madmole Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 You bought that asset bundle from him? Todd is my hero. But 10+ years between elder scrolls versions? I had high hopes to play about 10 more before I croak not 1-2. Should have shipped one in 2016 and another in 2020. They lost at least 2 billion dollars with this delay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnowDog1942 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 Todd is my hero. But 10+ years between elder scrolls versions? I had high hopes to play about 10 more before I croak not 1-2. Should have shipped one in 2016 and another in 2020. They lost at least 2 billion dollars with this delay. Its done when its done.... OHHHHHHHH!!!!!! dayyyyum…. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trankitas Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 Todd is my hero. But 10+ years between elder scrolls versions? I had high hopes to play about 10 more before I croak not 1-2. Should have shipped one in 2016 and another in 2020. They lost at least 2 billion dollars with this delay. One of the most (if not THE most) charismatic game developer/producer/director i've ever seen. They've made some mistakes but I love Bethesda, Fallout saga and 7 Days to die are my favourite games (and i've play a LOT of games in my 24 years of life). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scyris Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 I prefer to remain anonymous. "Go make your own game that is actually fun if its so easy" - done "Add voxels to it and use Unity and tell me how easy it is." - done, it isn't "Code it on top of 7 years of other peoples code." - I made my living doing this with a wide variety of code bases and several times the variables were named in other languages such as Turkish, Arabic and Slovenian. Still what game is it that your bragging about? Can't claim this stuff then refuse to prove it imo. If there are multiple people that worked on the game, its not like they'll pinpoint who you are, nor do they care really. They just wanna see if your game can live up to your bragging is all, and so do I. I need something to play till a18 hits anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RestInPieces Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 Todd is my hero. But 10+ years between elder scrolls versions? I had high hopes to play about 10 more before I croak not 1-2. Should have shipped one in 2016 and another in 2020. They lost at least 2 billion dollars with this delay. I used to respect him as a designer until he started sacrificing good gameplay in the name of accessibility. Still respect him as a businessman though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viktoriusiii Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 One of the occasions I agree with VictoriousIII, though I would have refrained from posting the know-it-all remark at the end You are one of the few that actually intuitively see the three i's as I's and therefor "the third"... and then you somehow corrected the hard K to a c god dammit. you were so close to greatness And my selfrighteousness really only happens to come out on this forum because I was right so often and people just kept claiming the same stupid arguments (not saying I'm better or anything! It is just frustrating to say 6+6=12 and someone says "but I only have 10 fingers so there is no way to count that high" over an over. And yes... it truely is like that sometimes on here (*cough* "why do you care how I play" is probably the most acknowledged one) Also thank you for agreeing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmole Posted July 20, 2019 Author Share Posted July 20, 2019 I used to respect him as a designer until he started sacrificing good gameplay in the name of accessibility. Still respect him as a businessman though. I'd disagree. Everything they made more accessible is a better design. Morrowind and Oblivion were overdesigned in some areas and they cleaned that up well in Skyrim. Spell creation: Klunky and was deleted. Leveling was streamlined. Classes removed. Armor needing repair was nuked. All better for the game IMO. Its a designer trap to make things overly complicated. Its actually very easy to make a klunky complicated design. Some odd players like that stuff, most don't. I tried Cities Skylines last night, I bought it in 2016 lol. Gave up on it in under 5 minutes, reading multiple paragraphs and "studying" on a Friday night is not my idea of fun. I've heard its a great game and it probably is, but there has to be a better way of teaching than making someone read a ton of garbage and make them feel like they are probably making a mistake by doing anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viktoriusiii Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 [...] Spell creation: Klunky and was deleted. Leveling was streamlined. [...] All better for the game IMO. I mean... it is just THE most requested feature in the elderscrolls... but I mean... that is you I guess If something isnt optimized, just scrap it and replace it with nothing instead of tweeking it so it is better. (#sorrynotsorry for that snarky tone, but it is true that this is one of 7d2d biggest flaws in my opinion and reading your comment I think I can trace it back to you. Removing something that is absolutely unbalancable is rarely okay. But not replacing it with something else leaves unnatural holes in the product, especially, but not exclusively for people who already played it before.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weazelsun Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 I'd disagree. Everything they made more accessible is a better design. Morrowind and Oblivion were overdesigned in some areas and they cleaned that up well in Skyrim. Spell creation: Klunky and was deleted. Leveling was streamlined. Classes removed. Armor needing repair was nuked. All better for the game IMO. Its a designer trap to make things overly complicated. Its actually very easy to make a klunky complicated design. Some odd players like that stuff, most don't. I tried Cities Skylines last night, I bought it in 2016 lol. Gave up on it in under 5 minutes, reading multiple paragraphs and "studying" on a Friday night is not my idea of fun. I've heard its a great game and it probably is, but there has to be a better way of teaching than making someone read a ton of garbage and make them feel like they are probably making a mistake by doing anything. In this case, I would disagree simply on the basis that some folks preferred the Oblivion style of actually having to choose a class and such. Heck, even with Skyrim, I have actually downloaded mods that implement such a thing in it, even though Skyrim at its core was never meant for it. As for Cities Skylines, I can kinda see where you didn't like it. I don't think I had to read too much but that's just my experience. Now on-topic, are there any more trader improvements coming? Like right now in-game there is the trader NPC and then are the rentable vending machines that be rented in the trader settlement. Are there any improvements that will come to incentive the player to use those rentable vending machines more? The only thing the in-game journal has about those vending machines is that a player can put things in it to sell and "NPC" will occasionally buy from it. Personally, for me the improvements I would like to see for that mechanic are: - Putting in more information in the journal as to what the "NPC" prefer to buy and how often they would buy from it - Being able to rent vending machines at all the traders instead of being locked to that one vending machine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouch Quit It Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 Coughs * VIDEO * Coughs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sillls Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 On this day marks the 50th anniversary of Apollo, the first moon landing! Be careful, some of those old farts are still around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerfly Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 On this day marks the 50th anniversary of Apollo, the first moon landing! Be careful, some of those old farts are still around. They were just faster than me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enragedcamel Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 Sorry if this has been asked and answered recently, but can we still expect the first A18 experimental to drop in August? