for the next couple of patches and see how things get ironed out, I will continue to play Alpha 17 with creative mode enabled. This way I can explore and understand the new mechanics that I have found both refreshing and a step in the direction I would like to see this game continue down. Being called a fanboy and all, I do respect other players passion and wish to have the game play more in their direction, but the direction of the vocal minority isn't necessary the best for the overall experience of the game.

 

I have enjoyed the journey to this point with a lot of great memories of alphas past, but the look, feel and potential of this latest version has me excited for the future. Give the developers a little time to hash out their vision of the game before you get on your war wagons and try to burn the place to the ground, please and thank you.

[Royal Deluxe]

Lets talk about Loot tables...

 

in B240 I have noticed the quantity/quality of loot is down a noticeable amount and clearing a building to get to the loot room and you just took down 20 zombies including radiated cops/wights to get to it only to find crap loot is just wrong. a "BOSS" or well protected loot room should have better loot tables.

 

Looting is only for the first 20 days, after that it cost more than you can get and you need anyway nothing you could find. Maybe except the 1-2 mods you still not have.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

 

"weathersurvival off" does not seem to be working in debug mode...

 

Is this yet another attempt to force players to accept the "challenge", or simply a bug?

 

The mechanic is still broken and unfun, which is ironic because games are supposed to be fun, last time I checked. It's even in the devs name... And having to change clothes every 5 minutes is not challenging, it is annoying.

 

If you do it right you only need to switch clothes in midgame, and then only max 2 parts

[Omega-Factor]

I hear ya Omega. With the Yucca Juice Cooling Effect missing from the xml, the being 'wet' cooling effect not working & 'sheltered' check not appreantly working when underground, I can't seem to live in the desert without multiple levels of that perk that adds hyper/hypo points. Even w a leather trench cost, tank top & skirt, no armor.

 

If you feel like there's a magic poncho under the dev blocks that's worth +/-100 temp points.

 

Ain't it funny how a mechanic that's been in the game for 2 or 3 alpha's is still broken? I don't remember players complaining about being "too comfortable" and "not annoyed enough" back in Alpha 11. Why was it even introduced in the first place?

 

Smell was a better mechanic and actually worked (until they broke it and apparently gave up on it)

 

[Omega-Factor]

Looting is only for the first 20 days, after that it cost more than you can get and you need anyway nothing you could find. Maybe except the 1-2 mods you still not have.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

 

 

If you do it right you only need to switch clothes in midgame, and then only max 2 parts

 

Put down the crack pipe, son.

 

What do you mean "midgame"? I was overheating on day 2 wearing one layer of clothing...

[Tin]

Not worried about the weather. Just looking at the buff.xml alone, it still has quite a bit of stuff that still needs to be hooked up, so they can use it. Among quite a few other things.

onSelfItemCrafted, //Hook Up
onSelfItemRepaired, //Hook Up
onSelfItemLooted, //Hook Up
onSelfItemLost, //Hook Up
onSelfItemGained, //Hook Up
onSelfItemSold, //Hook Up
onSelfItemBought, //Hook Up

//onSelfDiscoveredPOI, //Hook Up
//onSelfDiscoveredArea, //Hook Up

//onSelfEnteredPOI, //Hook Up
//onSelfExitedPOI, //Hook Up

//onSelfEnteredArea, //Hook Up
//onSelfExitedArea, //Hook Up

onSelfEnteredBiome

onSelfLootContainer
onSelfOpenLootContainer

//onQuestStart, //Hook Up
//onQuestLocationReached, //Hook Up
//onQuestLocationLeft, //Hook Up
//onQuestCompleted, //Hook Up
//onQuestFailed, //Hook Up

//onGameBloodmoonStart, //Hook Up
//onGameBloodmoonEnd, //Hook Up
//onGameDayStart, //Hook Up
//onGameNightStart, //Hook Up
//onGameRainStart, //Hook Up
//onGameRainEnd, //Hook Up
//onGameSnowStart, //Hook Up
//onGameSnowEnd, //Hook Up
//onGameFogStart, //Hook Up
//onGameFogEnd, //Hook Up

[FileMachete]

To be fair to TFPs, Gazz did say he "fixed it" when the missing Yucca Juice Cooling Effect was mentioned. (he -didn't- say/show how, grrr)

The being 'Wet' buff/effect used to work, so I'll assume it'll work again.

