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madmole

Alpha 19 Dev Diary

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The "difficulty" people are talking about isn't 1000hp zombies; it's the complexity of the game. Meta-difficulty.

 

Removing things like sticks, or bear meat; requiring you to convert hides to leather before you can use the leather; city biomes packed with cops and dogs.

 

These aren't difficulties you can change in the options menu. They are difficulties that come from game design mechanics, which force the player to make decisions about how to spend their resources and energy.

 

That's what's been taken away. Contrary to what MM believes, simplicity in a game is NOT always a good thing.

 

-A

 

That's just busy work making leather or sharp sticks. Cluttering up precious inventory space for the sake of nostalgia? Food was simplified until we figured out wtf we were doing with it, and might see "prime" meat or something like the old bear meat come back. City biome has more zeds than ever at night.

 

Simplicity is a tool, just like complexity is a tool. Simplicity is used to ease the new player in, complexity is used to challenge the player who is more experienced.

 

Mundane early game tasks shouldn't be complex. We've added complexity to where it matters, like crafting a vehicle, but simple tasks that are done by noobs on the first few days and are not in the least bit rewarding should be simple.

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That's just busy work making leather or sharp sticks. Cluttering up precious inventory space for the sake of nostalgia? Food was simplified until we figured out wtf we were doing with it, and might see "prime" meat or something like the old bear meat come back. City biome has more zeds than ever at night.

 

Simplicity is a tool, just like complexity is a tool. Simplicity is used to ease the new player in, complexity is used to challenge the player who is more experienced.

 

Mundane early game tasks shouldn't be complex. We've added complexity to where it matters, like crafting a vehicle, but simple tasks that are done by noobs on the first few days and are not in the least bit rewarding should be simple.

 

It's also worth noting that the same tasks that are easy for players who already spent thousands of hours in this game, are not so easy for players who are new to this game and just started playing it. Old players often don't realize that the game lacks challenge for them simply because they already know how to achieve their goals using the easiest and fastest way possible, but every new update cannot be about changing the fundamentals just to please the old players.

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That's just busy work making leather or sharp sticks. Cluttering up precious inventory space for the sake of nostalgia? Food was simplified until we figured out wtf we were doing with it, and might see "prime" meat or something like the old bear meat come back. City biome has more zeds than ever at night.

 

Simplicity is a tool, just like complexity is a tool. Simplicity is used to ease the new player in, complexity is used to challenge the player who is more experienced.

 

Mundane early game tasks shouldn't be complex. We've added complexity to where it matters, like crafting a vehicle, but simple tasks that are done by noobs on the first few days and are not in the least bit rewarding should be simple.

 

City biome, more Zed's...

 

...does that mean zoning is back?!?

 

If it is, can we get an 18.4 release with it in place? and hopefully it works in rwg, instead of just nave :pray:

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That's just busy work making leather or sharp sticks. Cluttering up precious inventory space for the sake of nostalgia? Food was simplified until we figured out wtf we were doing with it, and might see "prime" meat or something like the old bear meat come back. City biome has more zeds than ever at night.

 

Simplicity is a tool, just like complexity is a tool. Simplicity is used to ease the new player in, complexity is used to challenge the player who is more experienced.

 

Mundane early game tasks shouldn't be complex. We've added complexity to where it matters, like crafting a vehicle, but simple tasks that are done by noobs on the first few days and are not in the least bit rewarding should be simple.

 

City Biome huh, I cannot say I believe it until I see it. At least that makes 6 biomes we can use now..

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City Biome huh, I cannot say I believe it until I see it. At least that makes 6 biomes we can use now..

 

how would the city biome work?

 

 

say the City is in the snow?? would it snow???? or not have any weather. just seems like it could get complicated.

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how would the city biome work?

 

 

say the City is in the snow?? would it snow???? or not have any weather. just seems like it could get complicated.

Hopefully it's a zone and not a biome, but honestly, I'd take either.

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That's just busy work making leather or sharp sticks. Cluttering up precious inventory space for the sake of nostalgia? Food was simplified until we figured out wtf we were doing with it, and might see "prime" meat or something like the old bear meat come back. City biome has more zeds than ever at night.

