Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

[Kam R.]

Already asked in the "how do you like A17e?"-thread, but maybe a dev spots this here:

 

Alpha 17 – The alpha of everything being slowed down in some way...even in creative mode?

 

What's up with the super slow fly speed and also that weird jittering and wobbling of the vision when strafing in fly mode?

Assume this is on the low end of priorities, but what are the chances to get a more comfortable god/fly mode?

[FileMachete]

Yup, one tap goes to forged iron. I think, however, it cost slightly more than crating one out of the forge. Although the slightly more cost is definitely worth the absurd amount of time it takes to craft them lol.

 

hmm... I thought the 'iron' cost was the same either way? but either way, man I love those things!

 

I've got three more on my Christmas Wishlist

 

1) Murder Holes: ideally both a 'Bars' kind and a Flagstone half-height or plate. Something to drop Molotovs through but you couldn't fall through.

2) Retractable Stairs/Ladder: like the flimsy attic stairs or a fire escape ladder. Useful to retreat higher up in your base if there's a breach. Edit: and pull it up behind you

3) Roll-down Security Shutters: rolled up they'd be basically like the Poles, then close or un-roll and fully cover the block/s. Orignally was thinking of them as a last line of defense for spots you might build to melee through, so when it's get outa dodge time you'd slam em down and have a few seconds before z's broke through them.

 

I know, asking a lot but 'tis the Season right? & a man can dream

[Jugginator]

Agreed on them - especially murder holes. Even hatches are dangerous to try to throw a moly down through (if it even works, I tried like twice and burned myself both times). We have arrow slits and bars, but nothing to drop grenades down into lol. Like I said, I'm not sure if they cost differently but I think they do.

[meganoth]

I feel like they are trying to force MP servers to be restricted to only 8 players. (even tho the game is way more fun with 15+)

 

Sure, they deliberately made their game slow because it is super important to make you suffer. That you are paranoid doesn't mean they aren't after you, right?

 

If you do not clear the entire building then as soon as you are more than 30m away for more than 60 seconds they will respawn. You have to clear it ALL for the days long respawn timer to be a thing, otherwise it's almost instant.

.

 

Fataal told it differently. If you go more than 30 meters away, any awakened zombies will despawn and if you come back a minute later the sleepers might be at different locations than the first time. But the number of zombies will not increase again.

 

So if 10 zombies are in the house and you shoot 4, when you return there will only be 6, but possible even in locations you already cleared.

[worf3k]

what fataal told you is correct that is supposed to happen but doesn't always. i had it double the amount of zombies once and only once so i never bother to post it but next time it happens i will.

[faatal]

Is there a trick to placing bicycles the first time? I can't find any place for it to go green and I'm not sure if there's a trick I'm missing or if I've found a bug to report.

 

I think it is placing them too low, so it needs very flat ground. On my TODO list. Hopefully moving it up will make it easier.

[archergod]

I think it is placing them to low, so it needs very flat ground. On my TODO list. Hopefully moving it up will make it easier.

 

The problem is not with bicycle only. I was placing my motorcycle. It didn't allow me to place on Road, then I move a bit and then it place it exactly where I was intend to put it before. So same block that disable it at first allow it maybe from different angle on those very blocks.

[faatal]

If you do not clear the entire building then as soon as you are more than 30m away for more than 60 seconds they will respawn. You have to clear it ALL for the days long respawn timer to be a thing, otherwise it's almost instant.

 

Not exactly.

 

Every sleeper volume has a count. Killing zombies from that volume reduces the count. Leaving for 60 seconds does not respawn them, it despawns them. Returning to the volume respawns the current count amount of zombies, not all of them.

[faatal]

Hi yes I was inside of a house fighting zombies and it broke a door, ran down some stairs and ran up through the basement. Wolves are not that smart. Also how did it spot me? Because a zombie woke up it sent the wolf a text? If I'm outside in the forest it's one thing, but I am in a house with fully formed walls.

 

AI only spots you by sight and sound. If you were fighting zombies, then you were making sounds.

[ZehMatt]

Not exactly.

 

Every sleeper volume has a count. Killing zombies from that volume reduces the count. Leaving for 60 seconds does not respawn them, it despawns them. Returning to the volume respawns the current count amount of zombies, not all of them.

 

So how come I get zombie spawns directly infront/behind me, even tho the house is supposed to cleared? This frankly happens quite often.

[faatal]

So how come I get zombie spawns directly infront/behind me, even tho the house is supposed to cleared? This frankly happens quite often.

