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Developer Discussions: Alpha 17


Developer Discussions: Alpha 17  

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  1. 1. Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

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The sewers could be a POI that spawn under the city, it could maybe have 6-7 variants.

 

Unless you place sewers under the roads, as modern cities tend to do, you'll end up with random building collapses. The reason cities tend to place sewers under roads is to prevent random building collapses and allow for easier access.

 

The choice is then to crudely lever the POI system to operate below the ground or write an algorithm to generate sewers at runtime. The latter would be easier.

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Unless you place sewers under the roads, as modern cities tend to do, you'll end up with random building collapses. The reason cities tend to place sewers under roads is to prevent random building collapses and allow for easier access.

 

The choice is then to crudely lever the POI system to operate below the ground or write an algorithm to generate sewers at runtime. The latter would be easier.

 

I believe in like Alpha 14-15 there were HUGE sewers under towns and cities and they were pretty deep and nothing was collapsing ^^.

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I assume he is referring to Slaanhatten, essentially a handmade city. It had some pretty awesome sewers.

 

I think it may be this mod by the same author. Good work but a little crude in the implementation, not really surprising given the underlying engine really wasn't meant to do such a thing.

 

https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?32929-Fully-connected-sewer-subway-syetem-for-random-gen-cities

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I think it may be this mod by the same author. Good work but a little crude in the implementation, not really surprising given the underlying engine really wasn't meant to do such a thing.

 

https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?32929-Fully-connected-sewer-subway-syetem-for-random-gen-cities

 

That's more likely, I never actually tried that mod but I did explore Slaanhatten's laggy greatness ;)

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Just guessing, but if the new larger puzzle pois increase generation time, then adding swers would be the same kind of generation hit.

 

That said, maybe a18 could be the underground update? They could focus on the perlin cave system, underground pois, and large city sewer system generation. I would think you would only really need maybe a dozen pois that are tiled for the entire understreet system, with maybe a few specialty ones like a big cistern with a bunch of sleepers, or a big underground water treatment plant.

 

That would also give the code monkeys more time to really sort out bandits and the quest systems, but it would give us a new update in much less time that a17 and give us a significant addition to play without a huge development time hit.

 

An interesting addition might be a collapsed street poi leading down into the sewers, blocking off easy access to some parts of it. Manhole access could be every few city blocks, making it a little harder to explore the entire thing.

 

If pois can be stacked in rgw, they could even add underground storage rooms with sidewalk access (like they used to use in large cities.)

 

When I worked in Cleveland, we had a big steel door in the basement of the store I worked in. We learned that the city actually had an underground access tunnel under the sidewalks, which connected to store rooms under each store. They all had steel doors between them separating them. Deliveries would use an elevator in the middle of the sidewalk. (covered by a steel grate when closed)

 

We actually found the store key to the system, and went in one day after hours. It was ungodly creepy, and we didn't go further than two or three storerooms down because it just was THAT creepy.

 

I just present the idea because there is a lot that can pretty easily be added underground, and thats one of the things we love about minecraft still... the underground doubles rwg exploration.

 

And now that we have the gyrocopter, I really want the code repurposed for a parasail to quickly descend from tall skyscrapers. If link can do it in BOTW, we should be able to do it as well in 7 Days.

 

(explosive crossbow bolt elevation boosts could even be added to keep from descending onto a zombie bear or ferals!)

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So for sewers below a street, you could basically have buildings that are actually laying on their side and submerged with one side at ground level..

Make it as wide as a regular street to allow different sewer layouts.

 

You would need:

 

A straight section,

A "T" section,

A + section,

and two corner sections.

 

Don't allow it to build sewers on any town on a slope as it might look bad. Could work :D

 

***Also have one side of the building look like an asphalt street. It would be large enough to have quite a few interior layouts too!

 

And done!***

Edited by Aldranon (see edit history)
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<snipped for space>

 

This is why I specified American sewers. Most old cities in Europe have extensive underground areas. We have a few small rivers running under ours, nobody really notices until something like this happens...

 

 

The catacombs of Paris _might_ be doable, the passages seem thin enough to circumvent most SI problems...

 

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We still need an airport POI too.

 

Wasn't there an issue with large POI's being unable to be added to RNG? If memory serves the hand-egg stadium had to be split into two parts to add it to nave. Anyone know if this is still an issue with A17?

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Wasn't there an issue with large POI's being unable to be added to RNG? If memory serves the hand-egg stadium had to be split into two parts to add it to nave. Anyone know if this is still an issue with A17?

 

Mine were less than 200x200 ..whatever the max was for adding them.

 

Guppy had a motocross track...that was awesome!!

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Wasn't there an issue with large POI's being unable to be added to RNG? If memory serves the hand-egg stadium had to be split into two parts to add it to nave. Anyone know if this is still an issue with A17?

 

I'm thinking it's due to how stuff loads in. I know another guy earlier is making that aircraft carrier and having the same issue. It's too large for the chunks, so it never loads in if it's one piece, so he has to load it in as 2 pieces. I'm guessing that would be the same issue here, unless you could somehow make it to where those pieces ALWAYS load in connected, but I wouldn't know where to start with that to make sure the blocks are lined up. I could be wrong. You'd think it'd be one large POI, but made up of lots of smaller ones. Again, one reason I can't wait for this to be able to fully take a map hand made like Navezgane from other people. Things will be placed with a bit more reason. Random just seems too random for me, doesn't make much sense where things are located. I think some of that's been improved with A17 with the bits we've heard.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

Mine were less than 200x200 ..whatever the max was for adding them.

 

Guppy had a motocross track...that was awesome!!

 

So it is because of size. Is there a way for POIs to know what other POIs it should go with or how to line up?

