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Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

Developer Discussions: Alpha 17  

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  1. 1. Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

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My dearest madmole, gazz, and Faatal...

 

As I write this post, I am reminded that we don't always see eye to eye, but on this one point I'd like to show my solidarity in one particular vision...

 

...and that's difficulty.

 

The General threads are filled with cries of "it's too hard", and "waa, my hoo hoo hurts, it's not a cakewalk anymore", and yet a large number of these people also REFUSE to lower their difficulty level, citing "new users will die, the game will fail!".

 

And I'd simply like to help bolster your morale by pointing out that these same folks will be compaining that the game lacks challenges in 5 months, and that what makes this game great in the first place IS it's toughness...

 

So please, although you can feel free to revert the perk system, and I'm grateful levelled loot is no longer an issue, please don't cave to the loud few and nerf sleeper counts, irradiated zeds at GS 27, the New AI, vulture "death from above", or any other factor that makes zeds deadly.

 

Thank you.

 

While most of those issues are learning curves, i'd say there is a big issue when your getting the strongest zombies in the game spawning as part of your horde before you have even hit level 15. That combined with weakened base defenses, limited options for walls means there is basically no point in making a real base and your forced to either let them kill you and take the debuff, or create bases to exploit the AI to survive.

 

I mean if wood spikes could kill more then 1 zombie before being destroyed it might make defense more feasible, but i watched 1 radiated zombie just run thru 10 of em and didn't even take any damage because he just regenerated it instantly. Since we can't make log spikes or upgrade them, and can't make forged iron before level 20 to make stronger ones there is nothing we can do defense wise to stop one.

 

The perk system, sleepers, AI, vultures, etc are all great, but I definitely feel there is an issue with WHEN tougher zombies spawn.

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It's a side step that will enable a giant leap forward. I pinky promise.

 

Defiantly agree. The future looks bright!

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While most of those issues are learning curves, i'd say there is a big issue when your getting the strongest zombies in the game spawning as part of your horde before you have even hit level 15. That combined with weakened base defenses, limited options for walls means there is basically no point in making a real base and your forced to either let them kill you and take the debuff, or create bases to exploit the AI to survive.

 

I mean if wood spikes could kill more then 1 zombie before being destroyed it might make defense more feasible, but i watched 1 radiated zombie just run thru 10 of em and didn't even take any damage because he just regenerated it instantly. Since we can't make log spikes or upgrade them, and can't make forged iron before level 20 to make stronger ones there is nothing we can do defense wise to stop one.

 

The perk system, sleepers, AI, vultures, etc are all great, but I definitely feel there is an issue with WHEN tougher zombies spawn.

 

I (obviously) had your GS concerns in mind, but look at it this way... what if you are not meant to build a super base in the first few weeks of gameplay. What if you are meant to run from poi to poi, barely making it through... never able to use the same place twice... that makes for a much more exciting game, and then by the time you are ready to build bases then and only then can you stand a chance against them.

 

I'm digging it.

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Every poi that i have try to see has many many zombies inside.. a simple storage has 3-4 zombies.. whaaat? and the problem that i have is before you go inside you can't see any zombie and then suddenly all of these enemies spawn inside.. for example i found a hole in a storage and went down there.. i looted the basement (no zombies at all) and then suddenly i saw 2 zombies in front of my face and 2 sleepers behind me.. i run outside immediately from that hole... Why is that happening? Can you reduce the enemies inside simple poi's (i mean civilian houses, cabins, storages etc.. not military bases or police stations) and fix the spawning issue?

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I (obviously) had your GS concerns in mind, but look at it this way... what if you are not meant to build a super base in the first few weeks of gameplay. What if you are meant to run from poi to poi, barely making it through... never able to use the same place twice... that makes for a much more exciting game, and then by the time you are ready to build bases then and only then can you stand a chance against them.

 

I'm digging it.

 

Which is reasonable, but it doesn't sound like the intent of the game at least on normal difficulties. Now if the difficulty impacted the GS more so that only occured when you selected difficulties above the basic level then that would be fine, but when your playing on "easier" difficulties then having that its going to turn off the game to all but the most seasoned players.

