Jump to content

Alpha 18's pve melee is currently just as bad as alpha 16's multiplayer pve


Whitefoxx

Recommended Posts

Ya remember the bad old days of alpha 16's super reach zombie hits, where you swoop in, tag a zombie with your club and dodge away, only to be hit like where no zombie arm could realistically tag you? Yeeeeeeaaa......18's currently is just as bad if not worse and it needs to be looked at. Alpha 16's sp pve combat was on the money. Still got hit now and then , but with all the zombies around thats all you could stand and live lol. The melee in 18 needs to be like 16's, just tweaked here and there. Least thats my thoughts on the matter.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Tip: A18 zombies seem to preemptively swing as you approach. Stop short or just let them come to you and they will always swing too early and miss you. At that point you can step in a bit and basically do whatever you like to them (just don't miss!!). Seems a bit of an exploit to me but now that I've got it down, I am rarely hit in melee combat now.

Link to post
Share on other sites

As a matter of fact you should do exactly the same, start to swing your power strike BEFORE you get in range so that you don't just stand there while cranking up your arm. Which makes perfect sense to me. There might be some reach bug but overall the system is working great I think.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Give sledge a shot and watch your inner world crumble into nothingness.

 

If you find even a t1 steel sledge early give it a whirl, it's stupidly strong and aren't that rare to find them either. 1-2 shot kills even completly unperked on warrior difficulty if you get a t3 one and stick some mods into it.

Link to post
Share on other sites
If you find even a t1 steel sledge early give it a whirl, it's stupidly strong and aren't that rare to find them either. 1-2 shot kills even completly unperked on warrior difficulty if you get a t3 one and stick some mods into it.

 

The steel sledge is where it's at. I wonder if any other weapon can take off 2 heads with one power swing?

Link to post
Share on other sites
Give sledge a shot and watch your inner world crumble into nothingness.

 

My first game on A18 I survived using the sledge for quite some time. It works fine. I feel like there may be a prioritization issue with all of melee though where sometimes you'll hit something nearby instead of your target, similar to the days hitting crawlers in grass you'd hit the grass. But the sledge itself works great.

 

I think they've tightened up the hitboxes though. Previously I feel like their hitboxes extended beyond their graphics, now it's quite easy to shoot in between their legs or just to the side of their head. I really felt this more with knife instead of sledge. With sledge it was easy enough to knock them down and then smash their brains in. With knife using the normal attack you have to consistently hit the head or you're going to get mauled. While I did alot of bleed kiting, because Deep Cuts is amazing now, I definitely did get alot better at consistently head shotting a weaving and stumbling target because when you're backed into a corner with knife...you can't afford to miss.

Link to post
Share on other sites

No issues with melee, other than zombies are a bit smarter and speed variable so I can't just spend a day farming zombies and never get hit. Spear is safer but slower to kill with, sledge kills fast but must bigger risk due to closer proximity.

 

Took a little to adjust to but haven't had any real issue with melee on Nomad using sledge. So much so I sorta think sledge needs a nerf because once I got decent with it there was no reason to use anything else.

 

Armor is a big deal now BTW. Good light armor (mix leather and 2 pieces of military I found) and 3 ranks in light armorhave steeply mitigated both damage taken and risk of bleeds, I'm almost never stunned. I take some hits but a couple basic cloth bandages and natural healing perk fix it back up. I've got a huge stockpile of first aid bandages and pills because I don't really need them now.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Arent zombies doing much less damage than they did before? I havent been hit much, but in Kages lets play he gets hit often and his hp bar barely moves. I remember in previous alphas that just a few hits were deadly.

