Sirillion Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 Ultimately the food issue will need some extra work. It seems there will be no one size fits all fix but rather a conglomeration of ideas, many of which have already been listed by the wonderful minds from fellow players. I understand that some fear the tedium of food spoilage but I feel that is a good starting point (with proper balancing) to minimize over abundance. It also introduces more aspects to gameplay like working towards refrigeration (be it electrical or old fashioned block ice method). It will also increase the value of stockpiling canned goods and gives them value again. Speaking of canned goods, once smell sense is working properly again, canned goods become even more valuable as the zombies will always smell uncanned meat products. This can be taken one step further by allowing dogs/wolves/bears to have extra sensitivity and aggression towards smelling meat. Perhaps they can be given a آ“huntingآ” mechanic when they smell meat which could add some interesting gameplay. Another great idea previously mentioned was crop trampling which can add so much to the survival aspect of the game, kind of a risk vs reward system (do I chance it and leave my field unprotected or do I spend the time and resources to make it defensible)? Scavenger creatures like crows, rabbits, and gophers can also be introduced which could eat crops as could locusts which can devour crops (and be caught and eaten in turn). Crops can be made to not grow in the cold biomes while meat can be frozen there. Desert drought could be introduced to make crops perish as can a lack of rainfall. Rainfall could also give a bonus to growth but too much rain can also rot crops in the ground. Perks can also be adjusted to increase harvest (or decrease harvest penalties). The entire process of farming can go beyond just picking perks, ie, make the character have to tend to the farm more ( better crops mean more time working the fields which mean less time doing other things). Tending the fields also could attract more zombie attention. Overall food should be not so much harder to come by but rather harder to sustain. Lack of food (or quality calories) should slowly make one weaker, slower, and more susceptible to sickness/disease while healthy food and protein can give believable buffs like resistance and increased strength. Starvation would be so much scarier in a zombie apocalypse when you get progressively slower due to increased encumbrance and your hits get weaker and weaker with every swing and ultimately your stamina stays at zero. This way you do not die so quickly but yet death is on the horizon and suddenly finding food becomes an exciting adventure where even the lowliest zombie can be a major threat as you barely have the speed to escape or the strength to fight (the player needs to think and be cautious more than ever). Vultures then become the herald of your death. First they gather, then they peck, eventually they attract a horde of zombies... think of the excitement! Of course all of this would require proper feedback and balancing. Thoughts? This ^^^ I found this post to be interesting. I like the thought of a food spoilage system. And I like the way it is described here. The value it would give to canned goods is good as with this I would use whatever food is not canned first to keep it from spoiling. It could also introduce the need to process the food you gather as unprocessed food would spoils faster than processed. No stockpiling meat for ages without a freezer or processing kind of thing. I like the different growths based on biomes but I would also like to see spoilage differences with the biomes. Meat spoils faster if stored in a crate in the desert for instance, or having crops freeze to death in the snow biome. It is an interesting system that would bring a lot of the survival element back with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gaffer Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 Call me when RWG is fixed...still roads into mountains, POIs that float and are sunken down into the ground. Do any of the great systems of A17 actually work or are they all placeholders again for the next great iteration. Game is still a grind .. A gameday to open up a safe...BOOOOOORING!!! Its over Johnny!!! You killed a great game that just needed some tweaking and bug fixes and more late game content. 2 years to get what??? the same problems of A16 and more. Wow man you must have some patience standing around hitting a safe with a stone axe, if you find a safe early game just mark it on the map and come back to it later when you have a pickaxe. At the start of each game i am more interested in finding food, cooking pots and grills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Nice Cup of Tea Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 It’s a game full of freedom but just because you could doesn’t mean you should. Learn from Jurassic Park people! Velociraptors confirmed for A18! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weazelsun Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 People used to go into the hub city on day one naked and with only a stone axe and a wooden club and then complain that the hub cities were unfair when they died and then five more times trying to retrieve their backpack. Just die die die booooooooooriiiiiing!!!!! It’s a game full of freedom but just because you could doesn’t mean you should. Learn from Jurassic Park people! ^THIS. Plus, the fact that the only thing in a damn safe is going to be firearms and ammo. When I start a new game, my focus is on food/water/medical supplies. I've already got a bow and lots of birdsnest are on the ground that contain, guess what! Feathers. Feathers+wood+stone = arrows. On the other hand, I can understand why players would go for a safe. It contains a firearms and ammo. But, at the same time folks. The first starting weapons you have should be doable, unless one doesn't like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldranon Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 ^THIS. Plus, the fact that the only thing in a damn safe is going to be firearms and ammo. When I start a new game, my focus is on food/water/medical supplies. I've already got a bow and lots of birdsnest are on the ground that contain, guess what! Feathers. Feathers+wood+stone = arrows. On the other hand, I can understand why players would go for a safe. It contains a firearms and ammo. But, at the same time folks. The first starting weapons you have should be doable, unless one