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Developer Discussions: Alpha 17


Roland

Developer Discussions: Alpha 17  

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  1. 1. Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

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Roland quote:

"I haven't tested the multiplayer quests at all but I have done a few single player quests and they are a lot of fun and possibly the only way to get mods for your weapons. That is still up in the air."

 

If I want to explore and not set foot in a trading outpost ever I should not be punished by not getting mods.

 

I don't think this is reasonable to have access to everything just because you don't want to do something.

 

Games have been doing this for ages. Any game with Raids have Raid gear. The only way to get the raid gear is to do the raid.

 

If you want mods and they are only found in quests and traders, then guess what, you have to do quests and go to traders just like the rest of us. Your are not entitled to have access to everything if you are not willing to do the requirements.

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I don't think this is reasonable to have access to everything just because you don't want to do something.

 

Games have been doing this for ages. Any game with Raids have Raid gear. The only way to get the raid gear is to do the raid.

 

If you want mods and they are only found in quests and traders, then guess what, you have to do quests and go to traders just like the rest of us. Your are not entitled to have access to everything if you are not willing to do the requirements.

 

Agreed. This is a survival game. If you isolate yourself (for whatever reason), then the consequences are what the consequences are. In a previous post, someone mentioned not liking the traders because they "break" the idea of a survival game. I don't think that's accurate either, but everyone is entitled to play as they like. What we're not entitled to is having the game "nerfed" so that a portion of it becomes completely unnecessary. I like the idea of the trader, because let's face it...if I were to survive a zombie apocalypse and I realized I was the only living being left on the planet, I'm not sure the zeds would have a chance to eat me alive. I'd probably put an end to my own suffering.

 

So having the folks around who've managed to eke out a living by becoming traders makes sense. They gather, build and defend the same way the player does (from a lore perspective -- let's not even touch the "MAH BASE IS LITERALLY INDESTRUKTIBBUL!" aspect of the trader, LOL)...and now in A17, they're going to have things they need that we can get for them, creating a much more symbiotic sort of relationship between the player and the only existing NPCs in the game.

 

This actually enhances both the RPG aspect of the game and the survival aspect, as now not only am I fighting to survive, I'm aiding the traders in keeping their own survival going (at least in a story sense), and that's an awesome advancement, I think.

 

Bring on A17!

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you did not miss anything and Roland is still a human.

 

the three (3) sizes available sizes are :

4096 x 4096

8192 x 8192

16384 x 16384

So game setup will present us with a choice? What will the default value be set to?

What is the current size of a16 RNG?

Why would we choose anything other than 16384 x ?

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I just checked, the original kickstarter already included a strech goal of NPC characters and merchants. So this survival game was always thought to include survivors and traders, probably even factions (there is mention of the Duke). This is no direction they are taking, this is just an incomplete game where you see missing parts added.

 

Traders were useless in A15 and too powerful in A16, next stop, A17, should have more balance in the end. If not, we mod.

 

Thanks for pointing this out, Meganoth. I didn't back during the Kickstarter, but that's good to know. I love that A17 seems to be a push toward implementing systems that will really allow for them to craft the game they promised back then. I've loved watching this game develop, and I look forward to continuing to do so.

 

I think factions, a quest-line system that spreads out among all the various NPCs, and the slightly-more-RPG-than-before perk system might actually make the game more accessible to a larger player base, as it adds value and feature content AND makes the game's advancement mechanics a bit more streamlined and somewhat more familiar to RPGers in general.

 

Just my thoughts, though.

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Why would we choose anything other than 16384 x ?

 

Possible reasons:

1) A server owner may want to make sure players meet each other once in a while

2) For a quick game you don't want to wait hours for the world to be generated

3) You play SP, don't need that big a world and it just would waste disk space and generation time

4) In A18 or later: You want to handcraft a world and 16kms² are just too big for that

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For DEVS or ROLAND

 

Question pertaining to vehicle/ powered tool crafting.

 

Currently we can upgrade these items by trading out the engine or handlebars or any of the components.

