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Hopes and Worries about the Telltale Closure and Future of Console Edition


Roland

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I would honestly gladly and happily pay for an update if it came in the form of a DLC. That being said, I was also wondering about some way to crowdfund an update, like a kickstarter for a DLC/new version release. Anyone that donates more than a certain amount gets the update free, anyone else pays $10-$20, like a normal DLC, something along those lines. I was wondering myself about the Iron Galaxy connection. That would be the most logical method of trying to get an update out fast. IG knows more about the console version than TFP, and, like was said, probably has the nearly completed update still saved somewhere.

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It was never hidden that the console version was made from the Alpha 14.7 version of the game, or that it may not get any future updates or content.

Most of the money from the console version went to TellTale. It did not go to the PC, or have any significant benefit to the PC version.

 

I seriously don't know where you guys come up with this kind of ♥♥♥♥.

Maybe if you did some research before making a purchase like any smart consumer would, you wouldn't be making blatantly ignorant statements.

 

News and Announcements PC section, obviously shortly after it was released for console, and there was no console section in the forums back in June 2016.

https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?42274-Alpha-14-7-Stable-Is-Out!

 

talking about alpha 15 a few weeks out and what was done for this update of 14.7. So, seems to be someone could interpret that as future updates in a few weeks might mean even more updates. Before their initial purchase.

 

As for the amount of money made by TTG vs TFP, pretty sure that information is not available to the public. They didnآ’t do it for free so to say PC didnآ’t benefit at all, is not true. How much benefit, is impossible for a consumer to know unless disclosed by TFP. Which now that they own the rights, they get the $29.99 less console fee (I assume) per unit sold. One could interpret this as to why TFP would rather release a آ“new version of 7 days to dieآ” vs eating the cost of finishing up a free update for a game that someone already made money on. To be fair, it was TFP IP to begin with, but I didnآ’t negotiate the deal between the three parties who were involved in the console version. How many console versions were sold by TTG?

 

If anything you should be blaming this on TTG not the consumer. Since TTG didnآ’t alert TFP or the consumer they would go out of business and not finish something they promised. Seems like we both got burned. So donآ’t accuse people of being ignorant when someone does do research and still gets burned. For the record I donآ’t feel burned, but I could see where someone else did feel that way.

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I would honestly gladly and happily pay for an update if it came in the form of a DLC. That being said, I was also wondering about some way to crowdfund an update, like a kickstarter for a DLC/new version release. Anyone that donates more than a certain amount gets the update free, anyone else pays $10-$20, like a normal DLC, something along those lines. I was wondering myself about the Iron Galaxy connection. That would be the most logical method of trying to get an update out fast. IG knows more about the console version than TFP, and, like was said, probably has the nearly completed update still saved somewhere.

 

First off I work in the gaming industry for BGS (for disclaimer the opinions here are my own as a game software engineer and open world survival addict) As far as the money goes, studio's need to make money to put people to work. Its as simple as that. People are ready to pay for super small expansions for games like Destiny and yet would not want to help a small studio to get the money to put an update on a game people like to play ? This doesnt make sense. The game is totally playable as is. All future work should be done as a DLC. I would like TFP to get their due for this game. Now on the timeline we know how these things goes, the next gen dev kits will be finding their way more broadly next year for christmas when they release PS5 and XBOX. If anybody from TFP reads this, know that IG is a good company, but there is Behavior Interactive that is located in Montreal that does this kind of work and you would be benefitting from US to CAD exchange rate, so it would cost you a lot less to port your update if you have the code in hand if you ever want to do a final DLC on PS4. It is true it is costy to pass all the QA requirements to do updates, but there are programs for Indy studios and it cost a lot less to put updates out there as long as you have all the TRC done mostly. If you do not break any TRC's between updates then your turn around will cost almost nothing like on PC. For that the console makers have made great stride to make it easier. You can looke the number of indy games out there that have made their way to console. With that being said, I like the Idea of a Kickstarter to get an update on PS4. The current 7DTD dev time to gold doesnt seem to indicate they will be gold for the next 2 years. I agree that a come back with a bang could help build back the reputation of the game.