doesn't like that. With 17.3 wolves seem more abundant. Having a pistol at least, was on my mind as twice I almost walked into one were it not for the howls they sometimes make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weazelsun Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 With 17.3 wolves seem more abundant. Having a pistol at least, was on my mind as twice I almost walked into one were it not for the howls they sometimes make. Hm... then I'll have to check out A17.3 then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hek Harris Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 Dear devs, will we soon have a patch for the return of the infection? I play survivalist mode with a speed always nightmarish, but with all the food everywhere and no more infections, the game is rather boring ... You have to eat rotten flesh to feel a bit in danger ... And I hope you will remove all those gardens with 50 potatoes or blueberries, that makes no sense in a devastated world ^^. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tete1805 Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 Regarding food, maybe crops diseases? A percentage of crops would turn to dead plants. (Like dead corn.) And a perk/book/tool/whatever could help reduce the risk of disease. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chikorina Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 No promises, but after 18 is stable we're going to try to update the 4 we already have supported, and add Russian, Chinese and Japanese. Japanese too! Thank you. I've fully translated the vanilla 7 Days to Die, as well as 8 mods for it. I've been getting great feedback for them. Japanese people really seem to like this game. I had a lot of people tell me that they bought the game because they can play it in Japanese with my localization. Once it's officially supported, I'm sure there will be more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acquisitor Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 Dear devs, will we soon have a patch for the return of the infection? I play survivalist mode with a speed always nightmarish, but with all the food everywhere and no more infections, the game is rather boring ... You have to eat rotten flesh to feel a bit in danger ... And I hope you will remove all those gardens with 50 potatoes or blueberries, that makes no sense in a devastated world ^^. Have you ever left a basic garden unattended? My eggplant harvest last year had really pathetic produce because of less than ideal weather. I left them to drop and become compost. This year... so many new plants! Humans were devastated by the infection, the plants were not. The over-abundance of crops and large gardens makes sense, not like 'smart' zombies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hek Harris Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 Have you ever left a basic garden unattended? My eggplant harvest last year had really pathetic produce because of less than ideal weather. I left them to drop and become compost. This year... so many new plants! Humans were devastated by the infection, the plants were not. The over-abundance of crops and large gardens makes sense, not like 'smart' zombies... So, you want over-abundance of crops ?? Whatever the reason (illness, shortage, radiation ...) we need a world where resources are scarce. And for those who want an adventure in a world of opulence, the creative menu is wide open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endy Gainer Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 So, you want over-abundance of crops ?? Whatever the reason (illness, shortage, radiation ...) we need a world where resources are scarce. And for those who want an adventure in a world of opulence, the creative menu is wide open. By that same token argument, if you really want a world devoid of abundant resources the XMLs are wide open. How's about we stop blasting the other side and just agree to request these things as options instead of core game mechanics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazz Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 They are already options. It takes a single line to quadruple your harvest yield if that's what you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hek Harris Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 By that same token argument, if you really want a world devoid of abundant resources the XMLs are wide open. How's about we stop blasting the other side and just agree to request these things as options instead of core game mechanics? It's a survival game. My request was for the developers, not for the players who don't care about survival. But thank you for your advice: if the devs leave these fields as they are, I will remove the buildings concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endy Gainer Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 They are already options. It takes a single line to quadruple your harvest yield if that's what you want. I'm well aware. It just feels to me like all the arguments for and against spoilage and food balance is, "The game needs to be this way by default because I want survival to be more hardcore!" or, "The game needs to be this way by default because I hate micro-managing resources!" Options to tweak things are already available via XMLs, which are dirt easy to modify, and I feel like both sides could win easily if we argued for things like spoilage as options, rather than long-winded arguments about how we think others should play "our" game. It brings to mind the arguments I see when long-running games introduce faster or easier methods of catching up to current content, either by nerfing previous content difficulty or making rewards easier to get. There's a pervasive idea I've witnessed that someone even having an option somehow diminishes your own achievements and efforts, so there's always tooth and nail fighting against such changes, or demands to make things harder. Which introduces people from the other side into the fray, since now they feel attacked. Neither is actually making the game or community better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaVegaNL Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 People used to go into the hub city on day one naked and with only a stone axe and a wooden club and then complain that the hub cities were unfair when they died and then five more times trying to retrieve their backpack. Just die die die booooooooooriiiiiing!!!!! It’s a game full of freedom but just because you could doesn’t mean you should. Learn from Jurassic Park people! What if you rooted for the dinosaurs? - - - Updated - - - In one sentence, the bible references time as irrelevant to God as a shepherd might understand it. Oddly, Christian's have only partially embraced that one sentence. More oddly, only now does quantum mechanics support that sometimes, time is irrelevant. Time is irrelevant.. Pretty much sums up the punctuality of my in-laws.