khzmusik Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 No! We’ve got to be clear about this. The goal is not to discourage or make anything less appealing. That’s down the path of “this play style is wrong and you should be punished for doing it.” Perhaps "less appealing" was a bad way to phrase it. "Less safe" or "less of a crutch" might be better. I've spent about 900 or so hours in the game, including playing a few different mods, and the end game always ends up being the same for me: build a base at bedrock and sit in it. Even restarting a new game, ends up just being a playthrough in order to level up your skills enough to reach bedrock. It's really one of the few things I dislike about the game: as soon as you can build a bedrock base, it stops being a survival game. Sure you can leave to clear out some POIs if you want, but you don't need to do that to survive. It makes the late game sort of uninteresting. I'm not saying that people shouldn't build underground bunkers - I'm sure I will no matter what - just that it shouldn't be entirely safe down there. All IMHO of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zadwanaa Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 No! We’ve got to be clear about this. The goal is not to discourage or make anything less appealing. That’s down the path of “this play style is wrong and you should be punished for doing it.” The goal as I see it is to bring the game into balance when it comes to effort versus reward. The game is supposed to present challenges that are fun to overcome. I don’t want to prod people back above ground. I hope playing underground is a blast in A17. I think having gas being an issue for any/all sorts of bases would be great. Having a concrete fortress? Awesome! no air in/out? ded. Massive underground lair with 1k forges going at once? fantastic! No venting? ded. I like the idea of it because it can give incentives for building above ground until you've gathered enough resources to go underground. I agree with not wanting to punish or discourage a certain playstyle because its a sandbox game... but everyone wants something different. There are underground people who want underground threats, and above ground people who used to be underground people that want underground threats to punish them. There are underground people who have above ground horde bases but stay underground for the peace and quiet. Personally, i think gas can be a pretty helpful tool in all that, all the while adding in the requirement for O2 in sealed bases, ventilation for forges and such Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demonoid74 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 There is a virus infected strain of underground fungus that will slowly poison , kill you and turn you into a zombie...unless you have proper air filtration systems running! it would require a few things to be built and a gas supply for your generator running them... There can be several in game reasons to make underground harder...as it should be...In all my play throughs every alpha since 7...I have never , ever built an underground base because it was to easy and boring...I just hope they add some difficulty other then just zombies occasionally finding/following and digging down to you... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildaxeman1 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 exatly Zadwanaa, let people have choice to play as they want, but make sure, there is threat. lack of O2 or moles and vultures, what ever fantasy can bring out. we are smart to find a way beat z-s. but reward and effort as stated before, must be balanced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppycur Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 But special cases are more involved to implement. ...and this is the issue imo... We have been in this early access for so long, a lot of people are getting exhausted and just want it over with... 5 alphas ago, no one would have complained about the difficulty in implementation. Hopes and wishlists were still strong and appeared viable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildaxeman1 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 There is a virus infected strain of underground fungus that will slowly poison , kill you and turn you into a zombie...unless you have proper air filtration systems running! it would require a few things to be built and a gas supply for your generator running them... There can be several in game reasons to make underground harder...as it should be...In all my play throughs every alpha since 7...I have never , ever built an underground base because it was to easy and boring...I just hope they add some difficulty other then just zombies occasionally finding/following and digging down to you... i built underground horde base. with blade traps, turrets and escape routes. believe me, it is very hard work and time consuming. nothing boring there. since air vents and gases are hard to implement according to Faatal. would be easier create new zombie, specialised for digging. like zombie badger or pack of zombie meercats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armstrrong Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Bandits are smart enough to find undeground base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake_ Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 ...and this is the issue imo... We have been in this early access for so long, a lot of people are getting exhausted and just want it over with... 5 alphas ago, no one would have complained about the difficulty in implementation. Hopes and wishlists were still strong and appeared viable. Whether time will be a real issue in any tweak or feature we can't know for sure. I mean: Timelines in the dev process of this game come from the wishes of the heart , not from a strictly meticulously crafted nailed down agenda. Videogames are like that. And that modus operandi has its ups and downs. Ups: Flexible and tweakable fun with more and more fun attached by the minute. Downs: Some of that fun gets changed and/or not implemented in a way that someone really really likes and so that person doesn't really deeply enjoy that kind of fun (no one said Guppycur, just me). The solution to that conundrum is in your heart, young-ish padawan. And mods, your mods are cooler than the 7dtd fridge... oh,wait. This conversation is interesting. I'll go and get some popcorn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zadwanaa Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 i built underground horde base. with blade traps, turrets and escape routes. believe me, it is very hard work and time consuming. nothing boring there. since air vents and gases are hard to implement according to Faatal. would be easier create new zombie, specialised for digging. like zombie badger or pack of zombie meercats. I would imagine gas & ventilation would be difficult to implement without another overhaul.. but then again, i dont know squat about programming But it would be a very neat feature. Fungus growing underground once there's room for it would be a neat. Zombie badgers would be the worst. Screw radiated cops, the badgers would be VICIOUS! the problem with moles and stuff, is that they dont dig through rocks, just dirt. Maybe some graboids! That would change horde night! