Game feels like its punishing me for levelling up

[OzHawkeye]

I'm a HUGE Borderlands fan and used to speedrun Borderlands 2. Grinding the "bosses" for "legendary weapons" was a ton of fun, I just don't see how it would fit in this game. To grind the bosses for the drops required many MANY restarts just to get the item you wanted. Not sure that has a place in 7DTD, but sounds like it's coming.

 

Well, I'd be all in favour of extending the loot table. On my current game, my first in Navazgane since, well, Alpha 9 I guess, I've basically finished looting with Deirsville(sp?) and the Shotgun Messiah just to the west of it. I mean, I could get another mod or two to be sure (particularly in armour) but I'm pretty much geared up with not much of the map yet explored.

[RipClaw]

Don't know if I'm up with the idea. Finding items like "Wicked Hunting Knife", "Lucky Bone Shiv", "Pistol of Fear", "Iron Shovel of Digging", feels like Diablo or Borderlands. I'm on the fence here. Will enemies also get these denotations? "Chuck Corrupted Cop" (a rare bloated cop), "Daisy the Black Widow" (a rare stripper zombie), "Willy Foreman of Dread" (hardhat zombie).

 

Why not? People are already naming the zombies.

 

edit: besides, "Blood Hammer Bringer of the Final Sleep" is ridiculous.

 

Don't say anything against the bloodhammer. He has already brought many people a lot of entertaining hours on youtube.

 

I once had the bright pink burning spiked club of death. However they have unfortunately in 17.1 toned down the pink which I find really pity. Somehow it was funny to beat the zombies with a burning barbie club.

 

Don't look at these things so seriously. A bit of fun has never hurt anyone.

[PoppaTot]

Well, I'd be all in favour of extending the loot table. On my current game, my first in Navazgane since, well, Alpha 9 I guess, I've basically finished looting with Deirsville(sp?) and the Shotgun Messiah just to the west of it. I mean, I could get another mod or two to be sure (particularly in armour) but I'm pretty much geared up with not much of the map yet explored.

 

I can see if the legendary items are legit RNG like Augers, Chainsaws, ect. But I would not like to see there be specific enemies with specific loot pools. Just my opinion though.

[Kage848]

Don't know if I'm up with the idea. Finding items like "Wicked Hunting Knife", "Lucky Bone Shiv", "Pistol of Fear", "Iron Shovel of Digging", feels like Diablo or Borderlands. I'm on the fence here. Will enemies also get these denotations? "Chuck Corrupted Cop" (a rare bloated cop), "Daisy the Black Widow" (a rare stripper zombie), "Willy Foreman of Dread" (hardhat zombie).

 

This certainly adds rewards and variety for loot and enemies, respectivaly, but it'll also certainly steer the game into the action RPG genre.

 

edit: besides, "Blood Hammer Bringer of the Final Sleep" is ridiculous.

 

Fair enough. If all you want is the same old survival tropes over and over again that's fine.

 

For me, I want new things. I want more rpg in my survival games.

 

And Blood Hammer Bringet of the Final Sleep is great 😋

[PoppaTot]

However they have unfortunately in 17.1 toned down the pink which I find really pity. Somehow it was funny to beat the zombies with a burning barbie club.

 

Don't look at these things so seriously. A bit of fun has never hurt anyone.

 

I miss the bright pink as well. FeelsBadMan

[Kage848]

I can see if the legendary items are legit RNG like Augers, Chainsaws, ect. But I would not like to see there be specific enemies with specific loot pools. Just my opinion though.

 

Meh. Augers and chainsaws have been in the game for years now. How about new items and ideas.

[PoppaTot]

Meh. Augers and chainsaws have been in the game for years now. How about new items and ideas.

 

You totally missed my point lol. I'm saying that the new items should have the same RNG drop rate as those items lol

[RestInPieces]

Dragonzzz!!!

[Kage848]

You totally missed my point lol. I'm saying that the new items should have the same RNG drop rate as those items lol

 

Oh ic. Maybe. But if it's going to be better than an auger it should drop less right?

 

I would also be an item you could never craft. And would give the people complaining about no reason to go out and loot a reason too. It also helps with the issues of high gamestage zombies and no loot worth while.

[PoppaTot]

Oh ic. Maybe. But if it's going to be better than an auget it should drop less right?

 

I would also be an item you could never craft. And would give the people complaining about no reason to go out and loot a reason too. It also helps with the issues of high gamestage zombies and nonkoot worth while.

 

I can agree with all that, I would have a ton of fun searching for the rarer items and it would bring a lot more hours of looting to me.

