madmole Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 'Seriously? A fortnite/pubg/rust clone? Whatever you're smoking, stop. He's smoking on my ban hammer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weazelsun Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 I don't know if there would be a way to balance out the punishment of not focusing on a skill tree early-mid game. Punishment in the sense that I feel gimped/ less effective. For example fortitude and heavy armor, if I don't focus on getting those skill points into heavy armor, the stamina punishment from using it definitely makes it challenging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jugginator Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 He's smoking on my ban hammer. Ahhaha! I prefer a nice Cuban myself rather than that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdunham3 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 Its too easy and boring yet they knock down your base? Sounds like a contradiction. Its taken me until noon to repair my base on the next day is that too tedious for you? What was so amazing in the past? Not everybody plays the game because of the horde night cycle. Some play it despite the horde night cycle. Looting, crafting, making an appealing looking homestead, fighting zombies in POI's...there used to be a less horde-night focus that was quite enjoyable. Now it's a lot more focused on that one feature (and the prep for it, and recovery from it) to the point the other aspects have taken a back seat. On a bus. The new ability to turn horde night off or make it infrequent doesn't help that the other aspects are weakened. Don't get me wrong, there's a lot to like and a lot to do, but we're trying to note in the balance thread that we feel an imbalance. That's all we're saying. We're trying to be helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eatit Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 Its too easy and boring yet they knock down your base? Sounds like a contradiction. Its taken me until noon to repair my base on the next day is that too tedious for you? What was so amazing in the past? Was spam eating stew fun? Why are you scared of food poisoning? I've got 500 hours in and puked 5 times, that is no reason to stop eating cooked food. Buy the iron gut perk if you are so scared of food poisoning. We're working on making crafting a little more relevant. I disagree about the 4x4/gyro they are both superior to the motorcycle. The 4x4 has massive storage and can take passengers and the gyro is way faster flat speed, not to mention you can go cross country and not be slowed by hills. What I find Boring is the game play style. I enjoyed your earlier vision of Minecraft for Adults more. Why should I invest time into building a base for them to knock down? It's much easier to build a cheap 3x3x5 with some blade traps and spikes. I don't feel the need to expose my loot to the horde. I'm not afraid of food poison. I just don't see the need to craft food. I can find enough canned food. Why would I want to craft imperfect food if I find enough perfect food? There is no reason to craft food. I can't find a reason to craft anything other than ammo and the occasional mod. I find everything usually long before I can craft it. Why go through the trouble. The 4x4 should be faster than the motorcycle or at least the same speed. Two of us play together. We can ride together in the truck or go separate on motorcycles. If we go separate we get there faster. Faster is better. This isn't meant as an attack on you or your game. I love this game, it's why I took the time to write here. Steam says I have 2700 hours playing. This is meant as constructive criticism, and my opinion relating to the things I like. In a thread that was titled Feedback and Balancing. Just giving mine and my wife's feedback. Thank you for all of the work you have put in to give us so much enjoyment for so little cost. We truly love your game. With mods it can be anything we want it to be so take our feedback with a grain of salt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jugginator Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 I think you two missed the whole "build and defend your home against the zombie hordes" part of the main description of the game. Stop worrying about repairing your base/your loot, it's part of the game and look from another perspective and you'll enjoy it much more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tetrameth Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 Not everybody plays the game because of the horde night cycle. Some play it despite the horde night cycle. Looting, crafting, making an appealing looking homestead, fighting zombies in POI's...there used to be a less horde-night focus that was quite enjoyable. Now it's a lot more focused on that one feature (and the prep for it, and recovery from it) to the point the other aspects have taken a back seat. On a bus. The new ability to turn horde night off or make it infrequent doesn't help that the other aspects are weakened. Don't get me wrong, there's a lot to like and a lot to do, but we're trying to note in the balance thread that we feel an imbalance. That's all we're saying. We're trying to be helpful. Oh comeon... on the 7th day just run into a random POI and knock out the staircase, or jump into a vehicle and cheese it.... if you wanna cheese it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sticksabbi Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Was the horde night/gamestage difficulty changed? We just did our night 28 horde night on a dedicated with 2 other players and I don't ever recall seeing so many irradiated feral zombies on a day 28. Our groups collective gamestage was I think in the 400's (3 of us) we're only level 25 to 35ish with the new perk/skill system we don't have the kind of skills/equipment to stand up to that kind of horde yet. I hate to be one of those people who say "the game is to hard now" but... the horde night is quite impossible without cheezing the AI which we refuse to do in our builds. is there something we're missing here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jugginator Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Was