 

In a17 is sounds like this is no longer possible, SO when we make a vehicle and it is X quality, is there no way to upgrade it and in order to make something X+1 quality we have to make a new vehicle from scratch?

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What difference does it make if you get it two days later?

 

I'd be working on my mods now if I had access to the XMLs. Even knowing the XMLs will change from now until then, it would still be awesome to be able to start (though the share of the buffs system was awesome and helps conceptually).

 

There are tons of things I'm loving about A17, but I know that there are some areas where I totally disagree with the designers and I will (and have in the past) modded things more to my liking.

 

 

...

If you want mods and they are only found in quests and traders, then guess what, you have to do quests and go to traders just like the rest of us. Your are not entitled to have access to everything if you are not willing to do the requirements.

 

Unless someone beats me to it, I'll be creating at least one mod that removes the traders and puts in the quests some other way, if possible. I too mostly dislike traders, though I will gladly abuse the hell out of them if they are on a server I am playing on (where abuse =/= cheat, just use them to their fullest extent). That said, I liked the way Darkness Falls handles the traders, with bodyguards and turning off protection of the trader base. I think traders need to be able to be killed and have their loot stolen too(and massively reduced IMHO. Rekt wouldn't survive his first day in business without bodyguards (and I suspect his bodyguards would murder him in a week...)).

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Unless someone beats me to it, I'll be creating at least one mod that removes the traders and puts in the quests some other way, if possible.

 

I thought about putting 'or mod it' into my post, but chose not to.

 

This is a perfectly viable option, of course, and is one of the beauties of this game. They make it possible to turn it into what ever you want.

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Random question, loosely related to A17. I've been thinking about building my own computer (have a gaming laptop now). I figure if I can build one that plays 7DTD really well, it'll play just about anything else well. My question is, what price range would I be looking at if I bought and built the level of a PC needed myself?

 

I currently get about 30 fps on my laptop with low/mid settings. I want to have settings mid/high with better frame rates than 30 fps.

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Random question, loosely related to A17. I've been thinking about building my own computer (have a gaming laptop now). I figure if I can build one that plays 7DTD really well, it'll play just about anything else well. My question is, what price range would I be looking at if I bought and built the level of a PC needed myself?

 

I currently get about 30 fps on my laptop with low/mid settings. I want to have settings mid/high with better frame rates than 30 fps.

 

Um, I have one that was about $850 and I can do high with 7 in view distance with no problem (The larger the distance, the more rough it gets since it just means more the computer has to actively do). So if I make the view distance max, yeah, not very good, lol. I'm okay with this since I play mainly SP or with a couple friends. It plays most other games on high everything, but not ultra, etc. The stuttering gets to me a bit, but that's most anyone because of how 7DtD is currently programmed. MM said it was fixed for A17E already way back, so I should then be good there. So that's on the cheap end. If you really want something good, it can and possibly will cost you up to $2,000. But that can last you for 5+ years... That's just what I've noticed.

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Alpha 16 random gen is a 10k radius circle

 

My reference to 6k x 6k is the A17 size for Navezgane. Sorry for the confusion.

 

Thanks Roland. For random gen, Do you, or anyone have an idea of an approximate A17 size that would be a close comparison to A16 random gen (granted a different shape, im talking total surface area)

 

Basically if its moddable in A17 I want to create random gen maps approximately on par with A16 for total surface are, or slightly smaller.

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Thanks Roland. For random gen, Do you, or anyone have an idea of an approximate A17 size that would be a close comparison to A16 random gen (granted a different shape, im talking total surface area)

 

Yes: 17721x17721 equals to around 314km which is the usable surface area of the current RWG.

 

And yet, 16384x16384 is huge still ( around 284km) and offers much more gameplay per square km according to the devs. Both on POI density and flippin` time per POI.

 

So we might lose 30 km but we certainly gain on gameplay time and interesting things to do . Plus, trader's oneliners never get old.

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I don't think this is reasonable to have access to everything just because you don't want to do something.