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Like I said they probably be better off waiting till next gen. It would put them closer to beta/gold and as they said if they do anything it will most likely be after that. The next gen console will be able to handle the game as it will have the minimum specs or should anyway based on the way they have talked about it plus by then the game will be running even smoother. I know I know it sucks for current gen but sometimes times it is what it is. At least now we don't have anymore speculations.

 

Waiting till next gen will officially burn the xbox base and I'm willing to bet 80 to 90% will not even consider buying it for next gen. The game is not really playable without a constant cycle of losing progress.

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Waiting till next gen will officially burn the xbox base and I'm willing to bet 80 to 90% will not even consider buying it for next gen. The game is not really playable without a constant cycle of losing progress.

 

Considering this gen can't handle the full game thst the PC is and next gen would be able to I bet a lot of people would buy it next gen. Really the odds of another update happening on this gen are slim and the ones that are burn are already as it is now. I get it that it sucks but them being such a small company I really don't see them doing another update. As they said the cost it already took with the mess they had to deal with and the added cost of what it would take to do an update that still wouldn't be up to date and people will still complain that it isn't. But say so be it you know with any game no update is ever a clean update so then they have to do a follow up update to fix the unknown bugs that pop up for that update and so on. It becomes very costly and as they said they have bills and families to feed just like everyone else. So really the best thing would be to just wait until they are done with the PC version then get that version ported over. Of course that is if they even do that but it would be the best option for them.

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Well my 2 cents into this....

I don't really care for a big update tbh.

I just wanted the game to become playable again.

I am an xbox gamer and I kept getting screwed over by the "MD5" progress killing bug which stopped me from playing this game.

Adding a manual saving option would make me come back.

It's a fun game as it is already but the bug destroyed my pleasure in the game.

Wouldn't cost millions to just add that in.

 

And yeah, I read the workaround but it is, from personal experience, not 100% preventing my save from getting corrupted.

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Considering this gen can't handle the full game thst the PC is and next gen would be able to I bet a lot of people would buy it next gen. Really the odds of another update happening on this gen are slim and the ones that are burn are already as it is now. I get it that it sucks but them being such a small company I really don't see them doing another update. As they said the cost it already took with the mess they had to deal with and the added cost of what it would take to do an update that still wouldn't be up to date and people will still complain that it isn't. But say so be it you know with any game no update is ever a clean update so then they have to do a follow up update to fix the unknown bugs that pop up for that update and so on. It becomes very costly and as they said they have bills and families to feed just like everyone else. So really the best thing would be to just wait until they are done with the PC version then get that version ported over. Of course that is if they even do that but it would be the best option for them.

 

Nobody is expecting a full port up to A18 we simply want what we were promised. The MD5 error has been going for years its unacceptable the game is still being sold when it it virtually unplayable for xbox players. Where are the simple additions we were told we would get IE paint and traps? Even new POI would be something i mean i fail to see how "its too expensive" is the cop out TFP are taking. Millions of people bought your game and we were told updates were coming you cant now say we changed our mind but you should buy a different version of the game. This is basically bait and switch - we were lured in with fake promises and now we bought into the game we're told we need to buy a new version to get those promises

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Nobody is expecting a full port up to A18 we simply want what we were promised. The MD5 error has been going for years its unacceptable the game is still being sold when it it virtually unplayable for xbox players. Where are the simple additions we were told we would get IE paint and traps? Even new POI would be something i mean i fail to see how "its too expensive" is the cop out TFP are taking. Millions of people bought your game and we were told updates were coming you cant now say we changed our mind but you should buy a different version of the game. This is basically bait and switch - we were lured in with fake promises and now we bought into the game we're told we need to buy a new version to get those promises

 

 

I wouldn't say nobody because a lot of people do. Not saying you are one of them or everyone just saying a lot of people do ask and not happy that it isn't like the PC version.