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerfly Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 Sorry if this has been asked and answered recently, but can we still expect the first A18 experimental to drop in August? Plausible, dates are not discussed because the complexity of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunkwolf Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 Sorry if this has been asked and answered recently, but can we still expect the first A18 experimental to drop in August? I am 99.9% sure it wil drop before August. 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RestInPieces Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 I'd disagree. Everything they made more accessible is a better design. Morrowind and Oblivion were overdesigned in some areas and they cleaned that up well in Skyrim. Spell creation: Klunky and was deleted. Leveling was streamlined. Classes removed. Armor needing repair was nuked. All better for the game IMO. Its a designer trap to make things overly complicated. Its actually very easy to make a klunky complicated design. Some odd players like that stuff, most don't. I tried Cities Skylines last night, I bought it in 2016 lol. Gave up on it in under 5 minutes, reading multiple paragraphs and "studying" on a Friday night is not my idea of fun. I've heard its a great game and it probably is, but there has to be a better way of teaching than making someone read a ton of garbage and make them feel like they are probably making a mistake by doing anything. While I'd agree that complexity for the sake of complexity is a designer trap, I'd also argue that removing complexity that expands gameplay and adds depth because you want to widen your target audience/make it more user-friendly is also a trap. I think that in the end, complexity is only valuable when it adds something practical. 7D is already fairly complex and full of examples of that kind of complexity ranging from the forging/crafting process to player needs, so I can't imagine that you don't value it. Didn't spell making belong to that category of complexity though? It offered both practical value and was something to be coveted by players for various other reasons. They could have improved and build on it instead of throwing it away. Imo it was something worth salvaging. I read Todd's interview about it, but I think the real reasons it was thrown away were mostly technical. Complexity is one of Skylines' selling points, in a way. It has sold excellently after all. But yes, there surely is a better way of teaching than throwing a ton of information at once at the player, as you have also said many times before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaVegaNL Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 If MM thinks Cities Skylines is too complex, he better stay away from other Paradox games, hehe.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RipClaw Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 If MM thinks Cities Skylines is too complex, he better stay away from other Paradox games, hehe.. I love the paradox games. I like their complexity. You can spend hours optimizing traffic in Cities Skylines and it's a lot of fun. Or in Surviving Mars you must make sure that the population growth doesn't get out of hand and that you always have enough oxygen, energy and food. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gaffer Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 I wish people would stop asking for new stuff, i do not want anything else to delay Alpha 18 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaVegaNL Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 I love the paradox games. I like their complexity. You can spend hours optimizing traffic in Cities Skylines and it's a lot of fun. Or in Surviving Mars you must make sure that the population growth doesn't get out of hand and that you always have enough oxygen, energy and food. Yeah indeed! Or the micromanagement involved with Crusader Kings 2. Not to say those games are per se better than 7 days, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerfly Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 Yeah indeed! Or the micromanagement involved with Crusader Kings 2. Not to say those games are per se better than 7 days, of course. Quantum computers are on their way, just saying - - - Updated - - - I wish people would stop asking for new stuff, i do not want anything else to delay Alpha 18 Well, welcome to the forums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppycur Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 If MM thinks Cities Skylines is too complex, he better stay away from other Paradox games, hehe.. Well he has a valid business decision to make... Have a complicated game with a loyal, solid but small fan base, or listen to his rust buddies and consultant (real things he has posted) and simplify the game to appeal to the casual but much larger fan base. Both are valid. Neither is wrong. Me, I'd go after the money. So I don't blame them. Moddability is what the small/loyal crowd is going to do anyway, and they're certainly supporting that. Win/Win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tin Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 I wish people would stop asking for new stuff, i do not want anything else to delay Alpha 18 Pft, do you actually believe MM is going to hold up the release based off of them adding stuff that people asked for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odetta Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 Well he has a valid business decision to make... Have a complicated game with a loyal, solid but small fan base, or listen to his rust buddies and consultant (real things he has posted) and simplify the game to appeal to the casual but much larger fan base. Both are valid. Neither is wrong. Me, I'd go after the money. So I don't blame them. Moddability is what the small/loyal crowd is going to do anyway, and they're certainly supporting that. Win/Win. What you said is true but the only reason Rust has a larger player base is because it's a PVP game. Once the Pimps shift focus to that area of the game (they said they would, so it's not me) I can see the player count going up substantially. Single player games live forever but PVP games die when the player count reaches a certain low so I'm glad we have the game we got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sillls Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 I wish people would stop asking for new stuff, i do not want anything else to delay Alpha 18 But I was only going to ask for a few hundred other things. It shouldn't delay the next alpha for more than a few years. Walks away only to come back latter and see the storm this post started. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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