Sjustus548 Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 I like the idea of having random stats. It makes it worth it to keep crafting/looking for gear even when you find Q6 stuff. The problem I'm having is very bad luck when it comes to armor. I'm going with a heavy armor build currently. I'm wearing between Q3 and Q4 Iron Armor and can't find anything better. I crafted a set of Q5 Iron Armor and it was all worse. I'm finding Steel Armor while looting and from the trader but it is still worse. I understand why the different levels of Iron Armor would be better or worse but I would think that steel armor would automatically be better. Doesn't seem like much of a reason to get steel armor over iron armor if it will be the same armor rating. I could be mistaken and maybe I'm just having a bad set of armors to compare. Is anyone else having the same or better luck than I am currently? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synvastian Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 you found top "grade" iron armor, one without rust and defects (meaning it rolled its stats probably close to, if not at maximum) I RP that some armor has holes, or has worn out straps that could break Q3 Iron Chest with 13 armor vs a Q5 Iron chest with 10? The Q5 has a hole in it, or was misshapen when it took a blow making it less effective Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psychodabble Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 I like the idea of having random stats. It makes it worth it to keep crafting/looking for gear even when you find Q6 stuff. The problem I'm having is very bad luck when it comes to armor. I'm going with a heavy armor build currently. I'm wearing between Q3 and Q4 Iron Armor and can't find anything better. I crafted a set of Q5 Iron Armor and it was all worse. I'm finding Steel Armor while looting and from the trader but it is still worse. I understand why the different levels of Iron Armor would be better or worse but I would think that steel armor would automatically be better. Doesn't seem like much of a reason to get steel armor over iron armor if it will be the same armor rating. I could be mistaken and maybe I'm just having a bad set of armors to compare. Is anyone else having the same or better luck than I am currently? Six page thread on this topic here: https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?130618-Random-Stat-Implementation TL;DR: You are far from alone, but they want this this way and don't see a problem with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viktoriusiii Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 Six page thread on this topic here: https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?130618-Random-Stat-Implementation TL;DR: You are far from alone, but they want this this way and don't see a problem with it. As far as I remember, there was no official statement on this topic. I was mostly the guy who argued that it gave a more... varied gameplay then just stepping up a tier and becoming instantly better. To OP: There is no steel armor that is worse than an iron armor But I get your point. It can be quite frustrating. But maybe your T3 iron armor is just so awesome that you got a Q6 like very early on? So then you got used to this good quality and now cant find better stuff? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volstag Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 I think it's cool you can find a piece of top end Q5 gear that's better than "run of the mill" Q6 gear. It adds variety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psychodabble Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 As far as I remember, there was no official statement on this topic. I was mostly the guy who argued that it gave a more... varied gameplay then just stepping up a tier and becoming instantly better. Gazz dismissed my concern, ignored my potential solution, and declined to explain what we were seeing in the XML. Gazz is a TFP employee...that's pretty official...working as intended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostlight Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 I think it's cool you can find a piece of top end Q5 gear that's better than "run of the mill" Q6 gear. It adds variety. Do you think it is cool that you can find a Q1 item that is better than your Q6? According to the other thread, items' tier does not affect base stats, it only affects mod slots, sell price and durability. Everything else is RNG. So your Q1 Shotgun has the same potential damage range as your Q6 Shotgun. I find that laughably embarrassing. Also this means there is NO POINT WHATSOEVER in crafting, except to sell. It's just a waste of resources. Looting is officially strictly superior for yielding top tier items. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doombringer101 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Do you think it is cool that you can find a Q1 item that is better than your Q6? According to the other thread, items' tier does not affect base stats, it only affects mod slots, sell price and durability. Everything else is RNG. So your Q1 Shotgun has the same potential damage range as your Q6 Shotgun. I find that laughably embarrassing. Also this means there is NO POINT WHATSOEVER in crafting, except to sell. It's just a waste of resources. Looting is officially strictly superior for yielding top tier items. The other thread is incorrect, here is an example from the xmls outlining one example of how the item tier affects the stats: <passive_effect name="EntityDamage" operation="perc_add" value=".1,.5" tier="2,6"/> <!-- tier bonus --> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalen Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Do you think it is cool that you can find a Q1 item that is better than your Q6? According to the other thread, items' tier does not affect base stats, it only affects mod slots, sell price and durability. Everything else is RNG. So your Q1 Shotgun has the same potential damage range as your Q6 Shotgun. I find that laughably embarrassing. Also this means there is NO POINT WHATSOEVER in crafting, except to sell. It's just a waste of resources. Looting is officially strictly superior for yielding top tier items. Weapon damage does appear to be impacted by QL From the pump shotgun <passive_effect name="EntityDamage" operation="perc_add" value=".1,.5" tier="2,6"/> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doombringer101 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Weapon damage does appear to be impacted by QL From the pump shotgun <passive_effect name="EntityDamage" operation="perc_add" value=".1,.5" tier="2,6"/> haha beat you to it block damage example: <passive_effect name="BlockDamage" operation="perc_add" value=".1,.5" tier="2,6"/> <!