 

I would love nothing more then a update as far as the current gen could go and handle. But TT promised and they went bankrupt before at the very least the last update they was working on could be released. Even if it was released nothing was guaranteed that the MD5 issue for xbox would be fixed. Either way they went bankrupt and it is what it is really. If TFP don't have the money to put into it like that then how are they going to? Guess you want them to go broke and that it doesn't matter that they have bills, employees to pay and families to take care of. So they should just say oh all that doesn't matter we got to do this.

 

It sucks it does and wish it wasn't the way it is but it is the way it is and not much can be done with limited money. Sure a few people here have suggested a kickstarter or whatever to help pay for it but how many people besides the handful here would pay for another update? A lot of people will not so how can they even begin to do that and if it isn't enough money then people that put money into it will make claims they did it to support pc version and so on. I just really not sure what some want them to do if they don't have the money to do what another company promised? This wouldn't be the first time something like this has happened especially with a very small company and it most likely will not be the last. If you don't wanna buy it again if it comes out again on next gen consoles then don't is all I can really say.

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I wouldn't say nobody because a lot of people do. Not saying you are one of them or everyone just saying a lot of people do ask and not happy that it isn't like the PC version.

 

I would love nothing more then a update as far as the current gen could go and handle. But TT promised and they went bankrupt before at the very least the last update they was working on could be released. Even if it was released nothing was guaranteed that the MD5 issue for xbox would be fixed. Either way they went bankrupt and it is what it is really. If TFP don't have the money to put into it like that then how are they going to? Guess you want them to go broke and that it doesn't matter that they have bills, employees to pay and families to take care of. So they should just say oh all that doesn't matter we got to do this.

 

It sucks it does and wish it wasn't the way it is but it is the way it is and not much can be done with limited money. Sure a few people here have suggested a kickstarter or whatever to help pay for it but how many people besides the handful here would pay for another update? A lot of people will not so how can they even begin to do that and if it isn't enough money then people that put money into it will make claims they did it to support pc version and so on. I just really not sure what some want them to do if they don't have the money to do what another company promised? This wouldn't be the first time something like this has happened especially with a very small company and it most likely will not be the last. If you don't wanna buy it again if it comes out again on next gen consoles then don't is all I can really say.

 

I would say the immediate and easiest answer is stop developing the pc version and fix the console. The PC is 3 versions above console right now with loads more than we will ever receive. I image the pc base will survive just fine if say for the next year no further updates were released. The pc version is in essence complete and fully functional with none of the limits console players have. If TFP want to develop the pc version further they could release dlc same as suggested to console players

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I would say the immediate and easiest answer is stop developing the pc version and fix the console. The PC is 3 versions above console right now with loads more than we will ever receive. I image the pc base will survive just fine if say for the next year no further updates were released. The pc version is in essence complete and fully functional with none of the limits console players have. If TFP want to develop the pc version further they could release dlc same as suggested to console players

 

Unfortunately, never going to happen.

I assume TTG made the boatload of money on the deal with TFP to release the console version. Because remember TTG approached TFP about the idea. I donآ’t think TFP thought that console would be successful, and TTG made bank on that lesson. I think from a business point of view, TFP lost out on the revenue for for their IP on console. At this point the cost to update vs the cost to make a new release is about the same. That cost being about the same if you add in the additional revenue generated by the update vs re-release. That is simple business.

 

Side note, Tell Tale Games was a larger company and it actually was Tell Tale Publishing that worked with TFP and Iron Galaxy.

 

At this point if you ran TFP message about the current version of console, through the google translator it would have said, آ“Sorry guys update isnآ’t going to happen. When the next gen console comes out you can buy our version of 7 days to dieآ”.

