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If TFP wanted natural progression might I suggest they bring back "spam crafting"

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1 hour ago, RipClaw said:

Let me guess, the perk you're interested in is Lucky Looter.

As much as it's true, I like roleplaying as a looter and lucky looter is part of that, along with scavenger and lockpicker (yes yes they're useless, I know, I still love 'em)
I personally play as pistol toting looter just scavenging the remnants of civilization. I have to spread my skill points to support that playstyle. I don't particularly like the current system, much as I understand its benefits.
Personally, I'd abolish the attribute system altogether and just leave perks. All attribute does is number game and perk gatekeeping, I'd rather the perks are free to take, gated only by the requirement of getting up its own ranks. Each combat skill needs their own primitive weaponry to allow someone to specialize in it as early as possible, and replace those stone axes

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4 hours ago, RipClaw said:

No. Even primitive weapons can be effective on day 7 if the base is designed for them. You don't need an shotgun, pistol or a AK-47 for the day 7 horde.

 

For example, I fought the day 7 horde with a stone sledgehammer and a blunderbuss. The base design was a simple hatch base. Most of the base was flagstone and some parts I upgraded to cobblestone. The hatches were iron reinforced wooden hatches. All I needed could be looted from POIs or harvested with stone tools.

 

The design that JaWoodle used for his day 21 horde in his current series could be used in the same way for the day 7 horde but with flagstone and cobblestone instead of concrete.
 

I would rather blow my ears off with a blunderbuss than have to listen to ANYTHING jawoodle puts out, especially as he is all about cheesing the AI which is lame. I always use a converted POI and no cheesing. 

 

 

Luckily I can play and power level

 

 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, Galifrey1965 said:

I would rather blow my ears off with a blunderbuss than have to listen to ANYTHING jawoodle puts out, especially as he is all about cheesing the AI which is lame. I always use a converted POI and no cheesing. 

 

In fact, this base is not a cheese base at all. I know he uses cheese bases a lot but this one is legitimate.

 

You don't need a cheese base for the day seven horde. For example the hatch base I mentioned is not a cheese base but a legitimate melee base. And if you don't like close combat then you just build a filled in 5x5 tower with the first 3 rows upgraded to cobblestone. Multiple rows of spikes and barbed wire fences and you have a base that can be used with a bow.

 

In general I don't like POI bases. I prefer to build my bases from scratch. It gives me more control.

 

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Just now, RipClaw said:

In fact, this base is not a cheese base at all. I know he uses cheese bases a lot but this one is legitimate.

 

You don't need a cheese base for the day seven horde. For example the hatch base I mentioned is not a cheese base but a legitimate melee base. And if you don't like close combat then you just build a filled in 5x5 tower with the first 3 rows upgraded to cobblestone. Multiple rows of spikes and barbed wire fences and you have a base that can be used with a bow.

 

In general I don't like POI bases. I prefer to build my bases from scratch. It gives me more control.

 

Hey if you want to throw away XP with spike traps and Barbed wire, knock yourself out. Like I say, I wouldn't watch ANYTHING jawoodle puts out as I have misophonia and would rather blow my own ears off than listen to him. Although I believe Kage848 used the same kind of 2 row design.

 

My base works fine and I can manage without spikes and barb wire thanks ;) I also had a junk turret and AK by day 7(tier 2 quests and trader purchases), so no need to cheese or use xp wasting traps :D 

 

I play Nomad with 64 Horde settings so day 7 is a bit easy now compared to what I am used to. I usually play run and gun on war3zuk mod :D

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5 minutes ago, Galifrey1965 said:

Hey if you want to throw away XP with spike traps and Barbed wire, knock yourself out.

Well, that's my advantage. I don't care about the XP from the horde. I get a lot of XP by building and collecting resources. And that's the beauty of the game. You are not committed to playing only one way.

21 minutes ago, Galifrey1965 said:

Although I believe Kage848 used the same kind of 2 row design.

If you watch the videos of Kage848 you have already seen the hatch base in action. He used it in his "No more room in hell series".

14 minutes ago, Galifrey1965 said:

I play Nomad with 64 Horde settings so day 7 is a bit easy now compared to what I am used to. I usually play run and gun on war3zuk mod :D

That explains a lot. I know that war3zuk is already working on the version for A19. I am curious if he will take over the lot progression or create his own lot table.

