Glass Jars Question, A21

[OneManStanding]

I've read and heard over and over that glass jars have been Thanos-snapped out of existence in A21, and that we can now drink by hand out of available water sources and that buildable dew collectors are being brought in. But -- what I can't find clear information on is how we carry water from here on...? Instead of jars does it come in bottles, or do can we make a canteen? Sorry if I've missed some obvious bit of info somewhere. 

[Riamus]

It still works the same.  In your inventory, it will be represented the same.  You just don't have an empty bottle sitting around.  It is just like something like gasoline... You see it in a gas can but there aren't any empty gas cans in the game.

[zztong]

You won't be able to harvest water from a water source and carry it with you, except for perhaps a block of water in a bucket. Water that you loot, buy, or is produced by a dew collector can be carried and consumed. Drinking directly from a water source (block) will provide you murky water refreshment, but you cannot carry it away.

 

You may be one of us who finds it unusual and surprising not to be able to carry water away from a water source for a variety of reasons. I share the developer opinion that water scarcity in the early game could be an appealing element of play.

 

We're urged to give this approach an honest try in A21, which I plan to do. I encourage you to embrace the experimentation and eventually provide useful feedback.

[Crypted]

Instead of removing glass jars completely why not just make it to where you can't craft them, but can find them In loot and fill it up with water. I do like the idea of the dew collector though, so I'll at least give it a try. 

[Riamus]

36 minutes ago, Crypted said:

Instead of removing glass jars completely why not just make it to where you can't craft them, but can find them In loot and fill it up with water. I do like the idea of the dew collector though, so I'll at least give it a try. 

Probably because that doesn't greatly reduce glass jar counts and thereby make water more of a challenge like they want.  This puts water and drinks in line with other things that also do not have empty containers.  I think it is a good thing.  There really isn't a good reason to have them other than being used to them.

[Crypted]

Just now, Riamus said:

Probably because that doesn't greatly reduce glass jar counts and thereby make water more of a challenge like they want.  This puts water and drinks in line with other things that also do not have empty containers.  I think it is a good thing.  There really isn't a good reason to have them other than being used to them.

That's true I just hope that this is a good decision overall because I don't want things to keep changing and changing. 

[Riamus]

Changing a lot is not good.  I agree.  But considering they are putting the finishing touches on things, I doubt we will see many more significant changes unless something they do ends up being a flop as they said in the dev stream.  I'm not entirely sure that the changes to water are good, but I don't have a problem with removing the jars and cans.  They were never really needed for anything.  You could have had the same mechanics without them.  They only out a limit on the amount you could make, but were so easy to make that it didn't really matter.

[warmer]

I think having easy water access removed adds an interesting twist to the game. 

 

When I first started playing in A6 I'd die from food or water issues. I dont think thet has happened since A12 for me.

 

Food, water, and ammo are way too abundant on normal loot settings for my taste.

[bdubyah]

1 hour ago, warmer said:

Food, water, and ammo are way too abundant on normal loot settings for my taste.

This. 100% this.

[OneManStanding]

Just to be clear - I'm not complaining . They said there will be no more jars, but they've still mentioned water in your inventory and being used in recipes. How is that going to be represented? How do we take water on a night-long sojourn into the hospital or big factories or just to the next trader -- or can we simply not do that anymore? I've gotten the impression that you're still going to see a jar of water in your inventory but that it's going to be consumed (crunchy crunchy) along with the water. Again, might have missed some information somewhere.

 

 

 

[Gamida]

57 minutes ago, OneManStanding said:

Just to be clear - I'm not complaining . They said there will be no more jars, but they've still mentioned water in your inventory and being used in recipes. How is that going to be represented? How do we take water on a night-long sojourn into the hospital or big factories or just to the next trader -- or can we simply not do that anymore? I've gotten the impression that you're still going to see a jar of water in your inventory but that it's going to be consumed (crunchy crunchy) along with the water. Again, might have missed some information somewhere.

 

From my understanding you still will find murky water in loot and be able to buy it at trader or in vending machines. Just when water is used now the jar just goes poof.

