Adam the Waster Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 Not this time. I followed that quote back and it was a from a legit thread created by a user and not one created by me moving posts out of the dev diary. Also....that thread’s title is not one I would’ve made up for a bunch of extra dev diary fluff. Finally, getting Rolanded is something very different than what you ascribed. I’d be more specific but Adam is reading these posts and he’s very impressionable. For his sake, we’ll go with his Thanos Snapping euphemism. that's for sure but a better name would be "Roland the Destroyer" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted February 3, 2020 Author Share Posted February 3, 2020 One feature I would love - LOVE - to have in A19 is the ability to lock signs in singleplayer so that you can't edit them unless you hold down "E" for more options. That way, you can't edit them by accident, or accidentally click on a sign and get stuck in it while a Demolisher explodes during horde night... Not speaking from experience of course. Haha If this can be done, awesome, and if it is done, please and thank you. Yeah I want that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perlin_Worm Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 Random floor plans could be done with rotating turnstile walls. Just think Kwirk, that old gameboy title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazz Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 But then level designers revolt because they have to bend over backwards to make everything look the same, use the same layout. =P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sillls Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 We all need a little Roland in our life. =) No please don't encourage him! - - - Updated - - - I pitched a Roland action figure to TFP when they were brainstorming merchandise ideas-- but they didn't agree with you. =P Now you see what you did Gup! Great, just great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted February 3, 2020 Author Share Posted February 3, 2020 Hence why the game is boring and many only can play for a bit or play for 5 min then go nope need mods. Not like alphas ago when the game was a leveled plain where you had to actually learn the game and people would be plastered to the game figuring out recipes figuring out different things to make. Now its just oh the answer is easy as the game babies players... we all were new once and most the long timers learnt the game and was still pasted to the game. New players yeh they will find it easy but they will get bored after a few hrs knowing everything is handed on a plate. Sorry but the eye rolling i think is us towards some of the things like how easy and boring this game gets quickly. Fallout skyrim borderlands all have replayability over and over cause its not easy it doesnt hand the easy route to players. Bruh... if its so bad why are you obsessed with it? Go play Alpha 2 and have at it. You do not represent the average consumer at all and tuning the game to forum rats would be a cancer move. The game is challenging in the right ways now, change one of the million settings if you think its too easy. Its WAY harder than Skyrim and Fallout 4 even on survival mode. You have to not buy specific perks in FO4 to not become a god at level 20-30. FYI player counts are at an all time high and sales are the best since the initial release, so we're on track. The complaints are literally squeaky wheel straw man arguments at this point and making any changes would piss off most players TBH. We're fixing bugs and adding more content. Some more balance and optimizations. Not sure how this isn't clear. Any experienced player SHOULD need mods to make it harder. That kind of stuff is great for mods but the vanilla game has to be accessible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted February 3, 2020 Author Share Posted February 3, 2020 MM can we please have a separate gs calculator for MP than from Sp. yes, MP should have more zeds because we have more people helping out. get rid of team xp if you feel you must. people do level way too fast that way. but keep the zed type progression stable. I mean week 4 in sp I am still mainly getting cops as the big bad, but in MP I can get demolishers by week 2 with a 3 man team? time progression on that is out of whack. side note. who the hell is strapping c4 to zombie bikers and sending them out anyways?!? I mean who would get close enough to do 1, let alone dozens. Hopefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted February 3, 2020 Author Share Posted February 3, 2020 It would be great if the dungeon POI system were modular to reduce the samey feel every time. It would have to go hand-in-hand with removing the trail of light, but that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make. That's really the only solution to, "Been there, done that." Its just not possible for this game without a full redesign of the tools. Fallout and Skyrim are still fun with the exact same map, every single play through. Its like asking for a new game really. The issue with random dungeons is those can lose their personality if not done right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted February 3, 2020 Author Share Posted February 3, 2020 I would like to remind everyone something about blood moon zombie numbers. Specifically, that the zombie spawns are per player. I guarantee that if you play in a game with three or more players sharing the same base the number of blood moon zombies, and therefore demolishers, is very different. Even assuming that 8 zombie setting is used. You can easily survive 2 demolishers? Great! How about six? At once. Possibly two or more waves of this. Sometimes on the second blood moon night, certainly on the third. Did I forget to mention that the spawn difficulty setting also ramps with multiple players? It seems people are focusing on balance for single player survival forgetting about what happens in multiplayer. Design problems are often greatly exaggerated when you bring multiple sources in to the situation. Zombie counts apply to groups AFAIK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam the Waster Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 