 

I do not like mods in general. They are too gun-heavy for me. Just as if someone wants tear out the Sandbox Survival part from the game and turn it into a Loot Shooter.
 

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Roland said:

Every point you spend does give a direct benefit. It pays the required cost for Miner69 and Motherlode. 
 

1 point for tier 1

3 points more for tier 2

4 points more for tier 3
etc

It’s the direct cost for the benefit you want. Instead of the level 2 perk itself costing 3 points, you pay two for strength plus 1 for Miner69 tier 2. 
 

I disagree and the facts disagree with you. You said every point have direct benefits, but it is only true if you use the weapon governed by the tree in question.

To reach Mother Lode 5 I need Strenght 7, it will cost 8 skill points to me, 8 player levels, if I dont use clubs, sldgehammers and shotguns, I dont will have any benefit from these points. You said these points are part of the cost of the ability, but if that is true, why my friend playing with shotgun and clubs is more powerfull than me?

The truth is: TFP created pre-character builds, they admitted it themselves, they said they wanted to give every atribute branch, some independence from the others.

But that independence is based on the use of pre-determined weapons who are linked to skills what are inside a tree. If you dont like the pre-made kit, then that "independence" falls by apart. The logic of independent attribute branch only work if the player want to follow it, if you dont want, you dont will see any independence. And if you dont follow the branch, every point spent in that attribute is a wasted point in comparison to the player who follow the schedule.

If TFP want work with something like that, it will better if they introduce class system to the game, like Darkness Falls has.

If they still want work with this system, then better they add some direct benefits to every single attribute point like A-17 has. And on top of that, I suggest weapons have its own branch, so you can play as a smart guy with pistols or with a strong guy with sniper rifle.

7 hours ago, RipClaw said:

Let me guess, the perk you're interested in is Lucky Looter.

 

Lucky Looter's not as powerful as it used to be in the early game. It adds between 5% and 25% to the current gamestage, which doesn't have much effect at the beginning of the game. A gamestage of 10 becomes a loot gamestage of 10.5 with one point in Lucky Looter and 12.5 with Lucky Looter maxed out. Only when you are higher in the gamestage the effect of Lucky Looter becomes noticeable. Then a gamestage of 100 becomes a loot gamestage of 125 with Lucky Looter maxed out.

 

At the beginning the Eye Candy and the Lucky Looter Goggles are much more powerful since they add directly to the gamestage. The Eye Candy adds 5 to the gamestage so a gamestage of 10 becomes a loot gamestage of 15 and the Lucky Looter Goggles can also give up to 5 gamestages which means if you use the Eye Candy and the Lucky Looter Goggles then you will have a loot gamestage of up to 20.
 

Dude, the point here is not what skills we want, it is about combos. I dont want the combo: mining + shotgun, I want configure my own combo and hotpoon same as me. We dont want have to use jevelins, just because they are in the same tree as Lucky Looter and Scavenger.

Edited by Biscoitoso (see edit history)
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22 minutes ago, Biscoitoso said:

I want configure my own ... hotpoon

Don't we all, man, don't we all...

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6 minutes ago, Boidster said:

Don't we all, man, don't we all...

I am talking about me and the ones who agree with me. And on top of that, my ideal system of skills dont slow down your gameplay. But the actual system slow down my gameplay.

I hope some modder create a overhaul to the skills as soon as possible. Something with the LBD system mixed with perks.

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40 minutes ago, Biscoitoso said:

Dude, the point here is not what skills we want, it is about combos. I dont want the combo: mining + shotgun, I want configure my own combo and hotpoon same as me. We dont want have to use jevelins, just because they are in the same tree as Lucky Looter and Scavenger.

I'd rather have my own combo as well, but as long as the game is like it is you can only try to get the most out of the combos you have available and that match your preferences the most.

My point was that you don't need Lucky Looter in the early game because it hardly has any effect anyway. You can save the points for the skills you need to get stronger with the weapons you prefer.

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1 minute ago, RipClaw said:

I'd rather have my own combo as well, but as long as the game is like it is you can only try to get the most out of the combos you have available and that match your preferences the most.