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Every poi that i have try to see has many many zombies inside.. a simple storage has 3-4 zombies.. whaaat? and the problem that i have is before you go inside you can't see any zombie and then suddenly all of these enemies spawn inside.. for example i found a hole in a storage and went down there.. i looted the basement (no zombies at all) and then suddenly i saw 2 zombies in front of my face and 2 sleepers behind me.. i run outside immediately from that hole... Why is that happening? Can you reduce the enemies inside simple poi's (i mean civilian houses, cabins, storages etc.. not military bases or police stations) and fix the spawning issue?

 

Ok, here is how you deal with magical spawning sleepers. Run around the exterior of the POI, get close to windows and such and count to something like 10. They will spawn, you will see them and then they will begin trying to get to you. The open doors and windows for you to shoot at them.

 

Exploit? some will call it that, I call it looking very very closly for sleepers hiding in the shadows until they appear and you can see them.

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Which is reasonable, but it doesn't sound like the intent of the game at least on normal difficulties. Now if the difficulty impacted the GS more so that only occured when you selected difficulties above the basic level then that would be fine, but when your playing on "easier" difficulties then having that its going to turn off the game to all but the most seasoned players.

 

i wanna see how a seasoned player deals with 5 dogs spawnned in a poi withouth exploiting ai on day 4, not even an ak47 with a full magazine can save you this is not dark souls difficulty this is playing against aimbotters difficulty the games just ♥♥♥♥s you over and says its difficulty

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My dearest madmole, gazz, and Faatal...

 

As I write this post, I am reminded that we don't always see eye to eye, but on this one point I'd like to show my solidarity in one particular vision...

 

...and that's difficulty.

 

The General threads are filled with cries of "it's too hard", and "waa, my hoo hoo hurts, it's not a cakewalk anymore", and yet a large number of these people also REFUSE to lower their difficulty level, citing "new users will die, the game will fail!".

 

And I'd simply like to help bolster your morale by pointing out that these same folks will be compaining that the game lacks challenges in 5 months, and that what makes this game great in the first place IS it's toughness...

 

So please, although you can feel free to revert the perk system, and I'm grateful levelled loot is no longer an issue, please don't cave to the loud few and nerf sleeper counts, irradiated zeds at GS 27, the New AI, vulture "death from above", or any other factor that makes zeds deadly.

 

Thank you.

I'm glad you're enjoying it. But I'm not finding the game fun anymore. It's not too hard. Yes, I got killed a couple times when I started because I didn't expect ninja zombies. I even turned it down to scavenger (I normally play on nomad) and I didn't find it any more fun. Turned it back up to nomad, didn't die, still not fun.

 

I (obviously) had your GS concerns in mind, but look at it this way... what if you are not meant to build a super base in the first few weeks of gameplay. What if you are meant to run from poi to poi, barely making it through... never able to use the same place twice... that makes for a much more exciting game, and then by the time you are ready to build bases then and only then can you stand a chance against them.

 

I'm digging it.

Again, glad you're enjoying it, but if that's how the game is meant to be played now, it's not a game I want to play anymore, and that sucks. I've never done a horde night in a POI. I want to build bases. I watched this game on Youtube for several years (at least since the minecraft-style crafting grid was still a thing) thinking how awesome if would be if they just added a couple things, they added them in A16, and I bought the game. Loved it. Almost 500 hours played.

 

Now...it really does feel like a different game, and it's a game I don't want to play, because it just isn't fun anymore. If I'd only seen people play A16, I'd have blamed myself for not realizing what direction the devs wanted the game to go, but for it to so drastically change in the course of 1 Alpha after being so similar through many previous is kind of shocking.

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I love the perks!!!! The challenge is fun. People forget that there will be changes and balancing I am sure in the future. A16 is horrible compared to a17. I would never go back.

 

Don't worry... your manhood will still be intact if you lower the settings :p

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The patch does not need a new game?

 

To see this change:

Animal gore to roads for an easy supply of bone shivs and bones for glue.

 

I got the new gore blocks in my navezgane world w/o starting a new game.