the horde night/gamestage difficulty changed? We just did our night 28 horde night on a dedicated with 2 other players and I don't ever recall seeing so many irradiated feral zombies on a day 28. Our groups collective gamestage was I think in the 400's (3 of us) we're only level 25 to 35ish with the new perk/skill system we don't have the kind of skills/equipment to stand up to that kind of horde yet. I hate to be one of those people who say "the game is to hard now" but... the horde night is quite impossible without cheezing the AI which we refuse to do in our builds. is there something we're missing here? Not impossible and you don't have to cheese AI. Lower difficulty by one / lower horde spawn by one drop until you recoup if you rly need. Build square walls 4 high, put bars up top, shoot from up top downward. Utilize spikes, electric fensing / other traps to help. You can do it with some adapation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laz Man Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Was the horde night/gamestage difficulty changed? We just did our night 28 horde night on a dedicated with 2 other players and I don't ever recall seeing so many irradiated feral zombies on a day 28. Our groups collective gamestage was I think in the 400's (3 of us) we're only level 25 to 35ish with the new perk/skill system we don't have the kind of skills/equipment to stand up to that kind of horde yet. I hate to be one of those people who say "the game is to hard now" but... the horde night is quite impossible without cheezing the AI which we refuse to do in our builds. is there something we're missing here? You forgot to mention your difficulty setting. I know it's not the same but in SP, default difficulty, lvl 32, gs 70, I got cops for the first time on my day 28 horde. No radiated yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Not everybody plays the game because of the horde night cycle. Some play it despite the horde night cycle. Looting, crafting, making an appealing looking homestead, fighting zombies in POI's...there used to be a less horde-night focus that was quite enjoyable. Now it's a lot more focused on that one feature (and the prep for it, and recovery from it) to the point the other aspects have taken a back seat. On a bus. The new ability to turn horde night off or make it infrequent doesn't help that the other aspects are weakened. Don't get me wrong, there's a lot to like and a lot to do, but we're trying to note in the balance thread that we feel an imbalance. That's all we're saying. We're trying to be helpful. How is it a game with choice has forced things which have been bolstered to take a back seat? New shape blocks: You can easily use more shapes now than ever, promoting better looking bases. Some people have said they never built more than a square block base before, now they are getting into architecture! I myself have found a reason to play past day 28-35 and have been building interesting bases. How is base building diminished? If anything I think its needed now, before you could sit on a bar with a wooden frame in the doorway and they were too stupid to get to you. Now there is a strong desire to build a strong base. What has been weakened? Crafting was stupid OP in 17, but I'm still crafting tools, pockets for clothing, food, farm plots, some armor, and vehicles and traps. Lots of ammo, mods, too. That is a lot to craft IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 What I find Boring is the game play style. I enjoyed your earlier vision of Minecraft for Adults more. Why should I invest time into building a base for them to knock down? It's much easier to build a cheap 3x3x5 with some blade traps and spikes. I don't feel the need to expose my loot to the horde. I'm not afraid of food poison. I just don't see the need to craft food. I can find enough canned food. Why would I want to craft imperfect food if I find enough perfect food? There is no reason to craft food. I can't find a reason to craft anything other than ammo and the occasional mod. I find everything usually long before I can craft it. Why go through the trouble. The 4x4 should be faster than the motorcycle or at least the same speed. Two of us play together. We can ride together in the truck or go separate on motorcycles. If we go separate we get there faster. Faster is better. This isn't meant as an attack on you or your game. I love this game, it's why I took the time to write here. Steam says I have 2700 hours playing. This is meant as constructive criticism, and my opinion relating to the things I like. In a thread that was titled Feedback and Balancing. Just giving mine and my wife's feedback. Thank you for all of the work you have put in to give us so much enjoyment for so little cost. We truly love your game. With mods it can be anything we want it to be so take our feedback with a grain of salt. I'm glad you love the game, you made it sound like we ruined it for you or something. I build a base for the enjoyment of it. I want a place to hang my hat. If its built right zombies can't knock it down unless you go afk for 5 hours. I hate building in POIs they are usually too big and require more work in the long run to get acceptable. Well there is the cost of food, and the simplicity of eating one high calorie meal versus spamming down 15 calorie cans at best. To me its about efficiency and slots, I don't usually have 10 cans of chili, but a can of peas, a can of this and that and it takes up more room than its worth. I try to save it until it is a stack of 10, but I don't typically get there, I eat it. I also like cooked food despite the chance to get poisoning because it heals you a lot. Its a good bandage so to speak. We could make the 4x4 as fast. I thought it was a choice though... do I want a little faster and less space and mileage, or more space a little slower and worse mileage? To me the 4x4 is better all around if you can afford the fuel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Was the horde night/gamestage difficulty changed? We just did our night 28 horde night on a dedicated with 2 other players and I don't ever recall seeing so many