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Alpha 18 feedback and balancing thread

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I have once gotten food poisoning when trying to recover from food poisoning. It has not happened again in a long time, mostly because I take vitamins first, or maybe it's because I can cook much better foods.

 

As far as gameplay goes I think tinned food having no chance of food poisoning... it's a mechanic that fits well with TFPs trend of reward for risk/looting. Like MadMole said once, he wants most recipes to have one uncraftable ingredient to encourage continued looting.

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I understand how the mechanic works, and I've yet to get stuck in this so called "food poisoning loop" once so it sounds like maybe all half-dozen of you that can't eat once without getting it are just unlucky.

 

That being said, yeah the canned goods being food of the gods is a very silly concept and I don't think diluting the vending machines with candy will be enough to counteract how prevalent and easily accessible it is.

 

if you get poisoned, you will have to eat a lot to recover. So for each non canned food, you have 4% chance for getting sick again. If you have to eat like 10 pieces of food, its 40% chance to getting it again before you recover the past one. 40% is a really high chance and if you are in late game with more stamina, you will have 60% or more. Its crazy, like I said, i fear more eating than zombies now.

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if you get poisoned, you will have to eat a lot to recover. So for each non canned food, you have 4% chance for getting sick again. If you have to eat like 10 pieces of food, its 40% chance to getting it again before you recover the past one. 40% is a really high chance and if you are in late game with more stamina, you will have 60% or more. Its crazy, like I said, i fear more eating than zombies now.

 

That's...not how that math works.

 

4% each time (use vitamins!) is still 4% each time. It's not additive. Besides, in late game you're almost assured of either vitamin availability or having perked into a reduced chance of food poisoning. You're choosing to fail (occasionally) if you do neither.

 

This is like choosing to use stone tools and weapons in late game. Yeah, you can...but why would you?

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That's...not how that math works.

 

4% each time (use vitamins!) is still 4% each time. It's not additive. Besides, in late game you're almost assured of either vitamin availability or having perked into a reduced chance of food poisoning. You're choosing to fail (occasionally) if you do neither.

 

This is like choosing to use stone tools and weapons in late game. Yeah, you can...but why would you?

 

Yes, thats how math works. If you eat 1 piece, you got 4%, but if you eat 10 in a row you do get 40%. Its like lotery, if you buy 1 ticket you got a %chance, but if you do get more tickets, you increase that chance of winning, its simple.

Also, should I forget about farming and hunting that has a lot of perks, to just buy canned foods from machines? First that canned foods are the real poison, idk what made devs think that a canned chicken ration has 0% chance of poisoning while a stew that requires you to level up perks has a chance to poison. That does not make any sense. And second, devs were the ones who told us that we would have perks to create our character the way we like to play it, but making those perks useless (farming, hunting), we cant. As you said, we have no choice, we get vitamins or perk to reduce poison. Sad, but true.

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Posted (edited)
Yes, thats how math works. If you eat 1 piece, you got 4%, but if you eat 10 in a row you do get 40%. Its like lotery, if you buy 1 ticket you got a %chance, but if you do get more tickets, you increase that chance of winning, its simple.

 

No. Using your own lottery analogy, let's say you have a 1% chance of winning.

So if you buy 100 tickets you have a 100% chance to win!

 

Man, that was easy! Wonder why everyone doesn't so easily win the lottery?

Edited by UnkelRick
Typo-- meant "winning" not "whining" (see edit history)

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No. Using your own lottery analogy, let's say you have a 1% chance of whining.

So if you buy 100 tickets you have a 100% chance to win!

 

Man, that was easy! Wonder why everyone doesn't so easily win the lottery?

 

Sorry but you are missing the logic, the read and the math class. I didnt say if you buy 1 ticket you get 1%, did you read what i did say? I did say that if you buy one ticket, you have a % unknown chance of winning, but if you buy more tickets, OF COURSE you will have that chance increased. Can you read correctly now? Thanks.

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Sorry but you are missing the logic, the read and the math class. I didnt say if you buy 1 ticket you get 1%, did you read what i did say? I did say that if you buy one ticket, you have a % unknown chance of winning, but if you buy more tickets, OF COURSE you will have that chance increased. Can you read correctly now? Thanks.

 

Wow. Take your own 'advice' there, bud. I know what you said and I know what I said.

 

Do you?

 

Clearly you don't, and you seem to suffer from reading comprehension issues on top of the poor math abilities you've displayed.

 

I used your 10 4% chances equals 40% logic and made an analogy to the lottery (Because you mentioned it) AS AN EXAMPLE.

 

What part of "let's say" eludes you?

I didnt say that you said the lottery has a 1% chance of winning. Im using a 1% chance as an example to keep it simple for you. I used your own erroneous equation to arrive at the same erroneous results.

 

If you can't understand that...well, I can see why you're struggling with the game...