My point was that you don't need Lucky Looter in the early game because it hardly has any effect anyway. You can save the points for the skills you need to get stronger with the weapons you prefer.

Agree, but Perception not only have Lucky Looter, it has Savage Operations, and skills focused in hunting.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, RipClaw said:

Well, that's my advantage. I don't care about the XP from the horde. I get a lot of XP by building and collecting resources. And that's the beauty of the game. You are not committed to playing only one way.

If you watch the videos of Kage848 you have already seen the hatch base in action. He used it in his "No more room in hell series".

That explains a lot. I know that war3zuk is already working on the version for A19. I am curious if he will take over the lot progression or create his own lot table.

 

I do not like mods in general. They are too gun-heavy for me. Just as if someone wants tear out the Sandbox Survival part from the game and turn it into a Loot Shooter.
 

100% I agree, the beauty of this game is that you don't have to play one way. I play vanilla and war3zuk so both are important to me, usually run side by side games on both types.

 

I made 9 levels last horde night, that is not to be sniffed at ;)

 

 Problem is, this whole stone tools thing is a bit ridiculous as it forces you down a certain path. I mean what magically changes that pass'n'gas crates suddenly don't have stone tools (which I am pretty sure they would never ship in sealed crates ever anyway). The loot needs to better fit the poi, even if it is low level, wrenches, repair kits, a battery, a wheel, stuff like that in Pass'n'gas crates, 1 steel tool part in a working stiff crate, stuff that better fits and leave the stone tools to other places like garage storage etc.

 

That is my real issue with the loot, not the fact it is crap, it's the wrong crap ;)

 

War3zuk has kept the loot levels and rightly so, just it is stuff that is more appropriate alongside the usual stone crap :D

 

 

My main need right now is to get rid of the lag, that is pushing me to reinstall 18.4 lol

 

My PC is pretty monstrous and the constant pausing is doing my head in (Ryzen 3900X, RTX 2080 Super, 32gb 3200 drr4, 3gb/s PCI-e gen 4 m.2 NVME). It was buttery smooth last build :(

Edited by Galifrey1965 (see edit history)
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4 hours ago, Galifrey1965 said:

My PC is pretty monstrous and the constant pausing is doing my head in (Ryzen 3900X, RTX 2080 Super, 32gb 3200 drr4, 3gb/s PCI-e gen 4 m.2 NVME). It was buttery smooth last build

OK, I haven't been on b173 yet, but b172 was butter smooth on mine. Ryzen 3900X, GTX 1060 SSC 6GB, 32GB DDR4 3200, and the 3gb/s PCI-e gen 4 m.2 NVME. The literal only difference between our systems is that you have a newer GPU, and possibly a different motherboard.

 

I'm downloading all the different builds right now, and will be testing in a bit.

 

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5 hours ago, Galifrey1965 said:

100% I agree, the beauty of this game is that you don't have to play one way. I play vanilla and war3zuk so both are important to me, usually run side by side games on both types.

 

I made 9 levels last horde night, that is not to be sniffed at ;)

 

 Problem is, this whole stone tools thing is a bit ridiculous as it forces you down a certain path. I mean what magically changes that pass'n'gas crates suddenly don't have stone tools (which I am pretty sure they would never ship in sealed crates ever anyway). The loot needs to better fit the poi, even if it is low level, wrenches, repair kits, a battery, a wheel, stuff like that in Pass'n'gas crates, 1 steel tool part in a working stiff crate, stuff that better fits and leave the stone tools to other places like garage storage etc.

 

That is my real issue with the loot, not the fact it is crap, it's the wrong crap ;)

 

War3zuk has kept the loot levels and rightly so, just it is stuff that is more appropriate alongside the usual stone crap :D

 

 

My main need right now is to get rid of the lag, that is pushing me to reinstall 18.4 lol

 

My PC is pretty monstrous and the constant pausing is doing my head in (Ryzen 3900X, RTX 2080 Super, 32gb 3200 drr4, 3gb/s PCI-e gen 4 m.2 NVME). It was buttery smooth last build :(

Naming the stone stuff "crap" and then claiming you are only interested in the realism of what to find in the boxes. Very believable 🙃

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15 hours ago, Boidster said:

Don't we all, man, don't we all...