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kooky112 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 I hope the devs read this I want to thank you devs for taking your time fixing up A17 so theres as few bugs as possible upon release. Now the other part... To appease some of the complainers, instead of releasing new stuff from A17, why not release a patch for some of the known bugs in A16? It might really help calm down some of these complainers. This way when A17 is released it's simply adding in the new content instead of patching and fixing everything all at once which will cause some plpayers with slower internet connections to have a slow download and installation process. Not everyone is on big powerful machines like us crazy people who built our own. (I am pricing new graphics cards when tax season comes around and MAYBE a new motherboard). It's just something to consider since your team is fairy small and I'm sure there's a lot on your plates in real life too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted October 22, 2018 Author Share Posted October 22, 2018 It does feel good when people 'in the know' add something to the conversations. This. (Am I playing right?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppycur Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Bandits are smart enough to find undeground base. An excellent alternative to zombies that creates an underground threat... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnowDog1942 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 An excellent alternative to zombies that creates an underground threat... But if they are above ground to.. wouldn't you just complain that's its the same thing over and over Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armstrrong Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 But if they are above ground to.. wouldn't you just complain that's its the same thing over and overThey can just gps you, and find entrance to your undeground base, and blow it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppycur Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 But if they are above ground to.. wouldn't you just complain that's its the same thing over and over No, because it would not just be mindless clawing and digging, thus requring different defenses, thus creating a different gameplay experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crater Creator Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 I hope the devs read this I want to thank you devs for taking your time fixing up A17 so theres as few bugs as possible upon release. Now the other part... To appease some of the complainers, instead of releasing new stuff from A17, why not release a patch for some of the known bugs in A16? It might really help calm down some of these complainers. This way when A17 is released it's simply adding in the new content instead of patching and fixing everything all at once which will cause some plpayers with slower internet connections to have a slow download and installation process. Not everyone is on big powerful machines like us crazy people who built our own. (I am pricing new graphics cards when tax season comes around and MAYBE a new motherboard). It's just something to consider since your team is fairy small and I'm sure there's a lot on your plates in real life too. Each alpha is its own entity. Your suggestion is similar to asking a car company to retrofit last year's model with features added for this year's model. It may be possible, but the new pieces are made to work with the new whole, and in many cases may not 'fit' the old version anymore. Also, content creation isn't what's holding back Alpha 17, so holding back content wouldn't deliver anything to players any sooner. Lastly, this is not a hobbyist-in-a-basement operation. For many people, working on 7 Days to Die is their "real life" job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldranon Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 By your definition anything is gaming them.. so if we go by that definition.. I guess I rather enjoy gaming them.. I just don't enjoy using unintended ways around the AI like the current stilt base. I plan to do the same underground, gaming, but not by some method that some would argue is an exploit. You probably wouldn't have to move while underground against a night horde. Just fill in the holes the zombies make (after throwing in some TNT or shooting them in the hole) with reinforced concrete and if you're deep enough, they might never reach you. Maybe. My thinking has always been to "turn lemons into lemonade". Only if really bored will I refuse to try my best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnowDog1942 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 No, because it would not just be mindless clawing and digging, thus requring different defenses, thus creating a different gameplay experience. Cool id like both Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppycur Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Cool id like both Me too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouch Quit It Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 MM, GAZZ Were double doors ever added ??? Regards Ouch cough Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gnomaana Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 ...and this is the issue imo... We have been in this early access for so long, a lot of people are getting exhausted and just want it over with... Then pretend 16.4 is Gold and quit playing. The rest of us are having fun getting a practically new game for free every few months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppycur Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Then pretend 16.4 is Gold and quit playing. The rest of us are having fun getting a practically new game for free every few months. So am I. You're misunderstanding what I'm saying and who I'm talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odetta Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 This is A17 related right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaosterone Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 This is A17 related right? Yes, but you can't jump out, and seat belt malfunction is hard coded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaVegaNL Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Then pretend 16.4 is Gold and quit playing. The rest of us are having fun getting a practically new game for free every few months. .. Lol You're an optimist. I like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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