 

I kept my first reply short and simple and you couldn't even comprehend that, so...

Have a nice day, I'm done :)

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Wow. Take your own 'advice' there, bud. I know what you said and I know what I said.

 

Do you?

 

Clearly you don't, and you seem to suffer from reading comprehension issues on top of the poor math abilities you've displayed.

 

I used your 10 4% chances equals 40% logic and made an analogy to the lottery (Because you mentioned it) AS AN EXAMPLE.

 

What part of "let's say" eludes you?

I didnt say that you said the lottery has a 1% chance of winning. Im using a 1% chance as an example to keep it simple for you. I used your own erroneous equation to arrive at the same erroneous results.

 

If you can't understand that...well, I can see why you're struggling with the game...

 

I kept my first reply short and simple and you couldn't even comprehend that, so...

Have a nice day, I'm done :)

 

sorry, but you are comparing it wrong. If you have 100 tickets and 1 of this tickets is the winning one, you will have the same example from the game, so if you have 10 tickets, you got 10%, same as food poisoning, if you eat 10 in a row you will have 40% of chance that one of them will make you sick. But you are trying to compare a unknown lottery with a unknown system and saying that 1 is equal to 1%, so you are making this comparations wrong. Its easy, but i guess you cant understand that.

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sorry, but you are comparing it wrong. If you have 100 tickets and 1 of this tickets is the winning one, you will have the same example from the game, so if you have 10 tickets, you got 10%, same as food poisoning, if you eat 10 in a row you will have 40% of chance that one of them will make you sick. But you are trying to compare a unknown lottery with a unknown system and saying that 1 is equal to 1%, so you are making this comparations wrong. Its easy, but i guess you cant understand that.

 

Oh, I understand just fine. :)

 

The bottom line is that your math is wrong. Use (and then later reject) whatever example you like. Reword it, spin it, stomp your feet --do whatever. It won't change the fact it's wrong.

 

Ten individual 4% food poisoning chances does not equate to a combined 40% food poisoning chance.

Sorry if you don't like that fact.

 

Maybe someone smarter than me with more patience can explain it for you in terms you'll understand.

 

Maybe you'll just insult them as well, use fallacies and continue to declare everyone else is wrong and you're right.

 

Don't care what you do, I'm done. Have the last word if you will.

Good day, and happy New Year.

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Oh, I understand just fine. :)

 

The bottom line is that your math is wrong. Use (and then later reject) whatever example you like. Reword it, spin it, stomp your feet --do whatever. It won't change the fact it's wrong.

 

Ten individual 4% food poisoning chances does not equate to a combined 40% food poisoning chance.

Sorry if you don't like that fact.

 

Maybe someone smarter than me with more patience can explain it for you in terms you'll understand.

 

Maybe you'll just insult them as well, use fallacies and continue to declare everyone else is wrong and you're right.

 

Don't care what you do, I'm done. Have the last word if you will.

Good day, and happy New Year.

 

i didnt insult you. But know what? we can agree to disagree. And happy new year to you too, thx.

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can we talk about food poison? we eat a single non canned food and get poisoned, so we need to eat to get out of this poison and recover, but you get poisoned again when you are trying to recover from first poison. This sucks. Im more afraid to eat than zombies

 

So, have a plan B: stockpile vitamins for the times you can't afford to get sick eating, or put points into iron gut,, or put points into chef and lotl, or keep a backup supply of a bunch of slots of canned food instead of or even in addition to one slot for emergency vitamins, or just eat only from the vending machines and looted canned food. It's the zombie apocalypse. Food is a problem. Solve it or die.

 

People have tried to point out where your math's wrong, have you considered the possibility that you've got a blind spot there? No one's immune to those.

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sorry, but you didnt. When you get poisoned you go to 20 or less stamina max, so you will need to eat like 10 or more food to recover depending on the recipe. If you dont get poisoned again it is call luck, because you will. We should have food recipes that doesnt give poison status or have some drink to avoid getting poisoned for a certain time.

 

Also is crazy that old garbage canned food has 0% chance of making you sick, but go through all the trouble of hunting, gardening, and cooking and you still have 4% chance of food poisoning. The canned should make you sick, not the fresh new meat you did cook, once we dont have food spoiling system.

 

I didn't read ahead to see if you were answered but didn't you know about the Vitamins? They prevent food poisoning for like 15 min.

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No. Using your own lottery analogy, let's say you have a 1% chance of whining.

So if you buy 100 tickets you have a 100% chance to win!

 

Man, that was easy! Wonder why everyone doesn't so easily win the lottery?

 

So really buying more than 1 ticket is a waste of time is what you are saying?

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I didn't read ahead to see if you were answered but didn't you know about the Vitamins? They prevent food poisoning for like 15 min.

 

i know about the vitamins, thanks.. but you wont always have it everytime you're going to eat some food even if you spend a lot of time looting.