side note. who the hell is strapping c4 to zombie bikers and sending them out anyways?!? I mean who would get close enough to do 1, let alone dozens. sounds like me TBH. but i still think that they are army solders that worked with Ordnance. Yeah a few things are Off like the helmet but i still think they look like a solder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 Its just not possible for this game without a full redesign of the tools. Fallout and Skyrim are still fun with the exact same map, every single play through. Its like asking for a new game really. The issue with random dungeons is those can lose their personality if not done right. Would it be something that would be considered for the sequel right from the very beginning? If you can't have some randomization in the dungeons for this game that would be a nice upgrade for the next one. Another idea I've read is creating duplicates of existing dungeons but altering where the loot room is and the sleeper locations as well. Is that something that would be considered for this game by TFP or left to modders to create as a prefab pack? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4sheetzngeegles Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 Madmole Its a game so spoiling concrete would be lame. We don't want to force everyone into being a miner and not everyone wants to mine so bags of concrete can be looted, so that looters can get materials they need for a decent small base as well. Madmole Exactly. I don't think any changes are needed. This is another example where a mod would be better. You can't expect first timers to know stuff, so when a guy with 10k hours experience wants it harder for everyone you have to just roll your eyes. I do think making electricity required for the mixer and maybe scaling block damage with GS would be decent moves. RE:purposing and redistributing asset use. What are the archtypes you are designing for? I know looter/scavenger thats me. Then there is miner/builder. In pois there is stealth/marauder. What are the others? if there are any. If you continue the same path with repurposing assets in game will furniture be included. Example I like the fact that i destroy a candle or torch and retrieve it. I snatch and craft all i can. The thought is a wrench gets material, a hammer gets the useable/placeable part, and a ranged weapon is used to activate/deactivate it. For the lights if so can it be repurposed so that, with wrench you get the material, a hammer you get the light, and a ranged weapon it douses the light for stealth play. Later slideable/placeable furniture for a rudimentary barricade would be nice. Like the crushed cars, and broken stone in use now, but with furniture. The new way, the one quoted, distribution of use, adds a progression if sedentary or nomadic defenses are used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCrook1028 Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 No you would skip all the bs and upgrade everything to the selected material. If concrete is loaded, all wood blocks hit would become wet concrete, all flagstone would also become wet concrete. You set the material and upgrade to it. The only use case different would be steel, it would reject upgrading all but r concrete. So you're removing the path and eliminating the middle steps? hmm. Build with wood frames and next step is concrete. Sounds simplistic to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tin Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 Its just not possible for this game without a full redesign of the tools. Fallout and Skyrim are still fun with the exact same map, every single play through. Its like asking for a new game really. The issue with random dungeons is those can lose their personality if not done right. How about having the poi creators make a clean and dungeon version, and let the rwgmixer do the rest? edit: Heh, Roland beat me to it. That what I get for not finishing all the pages Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam the Waster Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 So you're removing the path and eliminating the middle steps? hmm. Build with wood frames and next step is concrete. Sounds simplistic to me. i think it would be great if say you upgraded your base from wood to steel, it adds HP to the block HP from the Perverse Block and it will add up until you hit steel. say you use scrap. and you upgraded it to reinforced scrap. it will be 2000 HP instead of 1000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimpy Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 Its just not possible for this game without a full redesign of the tools. Fallout and Skyrim are still fun with the exact same map, every single play through. Its like asking for a new game really. The issue with random dungeons is those can lose their personality if not done right. Do you think those Bethesda games would be better if the POIs were the same but randomly placed around the world, or if the general map structure and story was the same but with more generic-seeming POIs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerfly Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 Would it be something that would be considered for the sequel right from the very beginning? If you can't have some randomization in the dungeons for this game that would be a nice upgrade for the next one. Another idea I've read is creating duplicates of existing dungeons but altering where the loot room is and the sleeper locations as well. Is that something that would be considered for this game by TFP or left to modders to create as a prefab pack? Hope this idea goes further, mod or not, sounds really good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerfly Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 @Madmole I was watching the latest episode released by Neebs Gaming and at the of it was a funny ass joke which got me thinking. How cool would it be if Neebs or some of the guys did some voice acting for this game. I think that would be dope as hell. It would be sorta like what DICE did with Neebs Gaming for Battlefield. Plus you know they have the talent to pull off some incredible voices. Just sharing a cool thought I had. Steam