 

Friday, I had a zombie break through a wall from a hidden room, that I could not see in the house, since the room had no doors. You might think a house is cleared, but that does not mean it is. Spawn points are often in drop ceilings or closets.

 

In SP or MP host, you can walk into a POI, open the console and see messages for each zombie that spawned from a sleeper volume. If it says Restoring, then that was a zombie that was there from a previous visit, that was not killed.

 

Are you playing SP or MP? If MP and you are not the server, then what ping do you have?

[Kalex]

yup i dont understand why the silenced pistol still make noise and attract Z'S , i will understand the screamer coz she is attracted to the heat any ways LOL

 

Because real guns fired with suppressors (which is the proper name, not silencers) *still* make noise. Don't believe the Hollywood BS you see/hear in movies and TV, it is vastly different from reality.

[Diskans]

will the update be today ?

[ZehMatt]

Friday, I had a zombie break through a wall from a hidden room, that I could not see in the house, since the room had no doors. You might think a house is cleared, but that does not mean it is. Spawn points are often in drop ceilings or closets.

 

In SP or MP host, you can walk into a POI, open the console and see messages for each zombie that spawned from a sleeper volume. If it says Restoring, then that was a zombie that was there from a previous visit, that was not killed.

 

Are you playing SP or MP? If MP and you are not the server, then what ping do you have?

 

Ping is average of 30 to 60. Also do sleeper spawns consider the player rotation/view angles? I needed something like this in one of my prototypes.

 

bool util.IsPosVisibleToPlayers(pos)
{
for(auto&& player : gameState.GetActivePlayers())
{
	if (player.IsFlagSet(FL_NOTARGET))
		continue

	if(player.InsideViewCone(pos) and player.TraceHits(pos))
	{
		return true;
	}
}
return false;
}

bool PlayerBase::InsideViewCone(const Vector& pos)
{
Vector faceDir = GetFacingDirection2D();
Vector los = pos - EyePos();

float fov = GetFOV();
float dot = los.Dot(faceDir);

return dot > fov;
}

 

Fairly simple check.

[DaVegaNL]

I have to say...even with all the shortcomings of A16 .......I had a lot more fun with it. A17 seems to be more of a grind... just not having as much fun with it. By level 30 you maybe have your bow with iron arrows, 50-100 9mm and an orange pistol that does nothing against the relentless ferals and greenies. I always prided myself on not dying "alot" in game.....well both games i started i have died at least 8 -10 times each one. Thats not the complaint i have...its almost impossible to survive and enter POIs now. I dont want to even go in them because i know i will be tearing ass right out the same door i just entered. Every one has 5 or 6 Zs with half being feral and greeenies.

 

The use of the 30 minute magazines is useless and a waste of time unless you want to craft something and you havent leveled up. Your hands are so tied with the flow of the game and everything being tied to leveling and perks. You either are spending perks on trying to stay alive or saying screw it and going for something you want like a bike.

 

Try making concrete...it takes 45 minutes in game per 3000 made. Thats 90 minutes for 6000 concrete mix. Meanwhile, the overpowered Zs are tearing your base apart and you cant fix it fast enough.

 

Weather is still a joke too.

 

The food and drink system is annoying waiting for the timers to catch up to whatever you just ate or drank.

 

You can barely move away from a basic base that you have built, because the higher level Zeds just destroy everything while I am shooting them with my bow. The game is just to hard at the start to survive.....The only balanced area you have is when you are exploring and you meet a small horde that is manageable.....but dont enter a poi that looks interesting, because you are sure to be kicked out by its occupants. There arent even bosses in game yet.

 

I am waiting to see what the next patch brings but I play with alot of seasoned players who are not enjoying the game since a17. They are waiting for a stable version , because FPS drops are ridiculous especially around bases and are hoping that the modders go to work and change alot of these new systems.

 

I really think that the testers spent most of their time in GOD mode or flying around bypassing alot of the Zs or just loaded up on the DEV tools in game to give them super powers.

 

Regards

 

Ouch

 

I don't think you should worry mate. TFP will probably nerf the living daylight out of the game with the next patch, so the game will be much more like a16. Not very challenging, that is.

[lesipher]

hmm... I thought the 'iron' cost was the same either way? but either way, man I love those things!

 

I've got three more on my Christmas Wishlist

 

1) Murder Holes: ideally both a 'Bars' kind and a Flagstone half-height or plate. Something to drop Molotovs through but you couldn't fall through.