irradiated feral zombies on a day 28. Our groups collective gamestage was I think in the 400's (3 of us) we're only level 25 to 35ish with the new perk/skill system we don't have the kind of skills/equipment to stand up to that kind of horde yet. I hate to be one of those people who say "the game is to hard now" but... the horde night is quite impossible without cheezing the AI which we refuse to do in our builds. is there something we're missing here? Its easier than before actually, less radiated spawn. However gs 400 is somehow crazy late game and you would be getting nasty zombies by then for sure. I can't see you guys getting GS 400 with 3 level 25-35 people, but gazz could answer better to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gareee Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 The 4x4 should be faster than the motorcycle or at least the same speed. Two of us play together. We can ride together in the truck or go separate on motorcycles. If we go separate we get there faster. Faster is better. I DO agree about this. The 4x4 already has navigation limits because of it's width, and using a ton more gas AND going so much slower makes it feels unsatisfying. I started packing it up, driving the motorcycle to locations, and then unpacking it for the storage and journey home, which is a bit of a workaround, but seems like a waste. If its not adjusted by the final a18 stable, I'll just mod its speeds to at least match the motorcycle. - - - Updated - - - Was the horde night/gamestage difficulty changed? We just did our night 28 horde night on a dedicated with 2 other players and I don't ever recall seeing so many irradiated feral zombies on a day 28. Our groups collective gamestage was I think in the 400's (3 of us) we're only level 25 to 35ish with the new perk/skill system we don't have the kind of skills/equipment to stand up to that kind of horde yet. I hate to be one of those people who say "the game is to hard now" but... the horde night is quite impossible without cheezing the AI which we refuse to do in our builds. is there something we're missing here? The game is more balanced for sp right now. IMHO the mp multiplier is twice as high as it should be. I suggested a game setting slider with a lower setting (or two) vanilla and a higher setting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laz Man Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 How is it a game with choice has forced things which have been bolstered to take a back seat? New shape blocks: You can easily use more shapes now than ever, promoting better looking bases. Some people have said they never built more than a square block base before, now they are getting into architecture! I myself have found a reason to play past day 28-35 and have been building interesting bases. How is base building diminished? If anything I think its needed now, before you could sit on a bar with a wooden frame in the doorway and they were too stupid to get to you. Now there is a strong desire to build a strong base. What has been weakened? Crafting was stupid OP in 17, but I'm still crafting tools, pockets for clothing, food, farm plots, some armor, and vehicles and traps. Lots of ammo, mods, too. That is a lot to craft IMO. The difficult part is "crafting" can mean so many different things. Person #1 vision of crafting is realistic combination of parts (e.g. sharp sticks). Person #2 vision of crafting is creating huge bases that can withstand any horde. Person #3 vision of crafting is being able to construct everything from raw materials. Person # 4 vision of crafting is being able to make the best items in the game......and so on and so on.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake_ Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Armor is the one exception, we didn't want brown armor to be completely useless so there isn't enough range there to implement a better defense rating per quality level. So it is possible to get a brown armor that is better AR than a purple one, the purple one would still be way better because of durability and 4 mods installed. I see. I understand there isn't enough range on armor to balance the values too much. I feel weird about it is all. Not fulfilling enough. Here are some thoughts: To further add cool stuff into the mix, have you thought of "progressive random values" that apply to every quality and not only to the legendary items? Allow me to explain. Legendary has cool stuff like "dentist knuckles" with its effects and coolness. But quality 1-5 items could have some "enchantments" both negative or beneficial like: 5% more damage to wolfs /10% more damage to wolfs / 15% more damage to wolfs 3% more movement speed /6% " " / 12% " " 20% more durability / 30% more durability / 40% more durability reduces player movement speed by 1% and increases HP regeneration 1% /" 2% " 2% / "3%" 3% So you can reserve the really cool legendary golden effects to the Legendary stuff and mix those at random to every quality item. Imagine you got the crapiest level 1 stone axe in a trash can. Even its value is so bad that you couldn't pick your teeth with it. But you look closely and it has no legendary cheecky name, yet it does 20% more damage to stone. Those stats could be underlined in another colour. What do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 The difficult part is "crafting" can mean so many different things. Person #1 vision of crafting is realistic combination of parts (e.g. sharp sticks). Person #2 vision of crafting is creating huge bases that can withstand any horde. Person #3 vision of crafting is being able to construct everything from raw materials. Person # 4 vision of crafting is being able to make the best items in the game......and so on and so on.... Yeah I suppose there is a lot of visions, I'd say we've got it 90% right. A bit more crafting and we would be happy about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 I see. I understand there isn't enough range on armor to balance the values too much. I feel weird about it is all. Not fulfilling enough. Here are some thoughts: To further add cool stuff into the mix, have you thought of "progressive random values" that apply to every quality