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How about this penalty? Whenever you "die" you get "saved" from the nearest Trader. You won't really get saved directly you just need to show it like with a paper being in your inventory which says you're in his dept. So you must pay a price of dukes that depends on your level and gamestage. Something like [Level x Gamestage]. As long as you haven't paid it you can't buy/sell things to him or it's way more expensive and your selling get's like nothing.

And in later Alphas or Beta when the bandits are added you can add something like a period of time (best would be 7 days ;) ) where you need to pay it back or else they will start hunting your Base at daytime. So like a bloodmoon horde just with bandits and at daytime and every day for about 4 hours. This would also fix the problem with having too much dukes.

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This game used to be fun, now it tends to get more annoying every new alpha. I gave up on alpha 19, it's trash. Edit: I was angry when I siad trash, that's a little too harsh.

Yeah but this didnt fixed the initial problem of players getting bored. All it made is to shift around payers getting bored from engame to players getting bored from reaching endgame.   The

I appreciate your feedback and your perspective. I hope the devs don’t listen to you (people like you) this time around. Every Alpha the Pimps flirt with the survival genre in regards to penalties and

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I think DP is extremely flexible now.  Lose stuff or drop bag run retrieve or respawn with stuff.  Buffs.xml can be customized to your liking.  If you are unserious in the game you will take risks, not be prepared for encounters, not have required meds available, lack food, be out of stamina, and die often.  The people who are, "Meh, I'll just eat glass."  aren't playing a survival game.  They want to be playing CS versus bots.  

 

In my current MP game (Nitro custom 10K with Compopack46 ), at Level 29, GS 38 I have 1 death when I didn't see the land mine.  I have DP set minimal to respawn with my stuff, but I don't like to die.  In fact, I hate it.  I have watched many MP vids of players caught in a death loop because the zombies have over run the spawn, and the player re-awakens defenseless.  No fun.  The XP debuff is bad enough.  But, tolerating deaths in a survival game is just tolerating losing.

 

My chopper is a mobile EMT...  and I keep a roll of band-aids on the hot bar so I don't bleed out getting to the bike.  My team mates tend to be the bull in the china shop kind, go in pull the whole POI, and light em up.  While I tend to be a sniper with junk turrets (eventually) and find a defensible position and then pick them off from a distance mostly holding a fall back position.  When I'm solo I think the same way, I have a fall back position, then press point stealthily avoiding noise.  My optimal encounter is when I ghost all the zombies without awakening them.  The worst case using my tactic is I wake up too many, fall back and hold.  If I must, I'm not too proud to retreat. 

 

We had a level 1 buried supplies quest next to...  and ended up running after the 20th zombie climbed out of a hidden well of hell...

 

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20 minutes ago, Kandrathe said:

I have DP set minimal to respawn with my stuff, but I don't like to die.  In fact, I hate it.  I have watched many MP vids of players caught in a death loop because the zombies have over run the spawn, and the player re-awakens defenseless.  No fun.  The XP debuff is bad enough.  But, tolerating deaths in a survival game is just tolerating losing.

Yeah, in fact, the XP debuff combined with the loss of pride when losing, are so bad that some people cannot carry all that shame around and get depressed to the point they actually eat glass (since seppuku hasn't been implemented yet) :( 

 

Edited by RestInPieces (see edit history)
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1 hour ago, Kandrathe said:

If you are unserious in the game you will take risks, not be prepared for encounters, not have required meds available, lack food, be out of stamina, and die often.  The people who are, "Meh, I'll just eat glass."  aren't playing a survival game.  They want to be playing CS versus bots. 

I don't really care about how other people want to play the game. I just care about how unintentional death solves MY problems in an instant when I wanted to solve them through the gameplay designed into the game. There are splints, medkits, sewing kits, vitamins, pain killers, health bars, honey, and antibiotics for a reason and purpose. Death circumvents all of those intentional designs.

 

When I've got bloodmoon breathing down my neck and then I get sidelined by an infection with not antibiotics it makes the game interesting and urgent because now I have this unintended quest to remedy my infection while also needing to prep for horde night. THAT is fun and so while I'm frantically questing and chopping stumps and make a mistake and die....I don't want all of that instantly solved like it never happened. 

 

I don't want to get robbed of the victory of handling my immediate injuries and still getting my objectives done. I feel like the devs should protect players like me by putting some more thought into death erasing status effects. I don't want them doing it to stop other players who bought a survival game to play it non-survival.

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1 hour ago, Kandrathe said:

In my current MP game (Nitro custom 10K with Compopack46 ), at Level 29, GS 38 I have 1 death when I didn't see the land mine.  I have DP set minimal to respawn with my stuff, but I don't like to die.  In fact, I hate it.  I have watched many MP vids of players caught in a death loop because the zombies have over run the spawn, and the player re-awakens defenseless.  No fun.  The XP debuff is bad enough.  But, tolerating deaths in a survival game is just tolerating losing.

The  horde night death loop is a solved problem in A19. The horde loses your scent if you die on horde night.

 

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1 hour ago, meganoth said:

The  horde night death loop is a solved problem in A19. The horde loses your scent if you die on horde night.