2) Retractable Stairs/Ladder: like the flimsy attic stairs or a fire escape ladder. Useful to retreat higher up in your base if there's a breach. Edit: and pull it up behind you

3) Roll-down Security Shutters: rolled up they'd be basically like the Poles, then close or un-roll and fully cover the block/s. Orignally was thinking of them as a last line of defense for spots you might build to melee through, so when it's get outa dodge time you'd slam em down and have a few seconds before z's broke through them.

 

I know, asking a lot but 'tis the Season right? & a man can dream

 

A workaround for murder holes is to use railings(just the railing not catwalk) rotated flat. I havent tried this yet with the current build but it should work. As for the retractable ladder; use hatches placed flat on a wall and stagger them for steps. closed they cant be walked on (possible but very hard) opened they then can serve as retractable steps. Haven't considered a rolldown door workaround....

[Jugginator]

I don't think you should worry mate. TFP will probably nerf the living daylight out of the game with the next patch, so the game will be much more like a16. Not very challenging, that is.

 

Please no lol.

[ecv]

@Ouch Quit It

 

I can agree on the point that base-building is pointless now, could just as well remove the whole building stuff aspect alltogether if it stays like this. Takes like one minute for a base to get wrecked. Either keep the z's strong and make concrete viable again or weaken them considerably so you can at least shoot them before they tear down everything. The only way to build a sustainable base at this time is by using exploits and pathing issues. that can not be the end of it surely ^^

 

That poi's are hard is fine. i'd never go into a poi alone. never. With two or three people it's great fun, and even the big ones are manageable. Singleplayer might need a total different balancing, but i've never played SP at all, i have no idea how that goes.

 

after playing a14+15+16 and now a17, this current state of the game is my favorite. Finally no hours of looting after hordes, no cleaning up bodies... Melee is viable. Vehicles are mostly working. Visuals are kewl.

I only miss the base-building and distant water, which destroys the feeling of a real world entirely. a lot.

 

been running a community server for two years now that's focusing on base building. we have some EPIC builders. none of them can do anything now, we still play a16 for that and just hope that the zombies during hordenight get severely nerfed.

 

We'd like MORE zombies, not stronger ones *g* they are way too strong as it is, tearing through steel like it's paper mache ^^

[Viperel]

@Ouch Quit It

 

I can agree on the point that base-building is pointless now, could just as well remove the whole building stuff aspect alltogether if it stays like this. Takes like one minute for a base to get wrecked. Either keep the z's strong and make concrete viable again or weaken them considerably so you can at least shoot them before they tear down everything.

 

 

Playing on default settings i have no issue with them wrecking the concrete base. In the first 21 days i used some nearby POIs for horde night, then i made a funnel system at my base so i always have a "weak" point which the z's will always go for, set up an electric fence and a few blade traps, i never fire one bullet on horde night and just mind my own business like usual. The damages and costs are minimal, yeah i dont get any exp for the kills but i dont really need it, i have quests or random hordes for that. The new AI is a lot more predictable than before but you do need to change the way you used to design bases to be efficient, otherwise they will break through the walls fairly easy.

[Hellhound1408]

I don't think you should worry mate. TFP will probably nerf the living daylight out of the game with the next patch, so the game will be much more like a16. Not very challenging, that is.

I hope they don't! Whoever sees 7Days2Die as pure Sandbox Game with Zombies is in my opinion wrong. This is a Survival Zombie Game with an Sanbox Aspect. If you can't stand the heat, get out of the Kitchen/Git Gud or Die Trying. This isn't like Minecraft where you can build an simple Wood House and expect it to stand against the Undead. The Early Game is a struggle for Survival. You don't have Shelter, Enough Food/Water or in any way Arms to defende yourself against the new law and order, and every 7 Days comes the reality check, if you are able to defend yourself or not.

If ppl run into Poi's, fire their guns at the first Zed they see and then start complaining that the Zombies opened an Can of Whoopass at them, because they are not the killing machine they where in A16 where you could kill everything with an average Bow and some Stone Arrows, then i wonder what they expect from the game.

Because it sounds like to me, that they want to reach Endgame with all Guns/Tools on Max Quality and all Mods, max perks while they sit in their Bedrock level Steel Bunker, crafting their 100.000 Bandage or sitting next to a forge, without having to kill more then the few Zombies that run arround in the open or worry about the Blood Moon Horde.