 

At that point anyone who felt burned can choose to walk away. Everyone else will dig out their wallet/purse and pony up. I have already stated I will pony up. I just wish they would have said no on the update versus after PC goes gold. I am pretty sure they have zero idea of when PC will be finished, but I am sure that the new console version will be ready for sale when PS 5 hits the market in the آ“holiday 2020آ”.

 

So now we wait for the gold status for our next update I guess.

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Sure a few people here have suggested a kickstarter or whatever to help pay for it but how many people besides the handful here would pay for another update?

 

You never know unless you try. I mean, if TFP were to say "This is what a new update will cost us to put out (with an actual price, not just an estimate), see if you all can scrape the money together", who's to say they wouldn't meet that goal? There's still a lot of people that play console, most of whom have been waiting on an update or word from TFP about an update. With well over 100,000 copies sold between the consoles, if even a quarter of the original purchasers were to donate $10 or so, it would be a huge push towards getting an update out, and would show the devs how hungry the console crowd still is for their game.

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I would say the immediate and easiest answer is stop developing the pc version and fix the console. The PC is 3 versions above console right now with loads more than we will ever receive. I image the pc base will survive just fine if say for the next year no further updates were released. The pc version is in essence complete and fully functional with none of the limits console players have. If TFP want to develop the pc version further they could release dlc same as suggested to console players

 

 

So they should turn their back to the PC. People who invested in them before the first alpha even went out. People that been investing in them from day one. Something a different company started, went bankrupt not something they started and in fact made it very clear when TT started console that the made a promise to the ones on pc that helped with the kick starter that the console would NOT get in the way of finishing the pc version.

 

Do I need to keep on? I mean really not goin to happen regardless how much one wants to cry about it. They didn't make a promise to console. They made a promise to PC. The only thing they said with console was that they would try and do what they can. After the cost of this legal stuff they simply can't afford to do console not what you not understanding about this. Just because they have their name on it and got the rights back you think they have to do something and they simply do not have to. Like I said they didn't promise you anything besides they would try that is it. Not once did TFP promise you an update.

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You never know unless you try. I mean, if TFP were to say "This is what a new update will cost us to put out (with an actual price, not just an estimate), see if you all can scrape the money together", who's to say they wouldn't meet that goal? There's still a lot of people that play console, most of whom have been waiting on an update or word from TFP about an update. With well over 100,000 copies sold between the consoles, if even a quarter of the original purchasers were to donate $10 or so, it would be a huge push towards getting an update out, and would show the devs how hungry the console crowd still is for their game.

 

 

Sure they can try but if they say only get half the money that is a lot of money and then you have certain people that will come with pitch forks saying you took my money and put it towards PC because if they don't meet the goal where else would it go? It is a pretty big risk. Everyone on console was waiting on an update that TT promised. But now TFP have said they already spent loads of money on this legal mess and simply dont have it. They are a very small company after all. TT has simply screwed them and people want to blame TFP when all they did was sell the rights to TT. Wasn't like TFP said to themselves oh sure this company is goin to go bankrupt in a few years let's do this.

 

They said they know that many people still play. They even said they seen like 10,000 people playing over a weekend on console or something. I would love nothing else but to see updates happening on console and hope that something happens that they will be able to do so. But as of right now time to keep playing what we have, wait till next gen and see if they release a full version of the game that is actually up to date and also a console that can handle that and who knows what other surprises they might be able to do for next gen like servers or other things, or you feel betrayed and no way you goin to give them more money and just simply move on to other games or whatever it is one does.

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So they should turn their back to the PC. People who invested in them before the first alpha even went out. People that been investing in them from day one. Something a different company started, went bankrupt not something they started and in fact made it very clear when TT started console that the made a promise to the ones on pc that helped with the kick starter that the console would NOT get in the way of finishing the pc version.