 

[unholyjoe]

1 hour ago, OneManStanding said:

Just to be clear - I'm not complaining . They said there will be no more jars, but they've still mentioned water in your inventory and being used in recipes. How is that going to be represented? How do we take water on a night-long sojourn into the hospital or big factories or just to the next trader -- or can we simply not do that anymore? I've gotten the impression that you're still going to see a jar of water in your inventory but that it's going to be consumed (crunchy crunchy) along with the water. Again, might have missed some information somewhere.

 

 

 

we will try this again.

 

You still carry water around in a jar if you found it that way such as from cooking a jar of murky water or finding a vending machine with water in it or from your dew collector.

 

You just WILL NOT have or find nor create any empty jars. if you find or bought lots of water, you still carry it around in a jar as you always did. NO there is no normal way now in 7dtd to fetch water from anywhere to take back and cook it into drinking water.

 

Again, you will NOT normally find, buy or make any EMPTY jars in 7dtd. they have been removed from ALL recipes and loot lists.  one less item hogging up your inventory space when you need that space for magazines and books and whatever you else you deem important.

[meganoth]

2 hours ago, OneManStanding said:

Just to be clear - I'm not complaining . They said there will be no more jars, but they've still mentioned water in your inventory and being used in recipes. How is that going to be represented? How do we take water on a night-long sojourn into the hospital or big factories or just to the next trader -- or can we simply not do that anymore? I've gotten the impression that you're still going to see a jar of water in your inventory but that it's going to be consumed (crunchy crunchy) along with the water. Again, might have missed some information somewhere.

 

 

 

 

Just compare it to how you use gasoline or acid in this game. Those liquids are shown to be in containers but you never see or have or craft an empty gas or acid container. The icon is just to tell you this is acid through showing a liquid in a container labeled acid.

 

In other words it is assumed you always have enough containers with you to store liquids. Just like it is assumed you have to "go to the toilet" from time to time, but that detail is just not simulated in the game.

 

 

Edited April 17, 2023 by meganoth (see edit history)

[Gamida]

2 hours ago, unholyjoe said:

we will try this again.

 

You still carry water around in a jar if you found it that way such as from cooking a jar of murky water or finding a vending machine with water in it or from your dew collector.

 

You just WILL NOT have or find nor create any empty jars. if you find or bought lots of water, you still carry it around in a jar as you always did. NO there is no normal way now in 7dtd to fetch water from anywhere to take back and cook it into drinking water.

 

Again, you will NOT find, buy or make any EMPTY jars in 7dtd. they have been removed from ALL recipes and loot lists.  one less item hogging up your inventory space when you need that space for magazines and books and whatever you else you deem important.

 

Fixed it for you.

[Rotor]

What is A21?

 

/wiggle

[Roland]

57 minutes ago, Rotor said:

What is A21?

 

/wiggle

 

Until May? It is essentially an empty jar.

[Maharin]

6 hours ago, Roland said:

 

Until May? It is essentially an empty jar.

 

But is the air inside potable?

[unholyjoe]

12 minutes ago, Maharin said:

 

But is the air inside potable?

didnt you hear? the supposed zombie apocalypse outbreak that started all the zombie infestation was a germ in the air trapped inside of empty  jars so that is why the empty jars are/will be removed. ☠️

Edited April 18, 2023 by unholyjoe (see edit history)

[Maharin]

It's a good thing I boil my air before I breath it.

 

Could we get air collectors in the next alpha?

[Riamus]

4 hours ago, Maharin said:

It's a good thing I boil my air before I breath it.

 

Could we get air collectors in the next alpha?

You'll get those in the Moon Landing DLC.  Oh, wait... that was a hoax. 

[FA_Q2]

This was one of the changes that I did not like when it was announced as it really messed with a lot of things that work just fine.  However, after playing subnautica I have a new appreciation for the idea of normalizing how resources and items work.  It was a glaring hole in that game and made it feel amateurish as it was all over the place.

 

It makes sense that they would be normalizing the way it works across the various resources here.