and not only to the legendary items? Allow me to explain. Legendary has cool stuff like "dentist knuckles" with its effects and coolness. But quality 1-5 items could have some "enchantments" both negative or beneficial like: 5% more damage to wolfs /10% more damage to wolfs / 15% more damage to wolfs 3% more movement speed /6% " " / 12% " " 20% more durability / 30% more durability / 40% more durability reduces player movement speed by 1% and increases HP regeneration 1% /" 2% " 2% / "3%" 3% So you can reserve the really cool legendary golden effects to the Legendary stuff and mix those at random to every quality item. Imagine you got the crapiest level 1 stone axe in a trash can. Even its value is so bad that you couldn't pick your teeth with it. But you look closely and it has no legendary cheecky name, yet it does 20% more damage to stone. Those stats could be underlined in another colour. What do you think? All the more powerful stuff has a downside to it. I don't think we'd mess with other attributes on items just to keep balance sane. I have 55 legendary effects now, and many of them can spawn on all weapons, so probably hundreds or thousands of legendary variants already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damocles Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 What is wrong with adding an option to let players have static terrain that would improve performance and allow for faster vehicles, high performance water, and way more zombies on screen? I think a few players might appreciate that. I never said we'd remove diggable terrain completely. Its people like you who don't comprehend what I say that make it impossible to talk shop/pie in the sky ideas here. You could look into instantiating voxel terrain only at locations that are either affected by players or POIs. The rest being just standard 2D terrain. The effort to "break" the surface of the terrain should go up then, to limit the number of those areas. Chunk creation during normal travel should be a lot faster then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jugginator Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 What is wrong with adding an option to let players have static terrain that would improve performance and allow for faster vehicles, high performance water, and way more zombies on screen? I think a few players might appreciate that. I never said we'd remove diggable terrain completely. Its people like you who don't comprehend what I say that make it impossible to talk shop/pie in the sky ideas here. This is something I have suggested/thought of ever since I started really playing the game in A15: why not? Maybe not even completely static, but drastically reduce the amount that's "diggable" of the world. I can assume reducing 50% of diggable depth woult relieve quite a bit of resources, I'm sure people would be happy with an option to reduce the diggable amount to, say, 5 or 8 blocks (basicially current ground level before you hit rock). That gives enough to collect clay and do minor land changes for base design (tunnel, as well, for in/out of some base designs) Other than another option, you guys ever think of limiting the current depth overall? You can go down so far as it is, it's kinda too much (don't get mad mole rats that escavate 10-mile deep holes, just a suggestion lol). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weazelsun Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 @madmole, could the Batter Up! book volume 2, also have the "Take 5% less damage when wearing them" affect the high performance running shoes? Seems like a perfect fit, for those wanting to play a baseball slugger build. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Survager Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 @MM, I want get answer on this Q: https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?111778-Alpha-18-Dev-Diary!!&p=1058301&viewfull=1#post1058301 Do you plan to remove brass items from the game and leave only brass scrap? The situation with the removal of iron ore has a similar logic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobross Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Its easier than before actually, less radiated spawn. However gs 400 is somehow crazy late game and you would be getting nasty zombies by then for sure. I can't see you guys getting GS 400 with 3 level 25-35 people, but gazz could answer better to that. We haven't seen GS400, but we most definitely saw I think it was just short of GS200 for our Day 28 horde. Unfortunately, I accidentally nuked the VM that the old game was on so we had to restart. We were all around 25-35 as well. I'm telling you, oh Moly One, there's something off about group gamestage. We were handling it, but we really had zero time to do anything else but prep, and we're on 120-minute days. Most of the prep was repairs to fortifications and mining absurd amounts of ammo supplies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Piratenking Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Its easier than before actually, less radiated spawn. However gs 400 is somehow crazy late game and you would be getting nasty zombies by then for sure. I can't see you guys getting GS 400 with 3 level 25-35 people, but gazz could answer better to that. is there any plans to adress the saved game's file getting corrupted after power shutdowns?? for the second time all my effort and time gone to ♥♥♥♥ because the game cant do something as simple as having a ♥♥♥♥ing backup for the saved file, i am so ♥♥♥♥ing fed up with this ♥♥♥♥. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agrastiOs Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 @MM, I want get answer on this Q: https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?111778-Alpha-18-Dev-Diary!!&p=1058301&viewfull=1#post1058301 Do you plan to remove brass items from the game and leave only brass scrap? The situation with the removal of iron ore has a similar logic. No, it's not. You never needed to scrap Iron before you get the Forge. And when you got the forge, you might as well just smelt it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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