I see what you did there. haha. I actually cringe a bit at the name I chose. When I joined the forum, my usual gamer tag (Siren) was taken, and I guess I was in a silly mood that day, but it's given a few people a chuckle, so I guess that's ok. 😄

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9 hours ago, SylenThunder said:

OK, I haven't been on b173 yet, but b172 was butter smooth on mine. Ryzen 3900X, GTX 1060 SSC 6GB, 32GB DDR4 3200, and the 3gb/s PCI-e gen 4 m.2 NVME. The literal only difference between our systems is that you have a newer GPU, and possibly a different motherboard.

 

I'm downloading all the different builds right now, and will be testing in a bit.

 

Can confirm that the pausing is all but gone in 173, good job The Fun Pimps, Good job!

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, meganoth said:

Naming the stone stuff "crap" and then claiming you are only interested in the realism of what to find in the boxes. Very believable 🙃

Oh so to you it is highly valuable loot then?

 

What part of "it's not that it's crap, it is the wrong crap" did you not understand? Let me put it another way then, just blanket sticking stone crap tools in every type of crate bar shamway is just lazy and whoever is allocating needs some imagination. Do tell me in a modern post apocalyptic world who ships stone tools? If you're gonna have a sealed shipping crate full of stone tools, why is it labeled "vehicle parts crate" (Probably why Mods like Darkness Falls and War3zuk are so popular as they don't just rely on starving a player of resources to make a game hard) I am sorry I don't think the game is perfect and that you think my feedback based on over 40 years of video gaming is worthless.... You also need to learn the difference between real (main) issue and only issue (singular).... 

 

I genuinely would not have any issue with looting a vehicle parts crate and finding one headlight, 1 mechanical part, 1 electrical part, some scrap iron etc even cloth!

 

I genuinely would have no issue with looting a working stiff tools crate and finding scrap iron, broken tools, brass, lead or other junk that fits the type.

 

I DO have issues with looting those crates and finding 3 different varieties of stone axe/shovel/spear as 1. Who would order that garbage? 2. why would they order multiple types and levels? The simple fact is that we have an extended "stone age" and boxes full of useless items for scrap because there is no end game and SOMEONE decided that the best way to slow players down was to give them garbage so they were excited if they found a lvl 1 pistol. TFP once said that the inventory size was there to make the player have to make choices of what to take, stone tools are not a choice, you just keep the best and scrap the rest, then scrap it all once you have a viable alternative.

 

So if you think that is all unbelievable, then I leave you to your thoughts, but my closing statement is this, If TFP want people to be genuinely excited about getting something decent, then they should at least consider putting something decent in some of the crates otherwise you may as well just loot the kitchens and end loot and skip the rest ;)

 

PS. Whoever did the shotgun messiah crates got those spot on as they almost always contain some sort of gun parts, I really don't think it is too much of a stretch to suggest WST and PNG crates have a similar content to that which they suggest ;)

 

 

Edited by Galifrey1965 (see edit history)
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1 hour ago, Galifrey1965 said:

Oh so to you it is highly valuable loot then?

Snip for space

 

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20 hours ago, Galifrey1965 said:

I would rather blow my ears off with a blunderbuss than have to listen to ANYTHING jawoodle puts out, especially as he is all about cheesing the AI which is lame. I always use a converted POI and no cheesing. 

 

 

Luckily I can play and power level

 

 

 

 

And how about stacking frames or as they call it nerdpooling? It isnt cheesing? 😂

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20 hours ago, Galifrey1965 said:

Luckily I can play and power level

 

 

Do you play with days on standard length? You have quite a bit of levels, resources and loot for day 7, at least from what I could glance from your vid. Maybe I just underestimate going for INT straight off the bat and questing your buttocks off, I never really specialize in that tree.

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Posted (edited)
20 minutes ago, Hrod Land said:

Do you play with days on standard length? You have quite a bit of levels, resources and loot for day 7, at least from what I could glance from your vid. Maybe I just underestimate going for INT straight off the bat and questing your buttocks off, I never really specialize in that tree.

I think on this particular game I was playing 90 minute days, but TBH I usually spec intellect so it makes a little difference. And yes I quest and work my @%$*#! off, even at night ;) I am very good at choosing the right places and doing the right jobs (he says modestly :D)

 

37 minutes ago, Xtrakicking said:

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Genuinely LMFAO at that :D 

38 minutes ago, Bashtiks said:

And how about stacking frames or as they call it nerdpooling? It isnt cheesing? 😂

Nerdpoling is'nt cheesing...