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I'm thinking it's due to how stuff loads in. I know another guy earlier is making that aircraft carrier and having the same issue. It's too large for the chunks, so it never loads in if it's one piece, so he has to load it in as 2 pieces. I'm guessing that would be the same issue here, unless you could somehow make it to where those pieces ALWAYS load in connected, but I wouldn't know where to start with that to make sure the blocks are lined up. I could be wrong. You'd think it'd be one large POI, but made up of lots of smaller ones. Again, one reason I can't wait for this to be able to fully take a map hand made like Navezgane from other people. Things will be placed with a bit more reason. Random just seems too random for me, doesn't make much sense where things are located. I think some of that's been improved with A17 with the bits we've heard.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

 

 

So it is because of size. Is there a way for POIs to know what other POIs it should go with or how to line up?

 

You are asking the wrong guy bud...I just build them...no clue on the other magic that happens with them.

I'm sure someone with those mythical powers will answer.

 

Guppycur Guppycur Guppycur

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Oh, quick question.. I forgot..

 

How do you open 7DTD Client while it's already 'running'? (PID seems to share with startdedicated.bat)

 

I can open 7DTD, then startdedicated, but not the other way around..

 

So if I crash, I have to kick everyone off the server before I can get back in.

 

You probably got so many answers as private messages that your private message quota is full. Check your forum mail. In case your quota was exceeded a long time ago here is my answer:

 

With a little guesswork: I suspect startdedicated.bat doesn't really start a headless server but a client without gui that occupies your steam licence. Oh, the joys of DRM :upset:

 

If I'm right you have three options:

 

A) Start a real headless server (which you can download from steam, howto descriptions are on the net/in the forum, probably search for "headless server 7 days") does not use the steam licence and because of that you can start your client simultaneously. I do operate a headless server and I can start my client at the same time, so I know it works.

 

B) Start your client normally with a multiplayer game and let your friends connect to that. Naturally that means that a client crash will also kill the server, but you save the kicking and extra server restart.

 

C) Buy another copy of 7D2D on a separate steam account and use startdedicated in a parallel OS account and with that steam account. EDIT: In light of wolffbloods info buying another copy seems superfluous, just copy the game files to a different location and use the batch file from there.

 

EDIT: If this doesn't work, read the error messages and really try to understand them (many people just ignore error messages because they think they won't understand them anyway) and check the logfiles of 7d2d for more information.

Edited by meganoth (see edit history)
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You are asking the wrong guy bud...I just build them...no clue on the other magic that happens with them.

I'm sure someone with those mythical powers will answer.

 

Guppycur Guppycur Guppycur

 

Lol, there's definitely a maximum size that random world will Import in. Hopefully that's been adjusted for a17, but a15 allowed for prefabs to be joined together, that function was broken in a16.

 

Magoli cried that day.

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Also it would be cool to have clothing get wet (every slot fill up like a wetness bar - like in the long dark), that would freeze over in the snow but would cool you in the desert while it dries.

 

Uh, have you never gotten wet in A16.4? Being wet makes you colder and there is a percentage indicator (umbrella) that shows how wet you are

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Lol, there's definitely a maximum size that random world will Import in. Hopefully that's been adjusted for a17, but a15 allowed for prefabs to be joined together, that function was broken in a16.

 

Magoli cried that day.

 

Oh, so at one point you could. So that carrier could have work pre-A16, but A16 broke it. More than likely fixed for A17 I'd bet. I'm excited to see all the changes and find new ones. I mean we really only talk to, what, 3 devs? There's so many more out there doing more stuff. Wish we had a list of literally everything and in more detail like how faatal does with us.

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Lol, there's definitely a maximum size that random world will Import in. Hopefully that's been adjusted for a17, but a15 allowed for prefabs to be joined together, that function was broken in a16.

 

Magoli cried that day.

 

See....Maaaaaagic!!! Hope all is well Gup!!

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Oh, quick question.. I forgot..

 

How do you open 7DTD Client while it's already 'running'? (PID seems to share with startdedicated.bat)

 

I can open 7DTD, then startdedicated, but not the other way around..

 

So if I crash, I have to kick everyone off the server before I can get back in.

 

Hmmm, I actually don't have that issue. I usually can have the startdedicated.bat running all the time so my friends can jump on whenever they want, of course as long as my computer is on and it's running the server. When I want to get on, I can just open the client and it goes. Only have 1 copy of 7DtD. Though I do make copies of the game for each mod and do it that way. So I can actually have multiple servers going (1 server per copy) if I so wished, but only 1 client running. I wouldn't know where the difference would be.

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@Roland or @Faatal or @Madmole or @Gazz

 

Do you plan to make trolleys usable to transport things?

 

Maybe a Handcart would be nice too to build without receipe/shematics/blue print

as soon as you have some tires and some wood.

And then last but not least as an extension for vehicles - a trailer.

 

Because one of the first things i would organise in zombie apocalypse ist something

to transport needed stuff.

 

Best regards

Yoghira

Edited by Yoghira (see edit history)
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@Roland or @Faatal or @Madmole or @Gazz

 

Do you plan to make trolleys usable to transport things?

 

Maybe a Handcart would be nice too to build without receipe/shematics/blue print

as soon as you have some tires and some wood.

And then last but not least as an extension for vehicles - a trailer.

 

Because one of the first things i would organise in zombie apocalypse ist something

to transport needed stuff.

 

Best regards

Yoghira

 

I assume you mean the shopping carts for us over here in the colony. Have you heard the notice they make when you search them, Imagine what they would sound like if you moved them, and one always has a wonky wheel that drags you suddenly violently offcourse to ram into another shopper or a large fragile display (oh, maybe I do that on purpose)

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