Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

[JaxTeller718]

Check out our new perception attribute and its perks!

 

 

From one modder to another modder (who moved on to greater things) just wanted to reaffirm my faith in you guys and the work Im seeing. You have me 100 percent excited to get my hands on 17 brother.

 

This feels like the first Alpha in a long while where I'm excited to jump onto the vanilla experience and learn how to survive all over again. So many choices, routes to take and options in how to get it done. And so much opened up to us. The wait is definitely going to be worth it I know, as it always is.

 

Hope you remember to grab some much needed down time when all is said and done. Can't wait until all these "haters" have the words taken from their mouths when they get to see just how much work has been poured into this. I have NEVER been a fan of the perks system, but man Im not going to lie you proved me wrong. You actually have me excited to character build. I'm SO happy you guys went all in on these attributes.

 

Thank you for taking the time out to make these videos during what I am sure is a stressful time. It's always awesome getting to hear from the man himself.

[Damocles]

So there is now less time to profit from knocked down zombies (bonus damage) as they get up immediately.

That mechanic was helpful in melee, especially when fighting a larger group of them.

 

To visualize them not being dead on the ground, they could also play some "shaking" animation on the ground, instead of getting up immediately.

[wildaxeman1]

I am really sceptical about the new zombie loot. i always play with loot respawn off, so we'll see if that will still be an option, or if i stay with other games and forget about 7d2d

 

you can set loot respawn in longer time frame, so you can loot like 30 days later. by then you are levelled up and zombies are stronger too, so re-loot same place is more dangerous. you need to kill z-s , but instead of looting them, you loot POI

[CplCritter]

Check out our new perception attribute and its perks!

 

 

Thanks for the video MM!

 

Any chance of muzzle sway being a thing? I think it would be a good add for the sniper rifle. When I first saw "Aiming Stamina" in a screenshot last week, I jumped to the conclusion this had to do with the amount of sway we would see looking down the scope. After watching the video, I realized that was not the case.

 

I would love to see this as an added challenge on top of draining fatigue. Having a sniper rifle makes me feel a bit OP so I usually play without it unless I need to take out some exploding cops from a distance on horde night. If it took a bit more skill and timing, I would definitely go back to using it more often.

[MidnightRook]

Check out our new perception attribute and its perks!

 

 

Hey MM, Thanks again for the video. I am still a little saddened that knocked down zombies always start getting up right away. I feel that it takes away some of the jump scare that was built into the game, and was very natural for zombie films. Where the hero thinks they got everyone and turns their back just long enough to get jumped by someone they didn't double tap.

 

If they do the get up right away most of the time, and on occasion one will play dead...I feel would be the best possible mix here. Being used to them moving if they are not dead can lull us into trusting they are dead for sure when they are not. I never felt it was a "confusing" mechanic to not know if they are dead so much as it was the not knowing for sure at times made the game more un-nerving and nightmarish.

 

Just my thoughts, its not a deal breaker or anything. Thanks for being awesome!

[wildaxeman1]

Check out our new perception attribute and its perks!

 

 

thanx for video.

so shotgun messiah lvl5 cripples z if shot in legs. does it work with radiated cop, so he does not spurt to you?

 

archery lvl5 aiming speed went down to 10% from 40% at lvl4. is it just text mistake?

[ozzysfang]

Check out our new perception attribute and its perks!

 

 

Thanks again. for a bow perk maybe you could pin enemies if they stood in front of an object that arrows are retrievable from.?

then you could retrieve the arrow and "free" the enemy or kill them first.

[wildaxeman1]

also i have question about miner69#r. if i understood it correctly, it only increases powerattack damage to block, means it drains more stamina. then i may do more effectively with normal hits and i do not get tired so fast. so how that perk benefits me? could it be better (logical) to add damage bonus to normal hit too. increasing by 5% up to 25%

[Space4Ace]

Check out our new perception attribute and its perks!

 

 

This was a nice surprise! Another video already? So cool!

I love the direction you're going for with A17.

 

Thank you for taking some of your precious weekend time to make the videos.

 

P.S.: Nice touch by the way with starting and ending the video with you driving the jeep... Really cool!

[Bifferd]

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Hey MM yet another quality video so thank you. I can't help but feel like a17e is just around the corner. Keep up the good work and I look forward to watching the next installment in this series.

[sijb777]

Check out our new perception attribute and its perks!

 

 

Love the look of most of it. With the stamina usage while scoped in is it possible to do something like most other games with snipers and only drain stamina during a "breath hold" to reduce scope sway? A real life sniper will not hold their breath the entire time they are scoped in and thus will not bleed "stamina" while looking down the scope.

[Melthe]

No bows have their own perk tree under perception. I'll be showing new vids frequently covering each attribute.

