Please rescue Multiplayer in A20 !!!

[Matt115]

3 hours ago, kanaverum said:

 

"...it exist if you play in small group (4-8) too?"

Yes, every issue Zipcore posted at the top of this page has been reported to happen even in multiplayer with as few as 2 people. [edit; grammar]

 

I think everyone here believes that TFP will continue to do the best they can and try to deliver a great gaming experience.
But I also think that it helps to provide feedback. This is what everyone is trying to do in their own way.

 

I see that you're attempting to explain that TFP are going to work at it.

I also expect that TFP will work at improving the experience.
 

Since this thread is focused on 4 key issues with the multiplayer experience and you have already explained you lack knowledge on managing an open server for 7 Days to Die or playing 7 Days to Die with others, I can only assume that you're here to learn more about the experience?

 

Allow me to reset expectations a little and offer some clarifying information to help provide the extra context that seems to be missing:

1. I have personally experienced most of the issues Zipcore posted with as few as 2 players.
   1. And yes, that map never had more than 2 players play on it at any time, ever.
   2. From the beginning, TFP described their ideal game as "Walking Dead + Minecraft with your friends". Multiplayer has always been a central part of the experience and represents the ultimate target of the game.
   3. The only issue I haven't personally encountered yet is the floating/base-destroying tree. I am aware of other admins/servers/communities struggling with this bug, though.
2. While TFP officially support single player and peer-to-peer 'friendly co-op' multiplayer, they do also officially support dedicated servers.
   1. In fact, they deploy a dedicated server build with every release to Steam and this is what we use to host these games.
   2. It's entirely understandable that someone who only plays single player would not be aware of this, but now you know.
3. TFP actually support up to 16 since A20's release.
   1. You can click to start a new game right now in A20 and see this for yourself: 8 players remains the default, but you can click the right arrow (since A20) and select 16 players as an officially supported option for peer-to-peer games. So if you decide to play multiplayer one day, you can invite 15 of your friends (or maybe even more, if 7DTD supports more by then).
   2. Sure, 7 Days to Die will never become Rust with 300 players per server and that's ok. We want 7 Days to Die to be 7 Days to Die.
4. No software or game will ever be perfect. TFP were very kind to support official streams of modding. So as modders and sever admins, we spend a fair amount of our free time fixing bugs to help support the intended experiences that TFP were going for and sharing those fixes/mods with others.
   1. They didn't ask us to do this. We just started doing it on our own because we love 7 Days to Die. 
   2. Zipcore has released dozens of multiplayer fixes and has helped a lot of admins and players out as a result.
   3. The issues Zipcore posted are the kinds of issues that cannot be modded or fixed with modding.
   4. TFP are smart people, but nobody can know all things at all times. They ask for our feedback and this post is one way that the community seeks to provide feedback. Yeah, it seems a little hostile. But I hope you can appreciate that it's coming from a good place: from a love for 7 Days to Die and the desire for it to remain as one of the best zombie survival multiplayer experiences.

Anyhow, hopefully this helps to provide a foundation for what and why we're discussing in this thread.

Well i played with my friend and i hadn't such bugs since A16-A17 ( only bigger bug is "invisible" tree if you are few metres away from them.

 

1.2 yep but small 8 people max 

2.1 and 2.2 - if you mean rent of outside server --> this is not offical one

3. Still - as few people said -- > they test for 8 people. if there is more that 8 --> it's your risk. In older MP game ( i'm not sure which one) offical safe number was 32 player but you could increase even to 128 but on your own risk

4. And... that's their choose what they doing with free time. So - if you buy game in EA you can expect that there will be tons of bugs, updates can change a lot etc. - Well now updates are rare , that's is unfortunatly true and... that's problem. If updates were offten - like in MC. This... would be no problem. Why? if there was after 2-3 month new version of game --> this mean mods had to be updated often because a lot of things changes.  So there woudn't be problems like this becasue... everyone will know that's will be "stable" only for few months. 

And about last one - that's coming from bad place.  Just check older alpha like a11 - hard, dark, a lot of corpses ( you can that now is more corpses but -  now you don't have corpses radomly on streets), food spoiled, corpse decying, loot stage etc. and it was scrapped because "we want to have fun with friends so X is too hard". 7dtd had to be one of the most climatix 7dtd but what we have now? mad max with zombies.  And 7dtd in now so far from WD - i don't mean headshot zombie. I mean - art style, zombie types. loot etc.  you can say "you are frustrated" and yeah it's true because 7dtd had soo good base but so many people were " it's bad because unfun in MP", good game don't have to be fun to be good game- 

 

[Zipcore]

On 6/4/2022 at 7:48 PM, Matt115 said:

1. But can you?

 

Yes sir!