 

Simplicity is a tool, just like complexity is a tool. Simplicity is used to ease the new player in, complexity is used to challenge the player who is more experienced.

 

Mundane early game tasks shouldn't be complex. We've added complexity to where it matters, like crafting a vehicle, but simple tasks that are done by noobs on the first few days and are not in the least bit rewarding should be simple.

 

  • Love the city biome news!
     
  • I recognize that you have made your decisions, and I respect that. I respectfully disagree that they improved the game, because they took away meaningful choices.
     
  • None of the things I listed were due to nostalgia. For example, skins -> leather required at least a book and (maybe? memory is fuzzy) a tanning rack. Meaning you had to scavenge, fight/hunt, and craft.
     
  • If I have to craft sticks, or sharp rocks, or whatever base usable material, I can't craft anything else at that moment. Time is the most precious resource in a survival game, and in earlier alphas you were making good use of forcing the player to choose how to spend their time. Not so much now.
     
  • OK, so you pulled unique meats until you come up with a firm design for food. I'm down with that - I wish I'd known that when you guys pulled it, just so I wasn't thinking it was a nerf.
     
  • Agree 100% that simplicity is a useful tool.

 

Not trying to rabble rouse - just trying to explain my viewpoint which I know is shared by a number of other "olde tymers" :)

 

-A

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...recurringly resulting in rough reactions. Refrain!

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Causing Tables to become Unstable

 

Roland, change his title to combo breaker please, k thanks. :)

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Roland, change his title to combo breaker please, k thanks. :)

 

i was bored so i just said that cuz it seemed that you two were saying random things

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City biome, more Zed's...

 

...does that mean zoning is back?!?

 

No its in been in A18 for ages. At night that biome has a lot of zombies.

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It's also worth noting that the same tasks that are easy for players who already spent thousands of hours in this game, are not so easy for players who are new to this game and just started playing it. Old players often don't realize that the game lacks challenge for them simply because they already know how to achieve their goals using the easiest and fastest way possible, but every new update cannot be about changing the fundamentals just to please the old players.

 

Yep. Guys with hundreds to thousands of hours should be experts.

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i was bored so i just said that cuz it seemed that you two were saying random things

 

Rogue remark. Roland resisted ranting random ramblings.

Edited by meganoth (see edit history)

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No its in been in A18 for ages. At night that biome has a lot of zombies.

 

Bummer. So, you were just talking about the biome spawns between Day and Night :(

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Rogue remark. Roland resisted ranting random ramblings.

 

oh i agree with that,

 

sometimes when anyone here talks about ideas i want to add on.

 

 

but if i did that all the time there would be a extra 200 pages here :tongue-new:

 

 

and if i did that. MM and the other would not be pleased

Edited by Adam the Waster (see edit history)

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No its in been in A18 for ages. At night that biome has a lot of zombies.

 

Can confirm that, had a game today and decided to stay in a big town in wasteland (2h day lenght, vanilla settings, 70~sh level, day 38).

Had really good fun thinking I was invisible on the roof of a trailer park trailer (I have all wasteland books read :smug: ) My legs were shaking for fair 2 hours ingame right after 23h, radiated and birds were real fun to be scared of. The incoming zombies discovering mines on their path was like a fireworks on the background of all noises from zeds and the ambient sound of wastelands.

 

Almost all melee and double shotgun with few mods found in the loot.

 

You did well guys, again - thanks !

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No its in been in A18 for ages. At night that biome has a lot of zombies.

 

Oh you're specifically talking about the wasteland biome, not the city itself. Got it. Thanks.

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No its in been in A18 for ages. At night that biome has a lot of zombies.

 

Oh you meant the currently existing declaration of the 'city' biome that never spawns anywhere in the game of which even the spawning xml clearly states it is no longer being used (actually a relic from before A16). So A19 will have the same non-existing city spawns, check.

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We have all witnessed the reality of alliteration blindness.

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Oh you meant the currently existing declaration of the 'city' biome that never spawns anywhere in the game of which even the spawning xml clearly states it is no longer being used (actually a relic from before A16). So A19 will have the same non-existing city spawns, check.

I think he meant the wasteland.

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