 

Tell me, how would you have completed this quest? Spent 3 days building a base around the floodlight?

 

 

Edited by Galifrey1965 (see edit history)

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21 minutes ago, Galifrey1965 said:

I think on this particular game I was playing 90 minute days

Ah that makes sense. I also think of myself as quite efficient in this game (especially early game, I like dicking around later on), but I usually don't manage that amount of XP/loot until somewhere in week 2. Self esteem still intact 😉

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56 minutes ago, Galifrey1965 said:

Nerdpoling is'nt cheesing...

 

Tell me, how would you have completed this quest? Spent 3 days building a base around the floodlight?

 

 

Just wanted to see ur answer 😁

Sry dont have time to watch ur vid,  play as u wish 🙂

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Galifrey1965 said:

Oh so to you it is highly valuable loot then?

 

What part of "it's not that it's crap, it is the wrong crap" did you not understand? Let me put it another way then, just blanket sticking stone crap tools in every type of crate bar shamway is just lazy and whoever is allocating needs some imagination. Do tell me in a modern post apocalyptic world who ships stone tools? If you're gonna have a sealed shipping crate full of stone tools, why is it labeled "vehicle parts crate" (Probably why Mods like Darkness Falls and War3zuk are so popular as they don't just rely on starving a player of resources to make a game hard) I am sorry I don't think the game is perfect and that you think my feedback based on over 40 years of video gaming is worthless.... You also need to learn the difference between real (main) issue and only issue (singular).... 

 

I genuinely would not have any issue with looting a vehicle parts crate and finding one headlight, 1 mechanical part, 1 electrical part, some scrap iron etc even cloth!

 

I genuinely would have no issue with looting a working stiff tools crate and finding scrap iron, broken tools, brass, lead or other junk that fits the type.

 

I DO have issues with looting those crates and finding 3 different varieties of stone axe/shovel/spear as 1. Who would order that garbage? 2. why would they order multiple types and levels? The simple fact is that we have an extended "stone age" and boxes full of useless items for scrap because there is no end game and SOMEONE decided that the best way to slow players down was to give them garbage so they were excited if they found a lvl 1 pistol. TFP once said that the inventory size was there to make the player have to make choices of what to take, stone tools are not a choice, you just keep the best and scrap the rest, then scrap it all once you have a viable alternative.

 

So if you think that is all unbelievable, then I leave you to your thoughts, but my closing statement is this, If TFP want people to be genuinely excited about getting something decent, then they should at least consider putting something decent in some of the crates otherwise you may as well just loot the kitchens and end loot and skip the rest ;)

 

PS. Whoever did the shotgun messiah crates got those spot on as they almost always contain some sort of gun parts, I really don't think it is too much of a stretch to suggest WST and PNG crates have a similar content to that which they suggest ;)

 

 

Well, in your previous post you said "That is my real issue with the loot, not the fact it is crap, it's the wrong crap". And that is what I didn't believe. We could argue now what "real" issue means for any other issue, but lets just agree that you have a substantial issue with the stone age as well OR with the speed of advancement in the game.

 

If you played FOR and had a quality 3 AK and found a quality 4 AK with slightly more damage? Would you be happy with that or complain about not finding higher tier stuff? Well, the same step is if you have a q3 blunderbuss and find a q4 one.

 

I see (apart from the realism aspect) only the minor problem that stone tool scrap is nearly valueless and naturally that there are too few stone age weapons to have variety in the loot boxes.

 

Also there is nothing wrong if you only loot kitchens at first because the really valuable loot is there in the early game. Lots of people have complained that it doesn't matter anymore where they loot, now you can make an informed decision and loot residential buildings and kitchens first and switch to commericial buildings once the food problem is solved.

 

Edited by meganoth (see edit history)

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Dang, ran out of poop emoji's because of all the willful misinterpretation of arguments..

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21 minutes ago, Hrod Land said:

Dang, ran out of poop emoji's because of all the willful misinterpretation of arguments..

It's okay. I count you as having pooped me.

 

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