[Matt115]

1 hour ago, Zipcore said:

 

Yes sir!

So.. do it. And after that publish this and if this will be working good there is a chance that TFP will ask you about that

[Zipcore]

3 hours ago, Matt115 said:

So.. do it. And after that publish this and if this will be working good there is a chance that TFP will ask you about that

They don't like the region filter they could simply register all servers in the same region and make a pseudoregion search field for regions if they like to keep that. They don't need my code to fix this issue for everyone.

And yes it works well. Had to figure 2 things out which I could solve with little tricks.

I would be more interested if TFP would implement the fixes of my mods which solve major issues in this game and oh boy I fixed a lot and there is still so much more.

They can hire me if they want and I fix the bugs, I'm good in bug hunting, I would simply prefer to fix them directly in the game, mods should be no permanent solution.

[Roland]

11 minutes ago, Zipcore said:

mods should be no permanent solution.

 

Nobody from TFP has yet claimed that they are finished so there is no reason to think that mods are planned as permanent solutions.

[Matt115]

13 minutes ago, Zipcore said:

They don't like the region filter they could simply register all servers in the same region and make a pseudoregion search field for regions if they like to keep that. They don't need my code to fix this issue for everyone.

And yes it works well. Had to figure 2 things out which I could solve with little tricks.

I would be more interested if TFP would implement the fixes of my mods which solve major issues in this game and oh boy I fixed a lot and there is still so much more.

They can hire me if they want and I fix the bugs, I'm good in bug hunting, I would simply prefer to fix them directly in the game, mods should be no permanent solution.

Well... this is not solution.  This is connected with MS and steam versions of game - if manage to do this + play with someone using gamepass/MS store version you can say that you solved this problem

 

Your solution probably will not work in crossplay scenario

[Grandpa Minion]

1 hour ago, Roland said:

Nobody from TFP has yet claimed that they are finished 

Did you not read what he was saying? #zipcore "I would be more interested if TFP would implement the fixes of my mods which solve major issues in this game"

Most anybody who has seen his fixs knows exactly how huge they are- especially those veteran players like myself who been around X amount of years. I have witnessed many other coders and modders try to fix what he has been able to do but failed. The way this guy can fix bugs TFP would be foolish to not listen to what he has to say.

 

[Roland]

9 hours ago, Grandpa Minion said:

Did you not read what he was saying? #zipcore "I would be more interested if TFP would implement the fixes of my mods which solve major issues in this game"

Most anybody who has seen his fixs knows exactly how huge they are- especially those veteran players like myself who been around X amount of years. I have witnessed many other coders and modders try to fix what he has been able to do but failed. The way this guy can fix bugs TFP would be foolish to not listen to what he has to say.

 

 

Sure I read it. How does that change my response? What does that have to do with my response? Has zipcore put in an application with The Fun Pimps? I have no idea. Maybe they should. 

 

Regardless, the idea that anyone's current mod for Alpha 20 bugs represents a permanent fix since TFP isn't planning on doing anything themselves is ridiculous. TFP is still fixing bugs and still developing their game and until they say they are done then all mods can be considered temporary fixes until TFP gets to it themselves. 

[meganoth]

On 6/7/2022 at 10:01 AM, kanaverum said:

 

"...it exist if you play in small group (4-8) too?"

Yes, every issue Zipcore posted at the top of this page has been reported to happen even in multiplayer with as few as 2 people. [edit; grammar]

 

I think everyone here believes that TFP will continue to do the best they can and try to deliver a great gaming experience.
But I also think that it helps to provide feedback. This is what everyone is trying to do in their own way.

 

I see that you're attempting to explain that TFP are going to work at it.

I also expect that TFP will work at improving the experience.
 

Since this thread is focused on 4 key issues with the multiplayer experience and you have already explained you lack knowledge on managing an open server for 7 Days to Die or playing 7 Days to Die with others, I can only assume that you're here to learn more about the experience?