 

(I started on an mp server once that was on day 300+ with lvl 1 on Difficult Level 6 on A16. The fact that Zeds where plain stupid and would run in circle while you shot them from a save distance, and bashing their head in while they where stunned for several second (you got the stun bonus for every attack that you did while he was stunned, which is gone in A17) made it so easy to get even in pois that would normaly whoop your ass otherwise)

 

Also ppl complaining that they can't craft a forge at lvl 1 and get their Iron Tools asap so that they can open Safes or Doors or gather Stone/Wood quick that normally would be a pain with an Stone Axe sound to me more like they want to play a farming simulator. I don't think that the lvl 20 Gate for the Forge is game breaking, it is the first step to get you running with the access to better tools, better ammo for your Bow/Crossbow, better blocks and should be therefore an goal in the early game. Yet they have a point that the exp you get from anything else then killing zombies is to low.

 

Kudos to the Devs! I see the Alpha 17 Patch as a whole new 7 Days 2 Die, better then any other Alpha Patch that i played and i hope that Alpha 17.x and Alpha 18 will Rock our World, with new ways to die(More Zombies,Animals,Weather,NPC Bandits and Bandit Poi's new ways to survive(New Weapons for Meele and Range,Gadgets (Noise Maker to distract Zombies (Like the Pipebomb from Left 4 Dead))),new way to kill Zombies and/or other Players (Scrap Frag Grenate, Beartraps that Snares Zombies and Cripples them etc.)

While i know that this could be added to the .xml's, i hope that we get much more stuff in the standart game.

[FileMachete]

A workaround for murder holes is to use railings(just the railing not catwalk) rotated flat. I havent tried this yet with the current build but it should work. As for the retractable ladder; use hatches placed flat on a wall and stagger them for steps. closed they cant be walked on (possible but very hard) opened they then can serve as retractable steps. Haven't considered a rolldown door workaround....

 

When I tested Molotovs in b199 you had to basically throw them horizontally. Any attempts aiming 'down' failed. Hopefully Molotovs will get looked at soon-ish. Once they are I'll definately test the Crude Railing for Molotov pass-thru and falling thru.

Nice idea on the hatches for a foldable staircase, also an interesting test of the AI

 

Thanks for the ideas lesipher

[DaVegaNL]

Please no lol.

 

I hope they don't nerf the game too much either. But I'm fearing they will.

[jenniann]

I really hope they don't Nerf it either, i am loving the difficulty and challenges that i am facing. Have to be careful instead of just running in and looking at stuff.

[archergod]

I am reading some review where user are disappointed. Well I will say to them, it is not that bad at all. I just had my 3rd Horde night, with radiated Cops and spiders but:

 

1. I have 5 yr old business laptop I use to play this game on it. I used to get 40-60 FPS depending where I am on game, with low settings + couple of tweak for better UI. But, with a17, I got 16-20fps, with absolutely all values to 0, Even the z faces looks awful in graphics. But I never have Lag like I see on Kage's stream. It use to lag in b199, but not in b208 that much. sometime I even didn't notice horde spawning.

 

2. The Zed tear base quickly, but I have Working stiff as my base since day one. I fight first horde night on top of bridge, and since there were not spitting cop or vulture. these z cannot even touch me. I didn't die on first night though, I die 12-13 times till horde night, mainly those POI surprise are too much for me.

 

3. I never die in horde night, the max damage they do to me is 20 hit point, when a spider manage to diagonal jump on my base and catch me on my space. But just 2 spider manage to do that. My base can be seens as AI exploit, but before A17 was release going back 6-8 months, when news of smart AI came by, at that time I was able to plan a Maze, becuase if Path finding works they will follow path and maze can be set with auto turrent, it is not exploit. If it is exploit, then the fix is what I call is rig to player. like POI, they make POI where you have to fall in few places, and when you fall they bring 5 zed which are not there before, and you cannot fight and die. When zombie spawn at time of POI entry, all hidden zombie? if a poi is like hospital, even than, if I enter it, all 999 POI counter should trigger and all 999 should come to me on pistol firing, In real world that is what happen. It is not Dungeon game, it is not RPG game. so there is no exploit

 

Game is fun, if you plan better. Maybe you used to play Normal or Advance difficulty level, lower your level 1 point and it will become game of your level, then when you get used to game go to higher level.

[TSRViper]

Loving A17 so far!

 

Great job devs (and thanks for the spitting vultures, insane POIs and armour/gun mod system)

 

Cheers