 

Games have been doing this for ages. Any game with Raids have Raid gear. The only way to get the raid gear is to do the raid.

 

If you want mods and they are only found in quests and traders, then guess what, you have to do quests and go to traders just like the rest of us. Your are not entitled to have access to everything if you are not willing to do the requirements.

 

Well I just totally disagree.

 

The first thing I do in all games (including MMOs) is to ignore the quests and just explore.

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Yes: 17721x17721 equals to around 314km which is the usable surface area of the current RWG.

 

And yet, 16384x16384 is huge still ( around 284km) and offers much more gameplay per square km according to the devs. Both on POI density and flippin` time per POI.

 

So we might lose 30 km but we certainly gain on gameplay time and interesting things to do . Plus, trader's oneliners never get old.

 

This is great, thanks. Basically no mod needed to get something close to A16 then. Ill just choose the 16384, close enough.

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Well I just totally disagree.

 

The first thing I do in all games (including MMOs) is to ignore the quests and just explore.

 

And if you operate outside the means of earning things that have specific tasks to earn them (quests in your example), then you don't earn them.

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About the grease monkey perk. why having it as a perk? would some rare book made that much more giving to gameplay vs a perk? we all had a little victory celebration when we finally found the book we have been looking for. enabling the workbench on a perk isn't the same.

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Thanks Roland. For random gen, Do you, or anyone have an idea of an approximate A17 size that would be a close comparison to A16 random gen (granted a different shape, im talking total surface area)

 

Basically if its moddable in A17 I want to create random gen maps approximately on par with A16 for total surface are, or slightly smaller.

 

A16 random gen is 314 square kilometers. In A17 you would have to generate a square map that is approximately 17.7 km x 17.7 km for the same playable surface area.

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Well I just totally disagree.

 

The first thing I do in all games (including MMOs) is to ignore the quests and just explore.

 

Well I just totally partially disagree to your disagreement.

 

In order to explore you have to eventually go against some threats thus raids/quests/gazz's puns.

Exploring just for the sake of exploring gets old in 7dtd after you have seen it all, and random mountains doesn't cut it. For you, for me, for everyone. We can try and indulge in our particular vices for a while, but it's just our mind in denial on the "I need moarr content" situtation.

 

What were we talking about ? God we need a17.

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And if you operate outside the means of earning things that have specific tasks to earn them (quests in your example), then you don't earn them.

 

The devs are still deciding which tells me that what you are saying is not correct. This game is all about doing what you want, not pigeon holed to norms.

 

If push comes to shove I'm sure it can be changed in mod, hopefully.

 

I actually tend to ignore POIs since all i really need is a bow.

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The devs are still deciding which tells me that what you are saying is not correct. This game is all about doing what you want, not pigeon holed to norms.

 

If push comes to shove I'm sure it can be changed in mod, hopefully.

 

I actually tend to ignore POIs since all i really need is a bow.

 

Absolutely true. They are still deciding and it should be modable. I think loot content is in tables and the tables are assigned to entities. So you could assign the table that contains the weapon mods to every zombie if you wanted to.

 

I would say though that a statement like 'do what you want' is un-achievable. As we all want different things. Even down to the simplest of things.

 

So parameters have to be set. A general direction chosen. And they are the ones choosing it. Now, again, the beauty of this game is that it is so modable and that allows a larger group of people, that would not be able to otherwise, to be able to do 'what they want'.

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Absolutely true. They are still deciding and it should be modable. I think loot content is in tables and the tables are assigned to entities. So you could assign the table that contains the weapon mods to every zombie if you wanted to.

 

I would say though that a statement like 'do what you want' is un-achievable. As we all want different things. Even down to the simplest of things.

 

So parameters have to be set. A general direction chosen. And they are the ones choosing it. Now, again, the beauty of this game is that it is so modable and that allows a larger group of people, that would not be able to otherwise, to be able to do 'what they want'.

 

Well said.

And if the quest are interesting enough (not repetitive kill X zombies) I guess I'd be ok with mods being quest rewards but interesting missions are not going to be in A17.

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