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i wanna see how a seasoned player deals with 5 dogs spawnned in a poi withouth exploiting ai on day 4, not even an ak47 with a full magazine can save you this is not dark souls difficulty this is playing against aimbotters difficulty the games just ♥♥♥♥s you over and says its difficulty

 

1) set up spikes outside poi

2) shoot dog in face

3) run like hell

4) get behind spikes

5) profit

 

Did this very thing yesterday :smile-new:

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Hmm, I get 700 xp for a weak zombie. It takes me about 3-4 seconds to kill one with my club so I don't see myself getting xp faster any other way.

 

Seems that way at the moment. But it still means a builder could do a lot of mining, tree cutting and building and still progress. There is no need to grind zombies if you would normally do other things instead. You also don't need a forge immediately. The game has cobblestone for building and everything else, like a fire axe or even a working forge, can be found or bought.

 

Surely there is a need for more balancing. At the moment the xp for zombies seems to make them not loot but xp pinatas.

 

Another point: If the game is best solved by grinding fastest way to get xp and disregard other ways, why would you ever stop doing it even after getting the forge? So balancing is needed, not making the forge available immediately, it doesn't fix the problem.

 

 

...

stealth system need to sync faster, the sound detection has too long delay. Ex: You sit down, you're at 1-2 stealth, you jump and it - logically - increases to 30-50, as soon as the sound disappears it should go back to 1-2 stealth but it takes a couple of seconds. It's almost as if other scripts are queued before, why? Pasta is good in food, not code. :cocksure:

 

I think this is part of the stealth system - make multiple noises back to back and they multiply the effect. Even in reality you can pinpoint continuing noise much better than a single one.

 

Of the complaints that I have, melee (combat at least) actually feels like it's fine imo. There's no point to using regular attacks, only use power attacks. ...

 

I don't think it is a good sign if regular attacks have no use anymore.

 

What are the requirements to unlock all the craftsmanship perks I'm lvl 13 and all mine are still greyed out

 

Hover over the lock icon to the right.

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[ATTACH=CONFIG]25508[/ATTACH]

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]25509[/ATTACH]

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]25510[/ATTACH]

 

in places on your pics is cold anyway. only lack of snowfall makes it look like hot desert. but in game is hot and cold together. i'm not pushing to any realism, it just feel better for me to have cold and hot climate separated with "green" zone. but i wont complain, if it will changed back to old ways. it is fun eiter way

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1) set up spikes outside poi

2) shoot dog in face

3) run like hell

4) get behind spikes

5) profit

 

Did this very thing yesterday :smile-new:

 

that is exploiting ai and also are you a magician and can see in the future that 5 zombie dogs spawn in front of you in that aprticullar poi doors were even locked open on purpose you cant close them and run im talking about dogs inside poi dogs outside aggro range are easy to deal with but when they spawn rigth in front of you no way you can live

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Someone with the know how please do me a favor.

 

look into the rwgmixer and tell me if the higarashi building, the crack a book admin building and the other sky scrapers are still in. did 6 worlds, havent seen em. and if they are in, are they just too low a % chance to spawn?

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that is exploiting ai and also are you a magician and can see in the future that 5 zombie dogs spawn in front of you in that aprticullar poi doors were even locked open on purpose you cant close them and run im talking about dogs inside poi dogs outside aggro range are easy to deal with but when they spawn rigth in front of you no way you can live

 

Yes, mad wizard skills. Seriously though, I did see them before setting up my defense. I've yet to run across a poi that had dogs I didn't see before they saw me. Not saying it doesn't happen, just not in my experience thus far.

 

It does sound like there needs to be tuning done on what zombies spawn and when. As I understand it though certain pois have harder zombies and better loot from the start. I was satisfied with the loot at the end of the poi I took out with the dogs.

 

As to the original point I actually agree. I like to build bases, it's way too long a slog now to get a base up and running unless you want to dig a hole and hide for the night. Surviving a night in a poi is one thing, being forced to do it is another.

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Someone with the know how please do me a favor.

 

look into the rwgmixer and tell me if the higarashi building, the crack a book admin building and the other sky scrapers are still in. did 6 worlds, havent seen em. and if they are in, are they just too low a % chance to spawn?

 

this is what i found, is it what you were after? they dont go by names for the skyscrapers.