 

And it does seem like the leather trench coats are more common now? Could just be RNG/Murphy teasing me though...

[Omega-Factor]

Not worried about the weather. Just looking at the buff.xml alone, it still has quite a bit of stuff that still needs to be hooked up, so they can use it. Among quite a few other things.

onSelfItemCrafted, //Hook Up
onSelfItemRepaired, //Hook Up
onSelfItemLooted, //Hook Up
onSelfItemLost, //Hook Up
onSelfItemGained, //Hook Up
onSelfItemSold, //Hook Up
onSelfItemBought, //Hook Up

//onSelfDiscoveredPOI, //Hook Up
//onSelfDiscoveredArea, //Hook Up

//onSelfEnteredPOI, //Hook Up
//onSelfExitedPOI, //Hook Up

//onSelfEnteredArea, //Hook Up
//onSelfExitedArea, //Hook Up

onSelfEnteredBiome

onSelfLootContainer
onSelfOpenLootContainer

//onQuestStart, //Hook Up
//onQuestLocationReached, //Hook Up
//onQuestLocationLeft, //Hook Up
//onQuestCompleted, //Hook Up
//onQuestFailed, //Hook Up

//onGameBloodmoonStart, //Hook Up
//onGameBloodmoonEnd, //Hook Up
//onGameDayStart, //Hook Up
//onGameNightStart, //Hook Up
//onGameRainStart, //Hook Up
//onGameRainEnd, //Hook Up
//onGameSnowStart, //Hook Up
//onGameSnowEnd, //Hook Up
//onGameFogStart, //Hook Up
//onGameFogEnd, //Hook Up

 

Oh yeah! Look at all the other ways they could make it even more annoying

[Lonestarcanuck]

Not from what I see in items.xml Lonestar ;

 

<item name="meleeToolFireaxeIron">

<property name="Tags" value="knife,melee,medium,tool,perkDeepCuts,perkMotherLode"/>

---compared to---

<item name="meleeToolMachete">

<property name="Tags" value="knife,melee,light,weapon,meleeWeapon,perkDeepCuts,perkTheHuntsman"/>

 

so the description is not accurate it states any bladed item.

 

***************************************

 

(edit added comment by QA Tester-unholyjoe)

 

verified and reported

 

thanks

 

***************************************

[HungryZombie]

Lets talk about Loot tables...

 

in B240 I have noticed the quantity/quality of loot is down a noticeable amount and clearing a building to get to the loot room and you just took down 20 zombies including radiated cops/wights to get to it only to find crap loot is just wrong. a "BOSS" or well protected loot room should have better loot tables.

 

I'm pretty sure from the game developers perspective loot will be better at some point. I've heard them talk about legendary type loots and other things. I can't believe that the loot tables are final by any means.

[Cotabucky]

You might be onto something there. Would definitely give the tower defense aspect part of the game more focus. Would need to figure out how the player factors in though. For example, if you try to lead a horde away from your land claim, do they lose interest and retargeting your claim block instead? What consequences are there to losing your claim block? Etc.

 

Also need to balance everything with multiplayer....*headache*

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

 

 

Hahaha...mental images be gone!!!!

 

I think it would be simple like if you go out of your landclaim area they attack the base structures and storage(and ultimately the land claim) .If you go into a landclaim area they attack players. I think this could be fun and simple even for MP like the 7 day hordes are tied to each player. If everybody lives in the same area there are that many more zombies that spawn to wreck ♥♥♥♥. If one players dead and claim destroyed the zombies could go after the next closest one. I feel this would make an amazing 7 day horde event and true tower defense. No running and hiding on horde night unless you don't care about all your supplies getting destroyed along with leaving your friends to die against that many more zombies .

[DaVegaNL]

Sure thing Gazz. Pausing and waiting for stamina is a great game experiance.

Maybe you could prolong all loot timers to 30sec and add a 30sec animation when reloading the bow as well.

Oh and dont forget to make aiming almost impossible so it will take at least 5 min to kill a zombie.

That way we can really enjoy "playing" the game

 

Dramatic much?

 

I never have problems with my stamina. Don't know what you're doing, but you're probably doing it wrong