 

Do I need to keep on? I mean really not goin to happen regardless how much one wants to cry about it. They didn't make a promise to console. They made a promise to PC. The only thing they said with console was that they would try and do what they can. After the cost of this legal stuff they simply can't afford to do console not what you not understanding about this. Just because they have their name on it and got the rights back you think they have to do something and they simply do not have to. Like I said they didn't promise you anything besides they would try that is it. Not once did TFP promise you an update.

 

"The only thing they said with console was that they would try and do what they can.:"

 

which apparently was absolutely nothing and remains nothing. I dont care what cost are involved now for years TFP simply didnt do much of anything for the console player base. Again if TFP had no intention of making a console port they shouldnt have sold the rights but again if they didnt they likely wouldnt have been able to fund the pc version. this is fair turn around TFP/pc players benefited off of the console release and now with the opportunity to return the favor they should complete the projects we never got

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"The only thing they said with console was that they would try and do what they can.:"

 

which apparently was absolutely nothing and remains nothing. I dont care what cost are involved now for years TFP simply didnt do much of anything for the console player base. Again if TFP had no intention of making a console port they shouldnt have sold the rights but again if they didnt they likely wouldnt have been able to fund the pc version. this is fair turn around TFP/pc players benefited off of the console release and now with the opportunity to return the favor they should complete the projects we never got

 

What??? They sold the console rights to TT. If you really truly think they couldn't do the PC version without console you are crazy. They have sold more copies on PC to do what they have been doing without console. You really truly have no clue what you are talking about based on several of your comments so say what you want I'm done talking about it with you. Have a good one.

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What??? They sold the console rights to TT. If you really truly think they couldn't do the PC version without console you are crazy. They have sold more copies on PC to do what they have been doing without console. You really truly have no clue what you are talking about based on several of your comments so say what you want I'm done talking about it with you. Have a good one.

 

No i really think it is you who are clueless if you are trying to argue TFP didnt gain large sums of money off the port. Money which was used to further the pc development. Pc would not be where it was based only on the kick stater and sales they had. Until 2016 when the port happened the games was a relative unknown without any real backing. To that end the massive updates within a year of that deal are the changes which largely shaped the game and brought in the fan base. The addition of traps, electricity, alpha 15, 16 etc all happened within a year of the port....coincidence TFP suddenly pushed massive updates frequently after that or the result of cash influx you decide

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No i really think it is you who are clueless if you are trying to argue TFP didnt gain large sums of money off the port. Money which was used to further the pc development. Pc would not be where it was based only on the kick stater and sales they had. Until 2016 when the port happened the games was a relative unknown without any real backing. To that end the massive updates within a year of that deal are the changes which largely shaped the game and brought in the fan base. The addition of traps, electricity, alpha 15, 16 etc all happened within a year of the port....coincidence TFP suddenly pushed massive updates frequently after that or the result of cash influx you decide

This post again? Maybe you missed my other response.

 

No and we dont really need them? It's dumb to assume TFP didnt see any profit from the console sales and no matter what percentage that may have been the fact is they used to it further pc development. If its 1% or 70% the money was spent to develop a product other than the product the sales were generated from. For the pure sake of argument lets say they sold 1 million copies on ps4 and a million on xbox at a conservative $10 a copy (way below the $29.99 tag it came out with). Even at 1% that means they had a profit of $200,000. Is anyone seriously going to argue that with even a 1% sale revenue TFP couldnt have worked towards finishing the console versions?

Actually you do if you want to support your argument.

 

Let's take a gander.

30% of sales to MS and Sony. This is a known number.

5-10% of sales to TFP for licensing. (Unknown, but pretty common amount)

50% of sales to Iron Galaxy to fund development. (Again, unknown. We know it's not cheap though.)

Remaining 10-15% goes to Telltale profits.

 

Now, you can also argue that that small % that went to TFP, was used to pay for the support they gave IG in developing the console version. It also could have covered legal fees, and other things regarding the console version itself.

 

You can't just assume that it directly supported PC development. You can guarantee that it's not enough to cover finishing the console versions.

