Jump to content

Edit History

Please note that revisions older than 365 days are pruned and will no longer show here
n2n1

n2n1

51 minutes ago, khzmusik said:

/////

I personally agree that the issue is not randomness but perceived randomness. I think of it as the "playlist shuffle" problem. Many music apps shuffle a playlist by just choosing a random song in the playlist. But that means it's a near-certainty that many songs will be played multiple times, before all the songs in the playlist are played at least once.

 

What most people expect is "shuffling" like a deck of cards - they don't want the songs to be randomized, they want the song order to be randomized. If they hear the same song twice, they think the shuffle "isn't working."

//////

 

Right.... Only in our case it turned out that the algorithm designed to solve "imaginary repetitions "generates "real repetitions".

I would like the developers to pay attention to this.

And what algorithm they will eventually choose-we should not care.  And what algorithm they will eventually choose-we should not care.

n2n1

n2n1

48 minutes ago, khzmusik said:

/////

I personally agree that the issue is not randomness but perceived randomness. I think of it as the "playlist shuffle" problem. Many music apps shuffle a playlist by just choosing a random song in the playlist. But that means it's a near-certainty that many songs will be played multiple times, before all the songs in the playlist are played at least once.

 

What most people expect is "shuffling" like a deck of cards - they don't want the songs to be randomized, they want the song order to be randomized. If they hear the same song twice, they think the shuffle "isn't working."

//////

 

Right.... Only in our case it turned out that the algorithm designed to solve "imaginary repetitions "generates "real repetitions".

I would like the developers to pay attention to this.

And what algorithm they will eventually choose-we should not care.  And what algorithm they will eventually choose-we should not care.

n2n1

n2n1

47 minutes ago, khzmusik said:

/////

I personally agree that the issue is not randomness but perceived randomness. I think of it as the "playlist shuffle" problem. Many music apps shuffle a playlist by just choosing a random song in the playlist. But that means it's a near-certainty that many songs will be played multiple times, before all the songs in the playlist are played at least once.

 

What most people expect is "shuffling" like a deck of cards - they don't want the songs to be randomized, they want the song order to be randomized. If they hear the same song twice, they think the shuffle "isn't working."

//////

 

Right.... Only in our case it turned out that the algorithm designed to solve "imaginary repetitions "generates "real repetitions".

I would like the developers to pay attention to this.

And what algorithm they will eventually choose-we should not care.  And what algorithm they will eventually choose-we should not care.

n2n1

n2n1

44 minutes ago, khzmusik said:

/////

I personally agree that the issue is not randomness but perceived randomness. I think of it as the "playlist shuffle" problem. Many music apps shuffle a playlist by just choosing a random song in the playlist. But that means it's a near-certainty that many songs will be played multiple times, before all the songs in the playlist are played at least once.

 

What most people expect is "shuffling" like a deck of cards - they don't want the songs to be randomized, they want the song order to be randomized. If they hear the same song twice, they think the shuffle "isn't working."

//////

 

Right.... Only in our case it turned out that the algorithm designed to deal with"imaginary repetitions "generates"real repetitions". I would like the developers to pay attention to this. And what algorithm they will eventually choose-we should not care.  And what algorithm they will eventually choose-we should not care.

n2n1

n2n1

43 minutes ago, khzmusik said:

/////

I personally agree that the issue is not randomness but perceived randomness. I think of it as the "playlist shuffle" problem. Many music apps shuffle a playlist by just choosing a random song in the playlist. But that means it's a near-certainty that many songs will be played multiple times, before all the songs in the playlist are played at least once.

 

What most people expect is "shuffling" like a deck of cards - they don't want the songs to be randomized, they want the song order to be randomized. If they hear the same song twice, they think the shuffle "isn't working."

//////

 

Rright.... Only in our case it turned out that the algorithm designed to deal with"imaginary repetitions "generates"real repetitions". I would like the developers to pay attention to this. And what algorithm they will eventually choose-we should not care.

n2n1

n2n1

38 minutes ago, khzmusik said:

 

The biome placement example might not be a good one. I believe that biome placements in RWG aren't actually random. At least an alpha or two ago, they were the same biome pattern all the time, except perhaps rotated. I don't know if that's still true, but it might be, or they might have just added a few more pre-determined biome maps to choose from.

 

I personally agree that the issue is not randomness but perceived randomness. I think of it as the "playlist shuffle" problem. Many music apps shuffle a playlist by just choosing a random song in the playlist. But that means it's a near-certainty that many songs will be played multiple times, before all the songs in the playlist are played at least once.

 

What most people expect is "shuffling" like a deck of cards - they don't want the songs to be randomized, they want the song order to be randomized. If they hear the same song twice, they think the shuffle "isn't working."

 

That's certainly true of quest rewards. You can specify in XML that certain kinds of rewards are "fixed" (always appear), and other kinds have a limited supply to draw from. It's not particularly surprising that the same rewards would be offered to more than one player.

 

But IMHO "fixing" this is more trouble than it's worth. Like the "playlist shuffle" issue, 7D2D would somehow have to keep track of which items had already been given to someone, and make sure the next "random" item wouldn't match any of those. It would take time to program, would be easy to game, and probably wouldn't add much.

 

On the other hand, if it's as simple as re-seeding the RNG before each use - and/or not getting a shared seed from the server - then that would probably be worth it, since it's trivial. But I think it's probably not that simple.

RRight.... Only in our case it turned out that the algorithm designed to deal with"imaginary repetitions "generates"real repetitions". I would like the developers to pay attention to this. And what algorithm they will eventually choose-we should not care.

×
×
  • Create New...