 

 

 

[Vintorez]

I'm not convinced it's going to be received well even after players actually try it, having the jars just disappear and not be able to be used to fill up is the kind of thing that will just pull players out of the experience. Every time they go to drink it's just going to be like "Oh here's that thing the developers are making me do" rather than just being immersed in the survival aspect. In real life I can fill a jar or cup or whatever and boil it to make it drinkable, having the game literally bend reality to make that impossible won't feel good even if it functionally still works. 

 

IMO there are more simple, believable ways to achieve the dev's goals;

 

Make a glassblowing pipe required to craft jars and make it as rare/expensive as desired, like on par with a crucible. Now a forge + sand no longer equals infinite jars by day 3. Making the jars take longer to craft also would make bulk crafting take more commitment.

 

Have Tin Cans of water not stack anymore. Can't seal them, can't transport them efficiently. Logical and makes a player have to decide between inventory space or having water for travel without hindering them when rehydrating at base. Gives some player choice in how they want to manage their hydration in the early game.

 

Make most looted water be in tin cans (for murky) or in cracked jars (for pure) with cracked jars being lost when used, hydrating slightly less, and with a chance to cause a bit of damage. Intact jars could be somewhat rare loot that would be quite valuable for players who have yet to acquire a glassblowing pipe, slowly weaning off the need for inefficient cans of water.

 

I'm willing to give the new system a fair shake but I can't imagine it not feeling jarring (ha) whenever I need to manage my thirst meter and have to do so in these new somewhat roundabout ways.

Edited April 21, 2023 by Vintorez (see edit history)

[Ananais]

I have been holding off on forming an opinion until I have a play through on a21 vanilla, but honestly I cannot remember the last time I actually needed jars for survival, even with lower loot percentages and no respawn.

 

Now when I get to the point of mass producing glue, that could potentially call for a bit of modding, but we will see how it plays first!

 

 

[RipClaw]

47 minutes ago, Vintorez said:

Every time they go to drink it's just going to be like "Oh here's that thing the developers are making me do" rather than just being immersed in the survival aspect.

Actually, they only have to do one thing to get the immersion right. The character just has to throw the glass over his shoulder after drinking and you have to hear that the glass breaks.

 

[meganoth]

3 hours ago, Vintorez said:

I'm not convinced it's going to be received well even after players actually try it, having the jars just disappear and not be able to be used to fill up is the kind of thing that will just pull players out of the experience. Every time they go to drink it's just going to be like "Oh here's that thing the developers are making me do" rather than just being immersed in the survival aspect. In real life I can fill a jar or cup or whatever and boil it to make it drinkable, having the game literally bend reality to make that impossible won't feel good even if it functionally still works. 

 

IMO there are more simple, believable ways to achieve the dev's goals;

 

Make a glassblowing pipe required to craft jars and make it as rare/expensive as desired, like on par with a crucible. Now a forge + sand no longer equals infinite jars by day 3. Making the jars take longer to craft also would make bulk crafting take more commitment.

 

Just try to think a few minutes about ways to circumvent your own scheme (and your others). Maybe you will find holes large enough for a truck to drive through.

 

3 hours ago, Vintorez said:

 

Have Tin Cans of water not stack anymore. Can't seal them, can't transport them efficiently. Logical and makes a player have to decide between inventory space or having water for travel without hindering them when rehydrating at base. Gives some player choice in how they want to manage their hydration in the early game.

 

Make most looted water be in tin cans (for murky) or in cracked jars (for pure) with cracked jars being lost when used, hydrating slightly less, and with a chance to cause a bit of damage. Intact jars could be somewhat rare loot that would be quite valuable for players who have yet to acquire a glassblowing pipe, slowly weaning off the need for inefficient cans of water.

 

I'm willing to give the new system a fair shake but I can't imagine it not feeling jarring (ha) whenever I need to manage my thirst meter and have to do so in these new somewhat roundabout ways.

 

You have been using gas cans and acid bottles in very similar systems for years now without noticing anything jarring I would guess.