 

Allow me to reset expectations a little and offer some clarifying information to help provide the extra context that seems to be missing:

1. I have personally experienced most of the issues Zipcore posted with as few as 2 players.
   1. And yes, that map never had more than 2 players play on it at any time, ever.
   2. From the beginning, TFP described their ideal game as "Walking Dead + Minecraft with your friends". Multiplayer has always been a central part of the experience and represents the ultimate target of the game.
   3. The only issue I haven't personally encountered yet is the floating/base-destroying tree. I am aware of other admins/servers/communities struggling with this bug, though.
2. While TFP officially support single player and peer-to-peer 'friendly co-op' multiplayer, they do also officially support dedicated servers.
   1. In fact, they deploy a dedicated server build with every release to Steam and this is what we use to host these games.
   2. It's entirely understandable that someone who only plays single player would not be aware of this, but now you know.

 

Sorry to butt in on this conversation. I am maybe nitpicking here, but this sounds a bit wrong:

 

I personally use a dedicated server and I only play with invited friends co-op. But you seem to deduct from the existence of dedicated server builds that open servers are supported. And that can't be done, even though you are surely right that open servers are officially supported. A much better sign of that support would be the included server browser in the client.

 

Also I don't see what the distinction between peer-to-peer and multiplayer has to do with any of the issues.

 

On 6/7/2022 at 10:01 AM, kanaverum said:

 

1. TFP actually support up to 16 since A20's release.
   1. You can click to start a new game right now in A20 and see this for yourself: 8 players remains the default, but you can click the right arrow (since A20) and select 16 players as an officially supported option for peer-to-peer games. So if you decide to play multiplayer one day, you can invite 15 of your friends (or maybe even more, if 7DTD supports more by then).
   2. Sure, 7 Days to Die will never become Rust with 300 players per server and that's ok. We want 7 Days to Die to be 7 Days to Die.

 

I don't have seen any information that TFP changed its stance about max number of players, though I might have missed it. I seem to remember that only recently some dev mentioned it was still 8, but don't ask me about a link and I myself don't trust my memory here.

 

But you try to conclude from a client setting that more than 8 players are supported. But in the dedicated server we could allow more than 8 players for ages without that meaning that it was officially supported. Maybe ask in the Dev Diary if you really want to know.

 

On 6/7/2022 at 10:01 AM, kanaverum said:

1. No software or game will ever be perfect. TFP were very kind to support official streams of modding. So as modders and sever admins, we spend a fair amount of our free time fixing bugs to help support the intended experiences that TFP were going for and sharing those fixes/mods with others.
   1. They didn't ask us to do this. We just started doing it on our own because we love 7 Days to Die. 
   2. Zipcore has released dozens of multiplayer fixes and has helped a lot of admins and players out as a result.
   3. The issues Zipcore posted are the kinds of issues that cannot be modded or fixed with modding.
   4. TFP are smart people, but nobody can know all things at all times. They ask for our feedback and this post is one way that the community seeks to provide feedback. Yeah, it seems a little hostile. But I hope you can appreciate that it's coming from a good place: from a love for 7 Days to Die and the desire for it to remain as one of the best zombie survival multiplayer experiences.

Anyhow, hopefully this helps to provide a foundation for what and why we're discussing in this thread.

 

[Zipcore]

21 hours ago, Roland said:

 

Nobody from TFP has yet claimed that they are finished so there is no reason to think that mods are planned as permanent solutions.

 

I hope we all agree on that.

 

9 hours ago, Roland said:

 

Sure I read it. How does that change my response? What does that have to do with my response? Has zipcore put in an application with The Fun Pimps? I have no idea. Maybe they should. 

 

Regardless, the idea that anyone's current mod for Alpha 20 bugs represents a permanent fix since TFP isn't planning on doing anything themselves is ridiculous. TFP is still fixing bugs and still developing their game and until they say they are done then all mods can be considered temporary fixes until TFP gets to it themselves. 

 

Thank you.

[Grandpa Minion]

12 hours ago, Roland said:

How does that change my response?

Thats the thing your not getting. You can change your response by merely just stating "his mod is the only fix known to fix some issues" since you already stated "Regardless, the idea that anyone's current mod for Alpha 20 bugs represents a permanent fix since TFP isn't planning on doing anything themselves is ridiculous. " <--Thats the whole point! its been 7years and they still havent fixed it. What is the community supposed to do wait another 7 years? Ya thats why tfp have lost trust by so many in the community.