 

Unfortunately, there will be a lot of people that just use CM to bring the item in and then complain that there is no reason to loot LUL

[Jedo]

Well, I'd be all in favour of extending the loot table. On my current game, my first in Navazgane since, well, Alpha 9 I guess, I've basically finished looting with Deirsville(sp?) and the Shotgun Messiah just to the west of it. I mean, I could get another mod or two to be sure (particularly in armour) but I'm pretty much geared up with not much of the map yet explored.

 

My buddy and I have done about the same (haven't done the Shotgun Messiah yet), but we don't have near that stuff. Did you luck out on RNG?

 

I can see if the legendary items are legit RNG like Augers, Chainsaws, ect. But I would not like to see there be specific enemies with specific loot pools. Just my opinion though.

 

I wouldn't want to find legendary items in trash bags on the road. It should come from higher tier POIs or higher tier quests, I would think.

[Kage848]

My buddy and I have done about the same (haven't done the Shotgun Messiah yet), but we don't have near that stuff. Did you luck out on RNG?

 

 

 

I wouldn't want to find legendary items in trash bags on the road. It should come from higher tier POIs or higher tier quests, I would think.

 

How about they only drop in those really big new secure chests? They suck atm. Only thing I ever get from them is like 10 ammo of assorted ammo.

[PoppaTot]

I wouldn't want to find legendary items in trash bags on the road. It should come from higher tier POIs or higher tier quests, I would think.

 

Makes sense, the premise I'm trying to set for my thought on it is that I don't want a singular dedicated loot pool for it. I would like for it to be RNG based. Ideally I would like to see it setup in development to be that it only comes from reinforced chests, safes, and loot bag drops.

 

Or something similar to that. I don't want it to be something like BL2 where you fight BNK3R and reset repeatedly until you get the perfect Sham Shield. See what I mean?

[Jedo]

Makes sense, the premise I'm trying to set for my thought on it is that I don't want a singular dedicated loot pool for it. I would like for it to be RNG based. Ideally I would like to see it setup in development to be that it only comes from reinforced chests, safes, and loot bag drops.

 

Or something similar to that. I don't want it to be something like BL2 where you fight BNK3R and reset repeatedly until you get the perfect Sham Shield. See what I mean?

 

Sure, and I'm not sure how your scenario would be possible anyway (or even something approximating that in the 7dtd world). I wouldn't mind a multi-quest chain required to get it, but that would run close to your scenario. I guess I would want something where people can't just backdoor the loot room and look in the chest most likely to contain the legendary item.

 

(On a side note, I did find a back door into two POIs recently because TFP has trained me to look for strange flaps/panels. My buddy went in the regular way, so i went and looted the loot room then caught up to him. When we got to the end, he was like, "Where's the stuff? Is this it?" So funny.)

[PoppaTot]

Sure, and I'm not sure how your scenario would be possible anyway (or even something approximating that in the 7dtd world). I wouldn't mind a multi-quest chain required to get it, but that would run close to your scenario.

 

I suppose, for context purposes, there have been people wanting to see "boss zombies" added to the game to make horde night and POIs more "worth it". I may be taking things from other threads and including them into my thoughts here.

 

Long story short, I don't want boss fights with guaranteed loot drops. Hope that doesn't make it's way to 7D.

[RestInPieces]

Forgive my grumpiness this fine day, but that's what happens when you find a gun at every 2nd POI, lootlists are all over the place, resource sinks are not enough and traders feel like Walmart on Christmas Eve. Next logical step - rarer legendary stuff.

[Hek Harris]

... and hostile traders

[Khulkhuum]

I see one potential resolution that i think would satisfy most people here (seeing by the comments here, but also my own reflections on the topic). This is ofcourse apart from raising the amounts of loot you get (or the type of loot, including new items), but i think would greatly enhance how people would like to play.

 

Modifiable gamestage evolution throughout the game.

 

In short, it would be a setting for a specific map where you choose one of the many ways GS is calculated. Additionally, add a slider on how fast GS would increase - this would be independent (allowing tougher zombies, but GS rising differently) of game difficulty or on the other hand equal to it (so no slider).

1. Zombie kill counter based. - The more zombies you kills, the higher the GS. You don't kill Zs, you don't get higher GS. This should not be 1 zombie = 1 GS and definitely would require some tweaking.

2. Level based. - The higher your level, the bigger the GS. This is alongside how you advance with skills. At later stages you would need more skillpoints to advance some skills, meaning the GS would increase faster than your skills later on. Base values could be something like 1 level = 1 GS seems plausible, but you could get 1 level = 2 GS after level 50, 1 level = 3 GS after 100, etc. to get the game harder.

3. Time based. - The longer you play, the higher the GS. You could focus on power levelling to get the skills, knowing that sooner or later you'll get overwhelmed. Base values could be 1 day = 1 GS, but after each bloodmoon the increase would highten. So till day 7 you would have increase 1 per day, till 14th would be 2 per day, till 21th 3 per day, etc. This way you wouldn't have GS 20 on day 20, still with mostly the same enemies, but vastly greater skills.