 

Which lets be fair, is something TFP have said that they want to do. There are some issue with doing that though, and they've given you a heads up about it.

 

You guys seem to forget that they are still working on solving this issue. You're all treating it as if TFP said it's the end, for which they most certainly did not.

 

You keep showing that you quite obviously have no clue about how things really went down, how things work, or have much of a grasp on reality.

You're just making things up to suit your agenda.

Knock it off.

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Hello.

Here is my personal point of view, hopes & worries included !

 

What I read in TFP news :

The Fun Pimps have re-acquired full console publishing rights

Great news !!!

 

…and we do not have the resources or expertise to do ports/updates to the console

Bad news, but not unexpected. TFP is neither Electronic Arts nor Activision in size and resources.

 

... we have to evaluate the expense and risk of porting any future versions of the game to consoles relative to the income it could generate.

It seems very logical and expected.

They have a way to "evaluate the risk" : open a poll topic on this forum asking who will be interested in buying a future version of 7DTD. Although incomplete, full of lost promises, they would have a gross idea of their future customers.

 

Full console ports cost into the millions of dollars

Err, with Electronic Arts as a porting company perhaps, but there are plenty cheaper console companies doing ports.

Anyway, using 3rd party partners is always very expensive, and there are right to be cautious.

 

With Sony and Microsoft, no matter how small, any update has to go through a rigorous testing/submission process.

They forgot Nintendo with the Switch, but a zombie-survival game is more fit for Sony/Microsoft consoles and customers.

Anyway, there are 100% right, those two are pityless on QA testing.

 

In summary as I personally see this news :

For TFP --> It's good news, at least TFP bring their baby back home. Now they have to decide what's next.

For 7DTD players --> Just sit (err, play current 7DTD) and wait, something will eventually emerge now FTP owns the rights back.

 

Thank you for having read my post.

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Everyone on console was waiting on an update that TT promised.

 

This is something else that confuses me. If Telltale, as the original console publishers, promised an update, isn't there a legal (or at least moral) obligation to uphold that promise? Now that Telltale has been necroed back into existence, shouldn't they be held responsible for at least one further console update? Regardless of whether or not it's technically the same company, by taking on the name "Telltale", they've taken on the previous company's baggage, imo. Telltale made promises, not just to TFP, but to the players of this game, and I think they should have to follow through with those promises. Even though TFP have the rights back now, the "new" Telltale should still be held accountable for their "old" screwups. In the past, I have bought quite a few Telltale games (7D2D, TWD, Batman, etc.), but I can guarantee that I'll never buy another one. If the "new" Telltale wants to wipe out the bad name that the company currently has, following through with old promises for the sake of the customer, regardless of cost, would be a damn fine way to show it.

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If Telltale, as the original console publishers, promised an update, isn't there a legal (or at least moral) obligation to uphold that promise?

 

Only a written contract is a legal promise and can be enforced by a judge. Everything else is pure chit-chat.

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Only a written contract is a legal promise and can be enforced by a judge. Everything else is pure chit-chat.

 

That and also the fact they did bankrupt so would matter if they are back or not.... I made a promise to make my credit card payments on time but I failed and I went bankrupt. Now I'm back on my feet that doesn't mean I take back over those old debt that is what going bankrupt means. No different with a company that does bankruptcy. So no TT does not have to do anything at all no matter if at the time was written or chit chat promise.

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I guess I just don't like the fact that Telltale gets to screw over a small independent gaming company and well over 100,000 customers and get away with it scot-free, with their "bankrupted" company still intact, even. I feel like there should be some compensation for their inadequacies somehow.

 

I don't think it's the same company now. Someone aquired the name and assets I think.

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I don't think it's the same company now. Someone aquired the name and assets I think.

Yeah basically. This isn't the same company at all. It's a totally different entity that is just using the same name and has rights to most of the titles from the previous company. The new Telltale is extremely removed from the old Telltale.

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