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gronk Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 <nevermind, need more coffee> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicUs5000 Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 Have you ever left a basic garden unattended? My eggplant harvest last year had really pathetic produce because of less than ideal weather. I left them to drop and become compost. This year... so many new plants! Humans were devastated by the infection, the plants were not. The over-abundance of crops and large gardens makes sense, not like 'smart' zombies... Plants vs Zombies is a different game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrton Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 @Madmole, some questions, * In A18 we will have more new Pois? *New recipes? * Will we have zombie bosses? - * Will we have more air enemies? (bees and vultures) * Deterioration of crops? * More defense traps? (will return the peak) * Crossbow trap? * Throw flames? * Can we use the cameras and connect them to the TVs and watch them from our bunker? (that would be great) * More animals? (cows, tigers, and turkeys) * Scorpions in desert terrain? * Piranhas and sharks in the water? * Missions that take you to meet another merchant? * More skins for zombies? Keep up the good work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FA_Q2 Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 How are you intending to balance this without SBD? Once you have a farm that produces one more of an item than you need it's only a matter of time before the stockpile becomes huge. You can delay this by fine-tuning but that's not really a balance. This is no different with spoilage other than not having a lot in storage. You would just build a slightly larger farm that would yield what you need with some extra just in case. Again, as long as farming exists you will always be able to 'solve' hunger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FA_Q2 Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 I thought about attribute boosting foods, and special dishes that are good for ailments, more heat and cold insulation, etc. I would like to see most foods come with a very slight buff that would apply until you ate again or became hungry/thirsty. It would allow you to prepare when you travel rather than just going out with standard gear and a different jacket. Food for fighting (maybe health), heat, cold etc. Connecting this with skyrim as that seems the theme of the day it would be like the stews in requiem (if you ever played that mod). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FA_Q2 Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 Thanks for proving our point. It is easy to gain a surplus, no argument. Preserving that surplus to use months later for yummy home made soup during the winter is what food spoilage is all about. It is the quest for preservation and not that we want to see disappearing stacks of food. I get it. We all get food preservation for free right now. It's tough for some to give up what they already get for free and have to earn it. It's like the difference in building a base with the creative menu enabled vs disabled. With the creative menu on you can have all the blocks you need for free. With it off you have to gather resources and craft the blocks. Right now food preservation is "creative menu enabled." In some parallel universe the game has no other option for building except having the creative menu enabled and players just get whatever they need. Other players suggest turning that off and adding things like trees and rocks and ore that would have to be harvested to gather the mats and then players would have to craft the blocks. Those players are then told, "Adding that stuff would add very little value to the game" or "Who wants to micromanage the blocks we use to build with?" or "Stop trying to add artificial difficulty. If we will get the blocks eventually through gathering and harvesting we might as well get them like we do now" and the favorite... "If TFP adds the need to harvest and gather materials and then forces us to craft our own blocks that will be the first thing I mod out the moment that patch releases!" The question is no if the system is more complex or adds something to do but what behaviors would it change and, tbh, if food spoiled I would do almost nothing different. I already have a farm that is capable of producing enough veg stews to last until the next harvest cycle. The only real difference is I would harvest more often rather than cooking my food in larger batches. I guess it would solve one thing - I would not need to organize my food box anymore.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hek Harris Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 When bandits will be on the map, I hope they will have the ability to raid our bases. Food spoilage will not be a request anymore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omegarte Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 Food spoilage mechanics seems like a modded thing and not something required in the core game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meganoth Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 Ultimately the food issue will need some extra work. .... Thoughts? Nice summary of ideas. What everyone seems to be forgetting is that we have **exponentially** growing seed crafting in the game. Remove that and a lot of the overabundance of food is gone. Just make it so you can't craft seeds from your own plants. So, you want over-abundance of crops ?? Whatever the reason (illness, shortage, radiation ...) we need a world where resources are scarce. And for those who want an adventure in a world of opulence, the creative menu is wide open. I think Acquisitor was only challenging the last sentence of your post where you said "that makes no sense in a devastated world", i.e. you were not talking about game balance but compared it to your expectation of what is realistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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