[Matt115]

1 hour ago, Grandpa Minion said:

Thats the thing your not getting. You can change your response by merely just stating "his mod is the only fix known to fix some issues" since you already stated "Regardless, the idea that anyone's current mod for Alpha 20 bugs represents a permanent fix since TFP isn't planning on doing anything themselves is ridiculous. " <--Thats the whole point! its been 7years and they still havent fixed it. What is the community supposed to do wait another 7 years? Ya thats why tfp have lost trust by so many in the community.

Honestly idk about which bugs you talk about but... - in one alpha there was strange bug - some POI respawned on "cliffs" so after destroing a door they would just collapse. Now there is such bug because RWG was fixed. 7DTD will be finished maybe even in next year

[Grandpa Minion]

30 minutes ago, Matt115 said:

7DTD will be finished maybe even in next year

Don't kid yourself. A21 may be out by next year but the game being finished by next year is laughable

[Matt115]

10 minutes ago, Grandpa Minion said:

Don't kid yourself. A21 may be out by next year but the game being finished by next year is laughable

It's possible. I don't mean it will be looking like you want to looks like. I mean will be finished  as "exit  of early access". They have just add bandit and water overhoul. Rest can be fixed after early access

Edited June 16, 2022 by Matt115 (see edit history)

[Roland]

4 hours ago, Grandpa Minion said:

Thats the thing your not getting

 

What you don't get is that I ignore the parts of a post I have no issue with. So he's fixed bugs through the process of modding that the devs haven't fixed yet. Great. Bravo and thanks. That is exactly what modders can do and have been doing for years and not just for this game. I never disputed that fact. That's all good and like all modders who enhance the current game in ways that give people greater enjoyment, I am in awe of their willingness to do it and not just once but over and over again through multiple updates that break what they had before.

 

4 hours ago, Grandpa Minion said:

You can change your response by merely just stating "his mod is the only fix known to fix some issues"

 

But that would have made no sense as a response to the part that I quoted. That was the only part of his post I had a quibble with and only because he was applying it TFP prematurely. I agree that modders shouldn't have to be the ones to permanently fix bugs. I don't agree that we've reached that point.

 

Zipcore: Modding should never be the permanent fix to bugs that the developers should have fixed in code.

Me (as directed by Grandpa): Your mod is the only fix known to fix some issues.

 

Yeah....that just doesn't work for me since my whole point was that so far not one mod can be considered the permanent fix for any bugs. In 2023 or 2024 if TFP says, "We're done and moving on" and there are still some major bugs that are only fixed via mods and TFP has no interest in dealing with them-- then at that point will I join the lament that it is a shame that mods are the only permanent solution.

 

I guess go back and read the part I quoted and how I responded to it because the way you think I should have responded is janky. Even Zipcore, himself, understood what I was talking about and thanked me (I'm supposing because what I said gives him hope that the devs are planning to fix the bugs he's been fighting with mods). Since the convo was between him and I over that part maybe you can step back from defensive mode a bit. In no way was I dissing Zipcore or minimizing his contribution. 

 

I clearly stated that we are not to the point yet where we can call Zipcore's mods (which is the only one) fixing the bugs it they do as the "permanent solution". TFP is still on deck.

 

4 hours ago, Grandpa Minion said:

-Thats the whole point! its been 7years and they still havent fixed it. What is the community supposed to do wait another 7 years? Ya thats why tfp have lost trust by so many in the community.

 

It hasn't been 7 years. It has been almost 9 years and their priorities are their own. The community should know that they signed on to a game that is still in development and members of that community should hopefully get that their choices are A) live with the unfinished nature of the game B) mod temporary solutions that can make playing better while waiting for TFP to act or C) shelve the game until it's done.

 

I've met quite a few people over the years who reveal themselves to not have the patience, understanding, and temperament to enjoy playing a game that is indev. Maybe that's you. If this game ends up taking 10 years or 12 years to finish it doesn't matter. The full game hasn't been released yet and you sound to me to clearly be a "full release game" kind of person.

Edited June 16, 2022 by Roland (see edit history)

[Matt115]

24 minutes ago, Roland said:

 

What you don't get is that I ignore the parts of a post I have no issue with. So he's fixed bugs through the process of modding that the devs haven't fixed yet. Great. Bravo and thanks. That is exactly what modders can do and have been doing for years and not just for this game. I never disputed that fact. That's all good and like all modders who enhance the current game in ways that give people greater enjoyment, I am in awe of their willingness to do it and not just once but over and over again through multiple updates that break what they had before.