 

As of about 3-4 weeks ago, horde night death loop was still a thing on Darkness Falls Mod. Always have to have a retreat plan.  Mine is to have a bridge to a solid building from my hoard base where I can just cheese out the rest of the night being unreachable on the roof.

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All that it would take is a switch in the settings, that you can flip to "Death erases all abnormal statuses" to "Keep said statuses active after respawning from death". Easy 🤷🏻‍♂️

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1 hour ago, Kyonshi said:

Easy 🤷🏻‍♂️

All that it would take is a team of developers to come to consensus that making a switch in the settings to "keep statuses active after respawning from death" is a worthwhile use of time and resources so that they assign the task to someone. Hard🤷🏻‍♂️

Edited by Roland (see edit history)
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On 11/19/2020 at 7:37 PM, Axonius said:

As of about 3-4 weeks ago, horde night death loop was still a thing on Darkness Falls Mod. Always have to have a retreat plan.  Mine is to have a bridge to a solid building from my hoard base where I can just cheese out the rest of the night being unreachable on the roof.

mods can break/change mechanic

 

in vanilla A19 they lose tracking when you die

but if any zombie detect you by seeing you or getting shot blood moon will return to normal giving you choice to hide or return to battle

Edited by alanea (see edit history)
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I feel like the issue with the Death Penalty/Reward isn't that makes Critical Ailments pointless and their remedies redundant... but rather the ailments are too long, so players do find trading the minimal XP penalty (and the teleport can be a boon or flaw) for a cure-all a profitable trade. Now, one could just retain the ailments after death and just deny the trade, but then death becomes rather annoying (and if you can't recover or get multiple status effects before death... because crit-chains appear to be a thing it might playing unenjoyable) which could lead to them just not playing the game. It has be a careful balance.

Instead they could make the trade more unfavorable towards death (either reduce annoyance of ailments or increase the death penalty), or they could go Rogue-Like and make dying a feature, and instead having survival be sort of a challenge mode. By the way... how you die could also be used to determine a respawn penalty (ie. die by thirst or hunger... stamina penalty, die by fall damage... stealth/movement penalty, combat damage... reduced damage, etc.)

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they definitely need  to stay through they are punishment for mistake ...  but not severely crippling

death is supposed to be punishment  ... not reward or intentional behavior

 

for lenght .. each of them have multiple ways to cure them by common consumables  raid any popnpills and you  have  5-10  items to cure each one on day  1 even withou pharmacies ... all of them are extremely common in loot  (recipe for vitamins would be nice tho)

 

1-2  hours isnt that much ... especially considering there is  perk that drastically  reduce this duration ...

yes that perk used by 0% people who whine about crits on forum

 

sadly nothing can help people who refuse to use mechanics they have to counter crits .. and then go complain on forum about crits thats same as using wrench for combat and complaining how weak it is

 

btw heavy armor counter them easily ... with maxed one  i  die  2-3 times on average before getting debuff iam sorry  but if  you get  300-450  damage so often  it bothers you then you need to adress gameplay to start with ( not to mention many people  abuse padded  armor  with bugged negative stealth penalty and 0 stamina penalty  and thats literaly asking for all ailments in game )

 

problem with  7 days is extremely accesible healing

passive heal .. food heal painkillers even single aloe heals 30hp  in a18  you could go through  thousands of hp per poi and just spam easily obtainable items to counter it ...  A19  discourage people from getting too many hits by small chance of crit and thats definitely positive change

 

not to mention lacerations have very small impact and concussion is more annoying than impactfull

Edited by alanea (see edit history)
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On 11/16/2020 at 9:48 AM, meganoth said:

I agree, but maybe new players don't have good ideas how to proceed in such a situation. So here are a few hints:

 

Obviously you need to be more careful. In essence lose some time and efficiency to play it safer.

1) Always have a path in view to exit the POI at signs of danger. Even slowed you are faster than basic zombies and can run away from them around the house without failing the quest. Shooting them with a bow outside the POI is always easier than inside the POI

2) Block doors. You can put a wood frame into a door (and upgrade it) before shooting at anything inside. Makes it possible to use the bow even on approaching zombies.

3) Block doors with spike traps. Even better, you might also damage them. 

4) Add ladders to high walls, with the lowest two rungs missing. This gives you a defensible position. Lure zombies to this room, kill them from above.

5) Do you already have a turret but only use it on special occasions or never. Well, this is such a special occasion

 

My approach has been to focus on survival in early game, investing in strength, health, stamina.  I try to get the best scrap (heavy) armor I can find.  I tend to favor investing in clubs for early melee before I find guns.  About level 30 I start working to my combat specialization(s) ( int, str, agi, or mixed).  I might switch to light armor then before investing in any heavy armor perk.

 

Your list is excellent tactics, and especially to plan a fallback position.  I try to prepare for the rush every time I open a door.  My wife and 2 boys are more the "kick down the door and unload the shotty until nothing is moving" which becomes a problem later when many sprinting, irradiated specials don't die very quickly.  I try to keep bandages on me always, then splints, vitamins, & antibiotics in my vehicle storage.

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