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Changes to Screamers

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19 minutes ago, RipClaw said:

I had a world that was bugged and where no heat could be generated. The heat was always at 0% and the event counter was always 0. But in a new world the heat increased as expected.

Heat could be generated since we had screamers at our base, even if they only occured rarely.

Sadly i can't check directly, because the server i played on in not accessible anymore.

 

Any clues why this occured on this map? In our case we played on a nitrogen map. Could this be the issue?

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2 minutes ago, Liesel Weppen said:

Any clues why this occured on this map? In our case we played on a nitrogen map. Could this be the issue?

The bugged world was an old one I created in A19 EXP and upgraded to A19 stable and then A19.1 I have to create one with Nitrogen and test it there.

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14 minutes ago, RipClaw said:

The bugged world was an old one I created in A19 EXP and upgraded to A19 stable and then A19.1 I have to create one with Nitrogen and test it there.

Hmm, ours was created with the first A19 final. We intentionally waited until A19 is out of experimental.

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20 hours ago, hiemfire said:

Iirc it is on each hit. I forget where I saw it though, is there a journal entry or loading screen tool tip about the activity map (aka heat map)?

Its actually both.  The auger makes a sound, which adds heat as defined in sounds.xml.  And a block breaking also adds (a trivial amount of) heat.  You're getting most from the auger running, though.

 

<SoundDataNode name="Auger_Fire_Start"> <AudioSource name="Sounds/Weapons/Motorized/Auger/AugerAudioSource"/>
    <Noise ID="4" noise="60" time="2" heat_map_strength="1.0" heat_map_time="90"/>
    <Sequence/>
    <AudioClip ClipName="Sounds/Weapons/Motorized/Auger/Auger_Fire_Start"/>
    <AudioClip ClipName="Sounds/Weapons/Motorized/Auger/auger_fire_lp" Loop="true"/>
    <AudioClip ClipName="Sounds/Weapons/Motorized/Auger/auger_fire_end"/>
    <LocalCrouchVolumeScale value="1"/> <CrouchNoiseScale value="1"/> <NoiseScale value="1"/> <MaxVoices value="3"/> <MaxRepeatRate value="0.01"/> </SoundDataNode>

Each time the auger "runs" (which I think is 5x/sec) its adding 1 heat to the heat map.  That event lasts roughly 150 seconds, then drops off. (There's a note at the top of sounds.xml that explains heat_map_time, and 60 ~= 100 seconds)
 

So to prevent screamers, you need to run your auger less than 20 seconds of every 150ish.

Edited by stample
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Actually that seems wrong.  I don't get screamers in 20 seconds, even with an auger.  I wonder if its only adding 1 heat each time you start firing.

 

Question for everyone:  How do you mine with an auger?  Do you start/stop frequently when moving between blocks, or just hold it down continuously, and do you get lots of screamers or few?

 

I usually hold it down continuously unless I have to move more than 5 or so blocks to get to the next spot.  So I'm not stop/starting frequently, and I rarely get screamers.

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8 minutes ago, stample said:

Actually that seems wrong.  I don't get screamers in 20 seconds, even with an auger.  I wonder if its only adding 1 heat each time you start firing.

My tests showed me that the auger only adds 1% heat when you click the mouse button.

10 minutes ago, stample said:

Question for everyone:  How do you mine with an auger?  Do you start/stop frequently when moving between blocks, or just hold it down continuously, and do you get lots of screamers or few?

I am mining with the auger and keep the mouse button pressed. Still I get a lot of screamers when I mine iron or lead.

Some players seem to be creating long mine shafts. I don't do that. I follow the veins and expose a large area. Then I mine the resources layer by layer.

 

I did some tests and when you hit a iron or lead block it generates 0.2% heat per hit. When the block breaks it generates 2.84% heat. A stone, coal or nitrate block only generates 0.5% heat when it breaks and no heat is generated when you hit it. Depending on your miner69 skill and the quality of the auger you get 6-12% heat per block in total.

 

When I mine stone, coal or nitrate I get never a screamer but when I mine lead or iron I get a screamer every 2-3 minutes.

I assume this is either a bug or lack of balancing. Otherwise I can't explain why the differences between mining different resources are so big.

 

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44 minutes ago, RipClaw said:

I am mining with the auger and keep the mouse button pressed. Still I get a lot of screamers when I mine iron or lead.

Some players seem to be creating long mine shafts. I don't do that. I follow the veins and expose a large area. Then I mine the resources layer by layer.

This is exactly what I do

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7 hours ago, RipClaw said:

Otherwise I can't explain why the differences between mining different resources are so big.

Hitting/breaking metal blocks with tools or weapons also increase heat, likely at the same rate as mining metal ore.

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19 hours ago, Liesel Weppen said:

Then it would happen basically always.

But it doesn't. At least for me. I haven't gotten a single screamer.

Miner skills maxed, all mining books read, Auger was iirc T5. So almost everything maxed. NO. SINGLE. SCREAMER.

There is also a random factor involved. There is a chance that a screamer will not spawn. This was added in the beginning of A18.
In my tests, I did find that in some areas where the terrain was very rugged, no screamers would spawn. The console would report something once heat reached 100, but nowhere to be found.
Either one of these things could skew test results.

18 hours ago, Liesel Weppen said:

Sadly i can't check directly, because the server i played on in not accessible anymore.

Now there is a third factor. Was this server modded? Could it have been modded without you knowing exactly what was modded?

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4 hours ago, AtomicUs5000 said:

Was this server modded? Could it have been modded without you knowing exactly what was modded?

No, it was not modded. Completely vanilla, only external thing used was nitrogen.

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25 minutes ago, Liesel Weppen said:

No, it was not modded. Completely vanilla, only external thing used was nitrogen.

Then I would have to say that maybe you stumbled upon an area like I mentioned.
Really, if you think something is wrong in the game, just open up creative, display the heat, place some forges and torches down and watch the results. Read the console once the heat resets after hitting 100. All I see is that it is working as expected.
 

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15 hours ago, RipClaw said:

I assume this is either a bug or lack of balancing. Otherwise I can't explain why the differences between mining different resources are so big.

As stample mentioned, there is indeed extra heat added that is linked to sound. I remember faatal mentioning that back in early A18 when they were trying to locate the bug that was causing mass amounts of screamers.  A single torch would call in a screamer every 1 hour and 40 minutes of real time. Candles were messed up too.


When they were fixing things up, faatal did fix an issue with the auger, but just with the startup sound:


Unfortunately, I am having a hard time locating the post where the metal hit sound is mentioned. It might be in one of the posts that were lost in the recent forum migration.
However, in general, madmole "answered" your question as to why the difference is so big:


But yeah, I agree, some balancing would be nice. In my opinion, it's ok with a pickaxe... and of course, I would expect it to happen quicker with an auger... but it's too quick with an auger. Since the heat is linked to the sound, in order to ease up on it for the auger, they would have to create another sound object representing auger on metal... even if it uses the same clip.

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