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So really buying more than 1 ticket is a waste of time is what you are saying?

 

Nope.

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I think there should be a sticky thread that explains how independent probability works so we don't have to keep having this discussion.

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Nope.

 

Then I am confused. Are you saying that if you buy more lottery tickets you might have a bigger chance of winning then? If so, then wouldn't eating more grilled meats each day give you a larger chance for getting food poisoning?

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Then I am confused. Are you saying that if you buy more lottery tickets you might have a bigger chance of winning then? If so, then wouldn't eating more grilled meats each day give you a larger chance for getting food poisoning?

 

I don't believe you're confused in the slightest. I believe you're trying to play a game of semantics and "gotcha" of which I have no interest in playing. If I'm wrong, I apologize.

 

Do you share the belief that eating 10 food items each having a 4% chance to give you food poisoning equates to a 40% chance of getting food poisoning?

 

That belief is what was being contested. Not what you're now proposing.

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Looking through the items file trying to figure out what the best stats are for the firemans helmet, I noticed that it can get to tier 6. I decided to look for it in all of the xml and realized that there is no way to actually obtain one tier 6. Just wondering if there could be some way maybe like 10% to craft it at tier 6, or maybe have it show up in loot once you unlock all of the firemans books and have the ability to craft it.

 

Apart from this I do think it would be nice if there was some way to know the upper bounds of things like armor and weapon stats from within the game.

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Crack a Book headquarters

paper room.... seriously, none of the rolls of paper give paper? just wood painted white? can you please fix this. that room was GAH!

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I don't believe you're confused in the slightest. I believe you're trying to play a game of semantics and "gotcha" of which I have no interest in playing. If I'm wrong, I apologize.

 

Do you share the belief that eating 10 food items each having a 4% chance to give you food poisoning equates to a 40% chance of getting food poisoning?

 

That belief is what was being contested. Not what you're now proposing.

 

I do not agree that eating 10 food items a day will not give you a 40% chance of getting food poisoning. However I do agree that eating 10 items each with a 4% chance of giving you food poisoning will give you a better opportunity to get food poisoning than just eating 1 item a day.

 

This is what everyone you and others are disagreeing with and making sticky notes about. I think people are not communicating correctly here and are talking past each other.

 

You can agree or disagree that it is a problem or not. That is not important. What is important is that people who are giving negative feedback are doing so based on the very true fact that the more food you have to each each day with a 4% chance each of giving you food poisoning almost guarantees that you will get food poisoning sooner or later.

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Posted (edited)
Does your finger ever get tired from pushing up your glasses and raising your hand in the front row of the class?

 

The devs are grown ups, they can determine what they will or won't answer on their own, they don't need your help.

 

As someone who is on both sides of bug reports in my day job I simply know how time consuming and annoying this back and forth on bugs is. For me it is like seeing a slanted picture on a wall must feel to an orderly housekeeper

 

The other reason was: Since I knew it might be some time before Fataal would read this thread again (in the christmas holidays) I wanted to make sure we got a good answer the first time. Because I was curious about the answer myself.

Edited by meganoth (see edit history)

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ik this is a bit off topic but.

 

i was talking to trader jen and when i didn't find anything i want for sale and i stopped looking, she said. "sorry iv never heard of a stimpak.."

 

 

just thought it was funny. also love the new voice, so my idea that she was a chain smoker is out of the window. lol

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I do not agree that eating 10 food items a day will not give you a 40% chance of getting food poisoning. However I do agree that eating 10 items each with a 4% chance of giving you food poisoning will give you a better opportunity to get food poisoning than just eating 1 item a day.

 

This is what everyone you and others are disagreeing with and making sticky notes about. I think people are not communicating correctly here and are talking past each other.

 

You can agree or disagree that it is a problem or not. That is not important. What is important is that people who are giving negative feedback are doing so based on the very true fact that the more food you have to each each day with a 4% chance each of giving you food poisoning almost guarantees that you will get food poisoning sooner or later.

 

Fair enough. It seems a sticky could do wonders. There are plenty of work arounds for food poisoning -vitamins, canned food, perks.

 

Of course you're bound to get it at some point, and the sudden need to consume even more food could mean you just get it again and have to eat even more. You could even get it a 3rd time...

That's pretty "bad luck" though, and it seems to be more a matter of "what if?" than a matter of it actually happening to people enough to be a real problem.

 

In other words, I see more people lamenting at the possibility, than I see it truly happening repeatedly.

 

That's just my take though. It's only happened to me once early in the first a18 experimental and it just wasn't that big a deal to me. I had to leave my mine and run home to get more food. I adapted accordingly and it hasn't happened since. Maybe I'm just lucky. Had i been low on food it might have been a different story, but hoarding food is survival-101 IMO, and food is rather abundant in my experience thus far so hoarding it hasn't been an issue.

 

If it truly is a common, excessively nagging issue maybe a cool down could be implemented?

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