 

 

<prefab rule="skyscrapers" min_count="2"/>

<prefab_rule name="skyscrapers">

<prefab name="skyscraper_01" max_count="1" prob="50"/>

<prefab name="skyscraper_02" max_count="1" prob="50"/>

<prefab name="skyscraper_03" max_count="1" prob="50"/>

<prefab name="skyscraper_04" max_count="1" prob="50"/>

 

 

 

i use notepad++ to open my files... did ctrl + f and list all in document to show this.

Edited by unholyjoe (see edit history)

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that is exploiting ai and also are you a magician and can see in the future that 5 zombie dogs spawn in front of you in that aprticullar poi doors were even locked open on purpose you cant close them and run im talking about dogs inside poi dogs outside aggro range are easy to deal with but when they spawn rigth in front of you no way you can live

 

Thats not an AI exploit at all. I always keep 10-15 spikes on toolbelt for stuff like that. Have to sneak into POI's carefully. Saw one that when you went in the floor had collapsed and there were multiple dogs inside so I set up spike blockade and then sneak attacked and pulled em out.

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My dearest madmole, gazz, and Faatal...

 

As I write this post, I am reminded that we don't always see eye to eye, but on this one point I'd like to show my solidarity in one particular vision...

 

...and that's difficulty.

 

The General threads are filled with cries of "it's too hard", and "waa, my hoo hoo hurts, it's not a cakewalk anymore", and yet a large number of these people also REFUSE to lower their difficulty level, citing "new users will die, the game will fail!".

 

And I'd simply like to help bolster your morale by pointing out that these same folks will be compaining that the game lacks challenges in 5 months, and that what makes this game great in the first place IS it's toughness...

 

So please, although you can feel free to revert the perk system, and I'm grateful levelled loot is no longer an issue, please don't cave to the loud few and nerf sleeper counts, irradiated zeds at GS 27, the New AI, vulture "death from above", or any other factor that makes zeds deadly.

 

Thank you.

 

It had to be said - and it's even better when Guppy says it.

I've played more than 4000 hours, and now A17 is beating me, making me cry and rage quit.

And that's what I wanted : the opportunity to be challenged and humiliated by the game. Of course, one of these days, i'll be able to start a new map without being a miserable coward, fearing at each second to be killed. Or maybe not.

 

I'm amazed by the work TFP has done. The game has never been so immersive.

A big thank you for your work, dudes.

 

And as usual "sorry for my french"...

Edited by Hek Harris (see edit history)

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Re: difficulty

 

...sincere question.

 

Do people really want a game where there's little chance of failure?

 

Do people want a game where there's NO chance of a "crap happens" moment that's out of your control?

 

Cause those deaths are the best moments for me...

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this is what i found, is it what you were after? they dont go by names for the skyscrapers.

 

 

<prefab rule="skyscrapers" min_count="2"/>

<prefab_rule name="skyscrapers">

<prefab name="skyscraper_01" max_count="1" prob="50"/>

<prefab name="skyscraper_02" max_count="1" prob="50"/>

<prefab name="skyscraper_03" max_count="1" prob="50"/>

<prefab name="skyscraper_04" max_count="1" prob="50"/>

 

 

 

i use notepad++ to open my files... did ctrl + f and list all in document to show this.

 

Is that supposed to be 50 or 0.50? Just curious with all the other probabilities not going past the number 1, just 0.** leading to 1

 

Also:

 

 

 

skyscraper_01 = Dishong Tower

skyscraper_02 = Crack A Book Corporate

skyscraper_03 = Higashi Pharmaceutical

skyscraper_04 = Joe Bros Builders

 

 

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this is what i found, is it what you were after? they dont go by names for the skyscrapers.

 

 

<prefab rule="skyscrapers" min_count="2"/>

<prefab_rule name="skyscrapers">

<prefab name="skyscraper_01" max_count="1" prob="50"/>

<prefab name="skyscraper_02" max_count="1" prob="50"/>

<prefab name="skyscraper_03" max_count="1" prob="50"/>

<prefab name="skyscraper_04" max_count="1" prob="50"/>

 

 

 

i use notepad++ to open my files... did ctrl + f and list all in document to show this.

 

yep, but not finding any generated. no cities actually, but sprawled towns a plenty.

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