Link to post
Share on other sites

There is something about the A18 behavior that seriously messed with my old-man autopilot, for me it didn't show up so much in the melee as the early archery, early headshots are a _bitch_. Combine that with the rarer feathers and when just about any zed 'cept the fire demon's tramping towards me it's got my full attention and alarm. Gimmes on the headshots, R.I.P. Melee got easier when I became much more aware of my own reach. Dogs, though, I now hate dogs worse than I hate vultures, that's new.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Arent zombies doing much less damage than they did before? I havent been hit much, but in Kages lets play he gets hit often and his hp bar barely moves. I remember in previous alphas that just a few hits were deadly.

 

I think Kage plays on low difficulty....default or something. He's more of a builder than a fighter.

 

Also, melee is broken now, imo. I simply do not get hit anymore outside of Enrage. Once you know to exploit their preemptive swing, and use a Club (only weapon I've tried in anger coz I love it, but should work with any melee weapon except a Spear), you basically cannot get hit from walking zombies.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just putting this out for everyone to think about it for a while...

 

Most of us here are ADVANCED PLAYERS in the sense of playing the game for at least 1 more additional alpha (more likely several). This means we have tons of experience in fighting in this game. I'm talking about human skills, not in game skills. Just like you get accustomed to anything you frequent, we're more or less adjusted to 80-90% of the mechanics concerning fighting.

 

Implementing rage does not change much, apart from the need to react to it in some way. I'm pretty sure "baiting first swing" was acceptable fighting in A17 as well as in previous alphas, but i doubt anyone talked about it that much.

 

With that in mind, new players will need time to adjust, but we (as seasoned or advanced or pro players) already spent A TON of time fighting them zombies, even ferals and rads. You seriously think with one addition (apart from new sets of weapons) the fighting is so radically different that you have to relearn it? I doubt that.

Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm pretty sure "baiting first swing" was acceptable fighting in A17 as well as in previous alphas, but i doubt anyone talked about it that much.

 

Well I feel it has majorly changed. The preemptive swing comes too early. Try standing still and let a zombie approach. Its first swing is WAAAAY too early and will never (well perhaps VERY rarely) hit you. I feel they also nerfed player swing range (at least with clubs) but the 2 are out of whack atm. Melee has never been easier for me.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Well I feel it has majorly changed. The preemptive swing comes too early. Try standing still and let a zombie approach. Its first swing is WAAAAY too early and will never (well perhaps VERY rarely) hit you. I feel they also nerfed player swing range (at least with clubs) but the 2 are out of whack atm. Melee has never been easier for me.

 

It may not have been often, but rarely i went into range and could hit once or twice with my knife before the zombie would start making that first swing. I'm pretty sure it is random.

Link to post
Share on other sites
It may not have been often, but rarely i went into range and could hit once or twice with my knife before the zombie would start making that first swing. I'm pretty sure it is random.

 

It is easier to hit with machete than knives tho, rest assured. I'm a spear Main so far at early Game, but by looting all the ammo i transitioned very quickly to almost exclusively Shooting their heads off with guns in mid - Late game

Link to post
Share on other sites
I think Kage plays on low difficulty....default or something. He's more of a builder than a fighter.

 

Also, melee is broken now, imo. I simply do not get hit anymore outside of Enrage. Once you know to exploit their preemptive swing, and use a Club (only weapon I've tried in anger coz I love it, but should work with any melee weapon except a Spear), you basically cannot get hit from walking zombies.

 

Default is not low difficulty. Its default. As in normal. I cant have my skills being challenged like this. Raising difficulty next episode lol.

 

But back on topic. I think sp is working correctly. And is kinda easy on default difficulty. But mp is a different story. I was told a fun pimp dev said mp is broken atm as in the perks aren't working right with respect to combat. I heard this second hand but seems accurate to me. In my mp games zeds take like 6 to 10 hits to kill with the iron spear and that's with points spent in the javalin tree.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Can't say I've had any issues either, any my trusty club is what I meet 'n greet very nearly all zombies with.

 

Since when does any mod have any problem whatsoever with the game....

 

In any other case there are issues, pretending there isnt is a load of bullcrap.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Default is not low difficulty. Its default. As in normal. I cant have my skills being challenged like this. Raising difficulty next episode lol.