-- tier bonus --> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalen Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 The other thread is incorrect, here is an example from the xmls outlining one example of how the item tier The other thread was referring to armor value which does not appear to be impacted by QL - - - Updated - - - haha beat you to it Hah, you did.... dang it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazz Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 I wonder who is making this stuff up "in the other thread". Are these people even talking about A18 or some mod? And yes, armor rating can not scale very much. We had exactly that in A17 and everyone agreed that low quality armor with low perks was useless. If people are suggesting to make early armor useless again then... sorry. Not happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doombringer101 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 The other thread was referring to armor value which does not appear to be impacted by QL - - - Updated - - - Hah, you did.... dang it! I was just going off Ghost's statement, I did not peruse the other thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doombringer101 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 I wonder who is making this stuff up "in the other thread". Are these people even talking about A18 or some mod? And yes, armor rating can not scale very much. We had exactly that in A17 and everyone agreed that low quality armor with low perks was useless. If people are suggesting to make early armor useless again then... sorry. Not happening. Spell it out clearly in the XML text document next time slacker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazz Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 It uses the documentation it is provided or it gets the hose again! =P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doombringer101 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 It uses the documentation it is provided or it gets the hose again! =P hahaha ok ok Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theFlu Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 And yes, armor rating can not scale very much. We had exactly that in A17 and everyone agreed that low quality armor with low perks was useless. If people are suggesting to make early armor useless again then... sorry. Not happening. People are peeved about the armor Tiers not improving in their primary function. This stems from design choice problem, with the "Armor rating = damage reduction percentage" equation. You have 6 different types of armors, with armor types, requiring them to logically be split into at least 4 categories (making padded worst, and steel best, the others could overlap in pairs by design) Target value range 0-90 point reduction, five pieces to sum: free range 0-18 per piece. Armor with 0 would be quite odd, so, 1-18. Giving each of the 4 minimum categories their own range to vary in, you'll only have 4 points left to randomize AND tier. Choosing a different AR system, as most games have, would enable more variance. Say AR = percentage of Time to Live added. That takes a bit of math to create, but the jist is this At 0 armor, 100 health, you'll live 10 seconds against an enemy. At 100 armor, 100 health, you'll live +100% longer, ie 20 seconds at 1000 armor, 100 hp, you'll live +1000%, ie 110 seconds Essentially infinitely increasable, with the added benefit of having each point of armor being exactly as valuable. Harder to read, but a lot more usable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laz Man Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Do you think it is cool that you can find a Q1 item that is better than your Q6? According to the other thread, items' tier does not affect base stats, it only affects mod slots, sell price and durability. Everything else is RNG. So your Q1 Shotgun has the same potential damage range as your Q6 Shotgun. I find that laughably embarrassing. Also this means there is NO POINT WHATSOEVER in crafting, except to sell. It's just a waste of resources. Looting is officially strictly superior for yielding top tier items. I think that's a misconception. Based on the limited xmls that I looked at, q1 items dont get any bonus stats vs t2-t6. Edit: my observation is with wpns, havent looked at armors. Apologizes if its different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostlight Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Oh. Is it only Armour that uses this stupid approach? Which XML file should I be looking at? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doombringer101 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Oh. Is it only Armour that uses this stupid approach? Which XML file should I be looking at? Items.xml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalen Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Oh. Is it only Armour that uses this stupid approach? Which XML file should I be looking at? I'm no expert, but the way I read it, if it doesn't have "tier=" somewhere in the line, then that particular property is not impacted by QL example: <passive_effect name="DegradationMax" operation="base_set" value="400,800" tier="1,6"/> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 If people are suggesting [that TFP balance the game for meaningful and easy to understand progression] ... sorry. Not happening. Bummer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volstag Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Do you think it is cool that you can find a Q1 item that is better than your Q6? No, but since that never happens the question is immaterial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosmic Kerman Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Bummer. That is a really deceptive edit of what Gazz said. You can disagree with what he said all you want but to edit his reply to make it seem like he said something else is incredibly problematic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostlight Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 No, but since that never happens the question is immaterial. Except it can. Have you not been keeping up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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