workshop would be a great place for ideas such as this. This game gives so much opportunities already. P.S. If we can voice over random voices would be the best, I would make my best friend`s mother voice a trader and he will freak out on the spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerfly Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 Hmm I'll have to look in to what steam workshop is, I know it has something to do with mods..and maps...i think. Thanks I'll check it out Just to let you know, it is planned for 7 days to die, but after gold hopefully. There is so much content and stuff that is changing and added, so if at that level SW is added it will be a bug nest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gronk Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 This is a cool idea. Randomized dungeons, that sounds really good. Brings me back to the days of playing Diablo.... Let's hope it's a thing for the next Fun Pimps game *cough vampires cough*. The last I heard procedural dungeons are possible through modding, that may have changed though and I don't think anyone's tried it in a while. Writing code for a semi-decent building generator is often more art than science. The last time I tried this it took me twenty minutes to find out what they call the wall above a windows lintel and below its sill. Wall... those particular areas are called wall. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted February 3, 2020 Author Share Posted February 3, 2020 So you're removing the path and eliminating the middle steps? hmm. Build with wood frames and next step is concrete. Sounds simplistic to me. We're adding player choice. Build with what you want to build with and not be stuck forced to waste loads of mats because you started with wood. Why should you have to use cobblestone uprade wood to concrete? Thats just some old 2013 code that was easy to do, it was never designed properly. Its no fun smashing out old blocks and its also no fun upgrading wood to concrete if you have the concrete on hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted February 3, 2020 Author Share Posted February 3, 2020 Do you think those Bethesda games would be better if the POIs were the same but randomly placed around the world, or if the general map structure and story was the same but with more generic-seeming POIs? No their games are all about character growth and story telling, and lowering the quality to support random stuff (which would be difficult to avoid) wouldn't pay off for them. 7 Days is more about survival and making the most of what you can find, needing a lot of resources and not knowing where to get them is a huge part of the experience so having a random world adds a lot more value to our game. In their games you just get everything at X level, its just bound to happen, aside from the artifacts which you do a quest for. There is no "I need to find a medical store" or "I need car parts". Meds are in every bathroom and you can heal just by sleeping, etc. All crafting is made from generic BS which you will have loads of if you loot everything. So no it wouldn't help their games at all IMO, and wouldn't be worth the effort to engineer it to where it matches the quality of a hand crafted world. I mean if they could pull it off cool, but I don't see it adding much value unless the core game would change dramatically and they changed their loot to be more specific. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odetta Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 We're adding player choice. Build with what you want to build with and not be stuck forced to waste loads of mats because you started with wood. Why should you have to use cobblestone uprade wood to concrete? Thats just some old 2013 code that was easy to do, it was never designed properly. Its no fun smashing out old blocks and its also no fun upgrading wood to concrete if you have the concrete on hand. Does that mean flagstone is getting removed? Or do we still got to go from flag to cobble? Edit: they use the same material, but i guess each material will have an upgrade if you leave it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted February 3, 2020 Author Share Posted February 3, 2020 Does that mean flagstone is getting removed? Or do we still got to go from flag to cobble? Edit: they use the same material, but i guess each material will have an upgrade if you leave it Nothing is removed. It would probably work like now, unless you loaded a material into your nail gun, then it would only upgrade to that material. We'd have to discuss it a bit more, but that is the general idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirillion Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 No their games are all about character growth and story telling, and lowering the quality to support random stuff (which would be difficult to avoid) wouldn't pay off for them. 7 Days is more about survival and making the most of what you can find, needing a lot of resources and not knowing where to get them is a huge part of the experience so having a random world adds a lot more value to our game. In their games you just get everything at X level, its just bound to happen, aside from the artifacts which you do a quest for. There is no "I need to find a medical store" or "I need car parts". Meds are in every bathroom and you can heal just by sleeping, etc. All crafting is made from generic BS which you will have loads of if you loot everything. So no it wouldn't help their games at all IMO, and wouldn't be worth the effort to engineer it to where it matches the quality of a hand crafted world. I mean if they could pull it off cool, but I don't see it adding much value unless the core game would change dramatically and they changed their loot to be more specific. Speaking of sleeping ... with the new beds in A19, any plans for rested bonuses? Like say, when close to your bed you gain a buff. This buff increase in duration for an extended stay near the bed and could add bonuses like quicker stamina regen, better/faster aim, quicker actions like lockpicking, reloading, crafting...stuff like that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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