 

But back on topic. I think sp is working correctly. And is kinda easy on default difficulty. But mp is a different story. I was told a fun pimp dev said mp is broken atm as in the perks aren't working right with respect to combat. I heard this second hand but seems accurate to me. In my mp games zeds take like 6 to 10 hits to kill with the iron spear and that's with points spent in the javalin tree.

 

Interesting. I have 2 playthroughs in progress right now. One SP and one MP, and co-incidentally they are both on day 22. My observation is that MP is considerably harder, especially on horde night but generally as well. This is the first alpha I have felt that; it's usually the opposite.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 4 months later...

There aren't enough points to be a melee solo. Everything's so spread out now and points are rediculously scarce. I used to be able to at least have a half-decent build by L20, but now I'm lucky if I can scrape enough materials together, advance through tech, AND still qualify as a 'melee spec'. You actually NEED to blow a point just to grill meat. Seriously, that's stupid. That's like needing an instruction manual for grilled cheese.

 

Single player peeps can only be one thing: engineer-harvesters. Good luck getting points to spare for anything else.

Link to post
Share on other sites

A18's melee is an utter embarrassment that would get someone kicked out of a Collegiate course on game design. Let me assure each one of you tht from a very knowing full well what gets people a failing grade in game design courses.

 

There is no defending how far the reach of the hitboxes compared to the reach of the animations.

 

TFP really borked the melee in a very, extremely odd effort to make things harder when they just needed to polish up A16 and call t final. I'm not sure of the advantages of staying in EA forever, but clearly there are some.

 

If you play A16 for 10 minutes and do some melee you will walk away thinking "What the hell did they do and why??"

 

I 1000% enjoyed A16's MP as well. A16 is very easily IMO the best iteration of the game. Hands down.

Link to post
Share on other sites
There aren't enough points to be a melee solo. Everything's so spread out now and points are rediculously scarce. I used to be able to at least have a half-decent build by L20, but now I'm lucky if I can scrape enough materials together, advance through tech, AND still qualify as a 'melee spec'. You actually NEED to blow a point just to grill meat. Seriously, that's stupid. That's like needing an instruction manual for grilled cheese.

 

Single player peeps can only be one thing: engineer-harvesters. Good luck getting points to spare for anything else.

 

Well, what is the reason you wanna qualify as a melee spec? That´s a selfmade classification that has no impact on the game. Can you kill Z´s with putting skills in other things than melee? Yes you can. This isn´t a game that is about fighting only ya know. It´s a genre mix. Also there are people who can´t make a grilled cheese sandwich. Just saying..

 

And i do have points spare for other skills.

 

You seem like you play the wrong game tbh.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Because in A16.4 there was a difference between SP and MP and the long reach only happened in MP.

Since now ALL games are MP... Tadaaa!! Long reach for everyone! :D

Don't tell me I ams the only one in this thread that knows this... :p

Link to post
Share on other sites
There aren't enough points to be a melee solo. Everything's so spread out now and points are rediculously scarce. I used to be able to at least have a half-decent build by L20, but now I'm lucky if I can scrape enough materials together, advance through tech, AND still qualify as a 'melee spec'. You actually NEED to blow a point just to grill meat. Seriously, that's stupid. That's like needing an instruction manual for grilled cheese.

 

Single player peeps can only be one thing: engineer-harvesters. Good luck getting points to spare for anything else.

 

i have over 250 hours of a18, i made at least 5 playtrough and only in the first one spent a single point in masterchef, you can live easily enough with canned food and with the recipes that you can scavenge or, even more easily, with the recipe that you find in the tier1 buried supply quest

same thing for the engineer\harvesting part, i only spent point in yeah science and adv engineering, never in grease monkey(not even in my int playtrough), when i have a surplus of point, when i reach a decent level in my combat skill, same thing for harvesting, 1 or 2 point in mother lode is more than enough early game

Link to post
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...