 

 

But that would have made no sense as a response to the part that I quoted. That was the only part of his post I had a quibble with and only because he was applying it TFP prematurely. I agree that modders shouldn't have to be the ones to permanently fix bugs. I don't agree that we've reached that point.

 

Zipcore: Modding should never be the permanent fix to bugs that the developers should have fixed in code.

Me (as directed by Grandpa): Your mod is the only fix known to fix some issues.

 

Yeah....that just doesn't work for me since my whole point was that so far not one mod can be considered the permanent fix for any bugs. In 2023 or 2024 if TFP says, "We're done and moving on" and there are still some major bugs that are only fixed via mods and TFP has no interest in dealing with them-- then at that point will I join the lament that it is a shame that mods are the only permanent solution.

 

I guess go back and read the part I quoted and how I responded to it because the way you think I should have responded is janky. Even Zipcore, himself, understood what I was talking about and thanked me (I'm supposing because what I said gives him hope that the devs are planning to fix the bugs he's been fighting with mods). Since the convo was between him and I over that part maybe you can step back from defensive mode a bit. In no way was I dissing Zipcore or minimizing his contribution. 

 

I clearly stated that we are not to the point yet where we can call Zipcore's mods (which is the only one) fixing the bugs it they do as the "permanent solution". TFP is still on deck.

 

 

It hasn't been 7 years. It has been almost 9 years and their priorities are their own. The community should know that they signed on to a game that is still in development and members of that community should hopefully get that their choices are A) live with the unfinished nature of the game B) mod temporary solutions that can make playing better while waiting for TFP to act or C) shelve the game until it's done.

 

I've met quite a few people over the years who reveal themselves to not have the patience, understanding, and temperament to enjoy playing a game that is indev. Maybe that's you. If this game ends up taking 10 years or 12 years to finish it doesn't matter. The full game hasn't been released yet and you sound to me to clearly be a "full release game" kind of person.

I usually argue with you but this time i totaly agree with you. There a famouse RTS Half live 2 mod and it was finished after 13 years. 13 years for free mod is just wow. So that's why i know that it take time to make things. I can complain about gameplay/art style but i totaly agree about bugs and development time

[Grandpa Minion]

6 hours ago, Roland said:

 

I've met quite a few people over the years who reveal themselves to not have the patience, understanding, and temperament to enjoy playing a game that is indev. Maybe that's you. If this game ends up taking 10 years or 12 years to finish it doesn't matter. The full game hasn't been released yet and you sound to me to clearly be a "full release game" kind of person.

lol i had to laugh at this one for sure. "full release kind of person" doesn't wait 20000+hours for a game to complete. If you really want to know how i feel about it im an old man and i don't have time to wait another x many years odds are ill be dead by than.

[Roland]

1 hour ago, Grandpa Minion said:

lol i had to laugh at this one for sure. "full release kind of person" doesn't wait 20000+hours for a game to complete. If you really want to know how i feel about it im an old man and i don't have time to wait another x many years odds are ill be dead by than.

You think number of hours played means you are playing with the attitude and mindset that the game is still in development?

 

We’ve established well enough in that other “gone wrong” thread that people will continue to do what makes them unhappy for unfathomable reasons.
 

My humble 4000ish hours have been amazing because I play with the understanding the game isn’t finished. I use mods with gratitude for what they can offer in the meantime. I still hope for a complete polished game in the future.

I’d rather that than 22000 hours filled with resentment over what still hasn’t been fixed, anger that a mod is being used as a bandaid, and cynicism about the game’s future. 
 

It’s cool that you are such a veteran of the game but it just goes to show there is no correlation between time played and the type of early access attitude someone will have. 

[Sal]

1 hour ago, Roland said:

We’ve established well enough in that other “gone wrong” thread that people will continue to do what makes them unhappy for unfathomable reasons.

"We have"......Or was that just you trying to push your blatantly biased opinions onto others due to the fact that TFP can do no wrong in your eyes. Stop with the BS. 

 

 

[JCrook1028]

9 hours ago, Sal said:

your blatantly biased opinion

All opinions are biased.... that's the very definition of the term after all.

[Roland]

And isn’t “blatantly” biased simply evidence of my open and truthful discourse?  Nobody can accuse me of hidden agendas. 😉
 

By the way @Sal I do post criticism of TFP decisions and have done so recently. You just can’t recognize it because it is done with respect and without toxicity and with the understanding that they aren’t finished yet. 
 