 

Thanks MM

[Survager]

Joel, thank you very match for video.

 

Small question:

In the video said that heavy firearms will slow down the character. Will there be something like this with clubs, sledgehummer and crossbow? Crossbows, clubs and sledgehummers also have a big weight, especially sledgehammer. What do you say about it? Will these items also slow down the character?

[Crater Creator]

MM said zombies dont stun, the stay down perk says stun chance? did i miss something? or is stun being used in different contexts here?

 

not that i care i dont use a club ,ever. my preferred melee weapon is an AK-47 or a 9mm SMG if i dont have an AK-47..

 

I believe he was saying zombies can no longer be stun-locked, which is where they spend all of their time just reacting to the hits they're taking (i.e. flinching) and never get in a counterattack or other action.

 

Also, I thought Roland may have said small animals would be more common and large less common. Though, especially in brush, they can be incredibly hard to see or approach and far too quick to catch. Has there been any changes that make these smaller creatures a little easier to see and maybe not so fast? Another consideration towards starting characters.

 

One thing you could do is give grass blocks a slightly higher path weight than air blocks. Then animals will seek out the 'naturally' occurring bare spots on the terrain. You could see this as unrealistic, that animals would actually seek out tall grass in which to hide, or realistic, that animals would stick to game trails where the grass has already been trampled over time. Unfortunately zombies would do it too, which may or may not be desirable.

 

I am really sceptical about the new zombie loot. i always play with loot respawn off, so we'll see if that will still be an option, or if i stay with other games and forget about 7d2d

 

No loot respawn has been an option for years; I'd be super surprised if they removed it. Why would they? That could actually muddy the waters, as they won't know if fan reaction to loot in A17 is down to the change to zombie loot, or the change to the options.

 

"A17 will be released when the bugs are fixed"

 

 

That means never, because you will never catch all bugs.

 

Not all bugs, just the important 'show stopper' bugs. That line of text has to be extra short due to the limits imposed by the forum software, so it's abbreviated.

[FileMachete]

Thanks for the vid MM, nicely done!

 

Definately less worried about the new system now that I understand it better.

 

Was concerned that if you couldn't afford to spec into say Pistols that something like: at player lvl 0 zombie X takes 3 headshots from low qual pistol. At player lvl 50 still un-spec'd into pistols, same zombie X (which has become tougher) using a lvl appropriate qual pistol would take 7 head shots to bring down.

 

And that doesn't seem to be the intent, which is -really- good news.

 

I'll admit I'm going to miss the 'use it and get better at it' part, since that was an incentive to try to regularly mix in using non-Main weapons, to sort of keep them up-to-par, so even if you never spec'd into them they didn't fall so far behind that they became effective useless.

 

Really looking forward to seeing the other trees

 

---

 

meganoth, MM just proved you right, heh which is great news!

And I'm sort of okay with the second half, "Master of none."

Though honestly, even if I were playing co-op I'd still prefer an end-game where Master of all was attainable. I know, of course, mods

 

Might be interesting if after reaching max vanilla lvl that a mod tacked on more lvls for more points but not 1 for 1, maybe 2 lvls for 1 point then 3 lvls for 1 point. That kind of thing, so you're still 'advancing' towards Master of all.

 

Appreciate the wikipedia link, the other languages bit is quite interesting; had no idea so many cultures appear to view generalists in poor regard. I'm more in agreement with the longer version;

 

" "Jack of all trades, master of none, but oftentimes better than master of one" which refers to a person who is not the best at all skills, but is better than someone who is only a master of one."

 

Good stuff

[madmole]

Joel, thank you very match for video.

 

Small question:

In the video said that heavy firearms will slow down the character. Will there be something like this with clubs, sledgehummer and crossbow? Crossbows, clubs and sledgehummers also have a big weight, especially sledgehammer. What do you say about it? Will these items also slow down the character?

 

They should, or just use more stamina when running. Its a careful balancing act with a lot of stuff slowing you down (encumbrance, broken legs, reloading, stun and aim, etc so we might just increase stamina use when running with heavier weapons instead.

[Crater Creator]

I know we've only seen 2 attribute trees, but when it comes to weapons, so far it strikes me that many of the perks affect the same weapon stats that will be affected by weapon mods. It's nice to synergize your perks and mods, but I'm more excited to see my character gain new capabilities than to see incremental improvements. Perks like, now you can throw your knife, now you can dual wield pistols, now you can move while aiming, now you can melee with your gun, etc.

 

To that end, I actually think I'd enjoy fewer levels per perk. If it were me, I'd probably eliminate level 1 and level 4 from everything, cutting it down to 3 levels per perk. I would find each perk unlock more exciting this way: a more noticeable difference, without removing any functionality or affecting the difference between a new player and a maxed out player.