Honestly, why haven’t I made your ignore list yet? 😂

[Sal]

16 hours ago, Roland said:

And isn’t “blatantly” biased simply evidence of my open and truthful discourse?  Nobody can accuse me of hidden agendas. 😉

When a person has to resort to irrelevant semantics like this instead of addressing the initial post (when you were referring to yourself to "we have") then it's a clear sign of defeat without ever wanting to admit it.

 

So lets try this again and I'll be more direct here (as if it wasn't already).

 

You said this above....

 

Quote

We’ve established well enough in that other “gone wrong” thread that people will continue to do what makes them unhappy for unfathomable reasons.

This was a reference to the other thread and you said "we've established".  So tell me......who is "we"?

 

 

16 hours ago, Roland said:

 By the way @Sal I do post criticism of TFP decisions and have done so recently. You just can’t recognize it because it is done with respect and without toxicity and with the understanding that they aren’t finished yet.

 

See, once again, pushing your opinions onto others and trying to pass them off as facts.  Thanks for further proving my point once again. 

 

Here's another theory as to why I don't recognize it. IF, and that's a big IF, they are too few and far between the amount of time you spend arguing with people who don't like certain aspects of the game and trying to convince them that your are right and they are wrong based on your obvious one-sided perspective.

 

Here's another question since you said "truthful discourse". Out of your last 100 posts, how many of them are criticizing TFP?  That's what I thought.

You try too hard to pass your opinions off as clear facts and use your "super moderator" title to push your agenda and you know it.  Stop with the BS. You know there are sheep like the BFT2000, or whoever the hell her name is, will do whatever to kiss your ass and you use it to your advantage. You have been called out on this crap for years by many others than myself and where there's smoke there's fire.

[BFT2020]

4 hours ago, Sal said:

You know there are sheep like the BFT2000, or whoever the hell her name is, will do whatever to kiss your ass and you use it to your advantage.

 

Baaaa

[Roland]

7 hours ago, Sal said:

This was a reference to the other thread and you said "we've established".  So tell me......who is "we"?

 

Well...me, and No_Name_Idea, and even Soren Johnsen (whom No Name quoted), and some others probably on both sides of the overall argument that things have gone wrong since what Soren Johnsen said is pretty widely accepted as truth and I was basically saying the same thing. The famous quote is: "given the opportunity, players will optimize the fun out of a game". So..yeah...we established that players will continue to do what will make them unhappy for unfathomable reasons. And as the thread clearly showed, even when presented with the idea that players might choose to self limit themselves in order to preserve their fun, there were some who continued to state that they were forced to optimize their fun away since the opportunity to do so was there.

 

Since No_Name_Idea was posting counter arguments to mine on certain opinions, it is fair to say that my statement about "we" is pretty accurate. It wasn't just "me and my fans" as you might say.

 

Oh, and Kuosimodo showed up with some emoji reactions so we can include them too

 

7 hours ago, Sal said:

You have been called out on this crap for years by many others than myself and where there's smoke there's fire.

 

Out of the last 100 people directly addressing me in a post, how many of them have called me out on this crap? That's what I thought. lol

 

 

You seem very antagonistic towards me and are even beginning to insult others and call people names. I haven't invoked my super moderator status once in any of the back and forth debating that has been going on. Nobody who opposes my POV has been punished in any way. That's the way it works around here. You can be critical and you can share your different perspective and as long as it is done respectfully there is no harm and no foul. But as soon as you cross over the line into toxic posting, you're done (this is me invoking my super moderator status finally btw). You can push your own opinion about the game and remain but if you don't keep your anger in check you will be limited in your posting privileges.

 

7 hours ago, Sal said:

Stop with the BS. You know there are sheep like the BFT2000, or whoever the hell her name is, will do whatever to kiss your ass and you use it to your advantage.

 

Just in case you didn't grasp what I was talking about, it is right here in this line. This is pretty insulting language and BFT2000 laughed it off but there is no need to cross such lines. You've been insulting me in your last few posts directed at me accusing me of using my power to push my opinion and such. Interestingly, if I was really that type of a person, none of your posts calling me out would ever be seen and yet they are all still there and you are still here and with not even one single infraction on your record ever despite more than one post directly criticizing me and not even always in a civil manner. I just don't see the evidence that I'm using my super moderator status to stop you...like, at all.

 

But, I will use that status to stop you from insulting others if you don't reign it in. 

[Rotor]

Roh Roh!