 

I know I haven't played it yet, and I know we may not be seeing some differences because things aren't hooked up yet... but I still think this will hold true. I wouldn't like spending a point and not being able to tell the difference before and after, and it looks like that would occur when each 'pie' is cut into 5 pieces. For comparison, I think the rebooted Tomb Raider did perks well. Not too many perks made each one feel impactful.

 

Also,

• I think I know the answer to this, but some recipes (like cement, minibikes, and mechanical parts) will still be unavailable at the start and unlocked either by reading books or buying that skill, right?
  
• Zombies not going motionless while still alive looks good. Thumbs up.
  
• We can't see how much our stamina is draining while looking down a scope. Will that change? Ignore everything Roland has to say about this.
  

[Roland]

Ignore everything Roland has to say...

 

Wise words CC. Better advice never was given.

[Ouch Quit It]

Check out our new perception attribute and its perks!

 

 

 

 

One thing i noticed....in archery number 5.....it drops down to 10%...shouldnt it be 50% instead

[Laz Man]

Check out our new perception attribute and its perks!

 

 

Thanks MM! DUDE!!! I LOVE what you did with the zombie getup speed. It looks so much more fluid. The only downside now is no more running over to do a quick head smash for bonus damage. No matter though as I am sure you guys reincorporated that mechanic into some type of skill/perk.

[Laz Man]

Thanks for the vid MM, nicely done!

 

Definately less worried about the new system now that I understand it better.

 

Was concerned that if you couldn't afford to spec into say Pistols that something like: at player lvl 0 zombie X takes 3 headshots from low qual pistol. At player lvl 50 still un-spec'd into pistols, same zombie X (which has become tougher) using a lvl appropriate qual pistol would take 7 head shots to bring down.

 

And that doesn't seem to be the intent, which is -really- good news.

 

I'll admit I'm going to miss the 'use it and get better at it' part, since that was an incentive to try to regularly mix in using non-Main weapons, to sort of keep them up-to-par, so even if you never spec'd into them they didn't fall so far behind that they became effective useless.

 

Really looking forward to seeing the other trees

 

---

 

meganoth, MM just proved you right, heh which is great news!

And I'm sort of okay with the second half, "Master of none."

Though honestly, even if I were playing co-op I'd still prefer an end-game where Master of all was attainable. I know, of course, mods

 

Might be interesting if after reaching max vanilla lvl that a mod tacked on more lvls for more points but not 1 for 1, maybe 2 lvls for 1 point then 3 lvls for 1 point. That kind of thing, so you're still 'advancing' towards Master of all.

 

Appreciate the wikipedia link, the other languages bit is quite interesting; had no idea so many cultures appear to view generalists in poor regard. I'm more in agreement with the longer version;

 

" "Jack of all trades, master of none, but oftentimes better than master of one" which refers to a person who is not the best at all skills, but is better than someone who is only a master of one."

 

Good stuff

 

In A17, I believe treasure maps was a way to give players skill points still after hitting max cap. I support rare high level quest providing addtional skills points. But as you stated mods will beable to adjust this to your likely if vanilla is not to your taste. I suspect balancing the skill/perk trees won't be fully complete until gold release so I am not expectly perfection for A17.

[TSRViper]

...snip

 

No loot respawn has been an option for years; I'd be super surprised if they removed it. Why would they? That could actually muddy the waters, as they won't know if fan reaction to loot in A17 is down to the change to zombie loot, or the change to the options

 

 

I think what they meant was they relied on Zed loot for a portion of the ‘general’ crafting materials you need regularly. If zeds don’t drop a lot of loot and you have loot respawn off, you will need to explore further as the game progresses.

 

This is my interpretation of what was said. I don’t necessarily agree with this as I remember Gazz or Fataal mentioning that the zeds will still drop loot, this is just saving us time looting the empty ones.

 

Notwithstanding what Roland has said, the testers are using a pre-experimental build so zed loot drops (or balancing) may not be in the version they’re testing so their experience may be quite different to what we see when A17e drops.

[DaVegaNL]

I had a question regarding many of these attributes. In many perks one can see that the 1st level adds +x% of something, and the 2nd level adds +y% of the same thing. Are these bonuses cumulative? As in; does the 2nd level of a perk add y*(x*start value)%?

[TSRViper]

I had a question regarding many of these attributes. In many perks one can see that the 1st level adds +x% of something, and the 2nd level adds +y% of the same thing. Are these bonuses cumulative? As in; does the 2nd level of a perk add y*(x*start value)%?

 

I doubt they would stack, it would be too OP.

[Eihwaz]

@MM

will there be a video for every attribute?

 

I ask to plan my uploads : /

 

/btw I dont need it, I see how the system works and would like to be surprised on release day