4. Zombie kill counter + Level based. - Different than current mix, a more focus on killing and level raising. In tune for players wanting to leisurely play, not caring much about time passed or the zombies.

5. Time based + Level based. - Current option we have.

6. Zombie kill counter + Time based. - Aimed for those that want to power level not by killing zombies.

7. Time + Level + Zombie kill. - All types into one, meaning the GS will rise fast. Not for the faint of heart.

 

To some extent this would feel like such diverse games like Rimworld, where you can tweak and mod so many things, yet lets you play as you really want, changing the increase of the "difficulty" in so many different ways.

[Royal Deluxe]

All we need are two multiplicators in the gamestage calculation

 

(Vanilla gamestage calculation) * XML multiplicator * Option multiplicator

 

The XML Multiplicator is set to 1 (But can be used by mods, maybe ideally inside buffs too *)

and the option multiplicator is set to 1 too as default setting but can be

0.1, 0.25, 0.5, 0,75, 1, 1.5, 2, 4, 10

 

 

* (like lootabundance should be too))

[Vomkat]

Yah, my biggest issue with this game is how quickly it degenerates into glowing green jumping spider spitter zombies. Normal zombies are more interesting.

[Cirion]

I see one potential resolution that i think would satisfy most people here (seeing by the comments here, but also my own reflections on the topic). This is ofcourse apart from raising the amounts of loot you get (or the type of loot, including new items), but i think would greatly enhance how people would like to play.

 

Modifiable gamestage evolution throughout the game.

 

In short, it would be a setting for a specific map where you choose one of the many ways GS is calculated. Additionally, add a slider on how fast GS would increase - this would be independent (allowing tougher zombies, but GS rising differently) of game difficulty or on the other hand equal to it (so no slider).

1. Zombie kill counter based. - The more zombies you kills, the higher the GS. You don't kill Zs, you don't get higher GS. This should not be 1 zombie = 1 GS and definitely would require some tweaking.

2. Level based. - The higher your level, the bigger the GS. This is alongside how you advance with skills. At later stages you would need more skillpoints to advance some skills, meaning the GS would increase faster than your skills later on. Base values could be something like 1 level = 1 GS seems plausible, but you could get 1 level = 2 GS after level 50, 1 level = 3 GS after 100, etc. to get the game harder.

3. Time based. - The longer you play, the higher the GS. You could focus on power levelling to get the skills, knowing that sooner or later you'll get overwhelmed. Base values could be 1 day = 1 GS, but after each bloodmoon the increase would highten. So till day 7 you would have increase 1 per day, till 14th would be 2 per day, till 21th 3 per day, etc. This way you wouldn't have GS 20 on day 20, still with mostly the same enemies, but vastly greater skills.

4. Zombie kill counter + Level based. - Different than current mix, a more focus on killing and level raising. In tune for players wanting to leisurely play, not caring much about time passed or the zombies.

5. Time based + Level based. - Current option we have.

6. Zombie kill counter + Time based. - Aimed for those that want to power level not by killing zombies.

7. Time + Level + Zombie kill. - All types into one, meaning the GS will rise fast. Not for the faint of heart.

 

To some extent this would feel like such diverse games like Rimworld, where you can tweak and mod so many things, yet lets you play as you really want, changing the increase of the "difficulty" in so many different ways.

 

I like it!

[Jackelmyer]

This does not have to be the fix. You could leave the gamestage alone and give us rewards worth fighting for?

 

The way the game stage xml is setup, it's going to be hard not to change the game stage for a number of reasons. For people not fond of ferals at GS 50+, so like level 40 day 10, difficulty settings don't really help much. Game difficulty seems to much more notably impact game difficulty in mid to late game. When the multiplier has larger numbers to bite on. Early game, without the larger numbers of level and days alive, the variance between game difficulty seems to be marginal at best. Unless you shoot things up to insane. But the first three difficulty modes are like 1.1, 1.3, and 1.5 multiplyers. Then I think it goes to 2.0 and 2.5. The lower game stages could use a bigger difference than a .2 multiplier, but the gamestages.xml still should be tweaked.

 

Personally, I think the easiest mode shouldn't even hit ferals till GS 120+. Especially with a lvl 300 Max. Then scale the rest of the difficulties from there. And high end multipiers could probably use being pushed up. So the last two go from 2.0 and 2.5 multiplier to something like 2.2 and 2.7. especially should the Gamestage.xml get moved as I recommend for the lowest difficulty.

[RipClaw]

I suppose, for context purposes, there have been people wanting to see "boss zombies" added to the game to make horde night and POIs more "worth it". I may be taking things from other threads and including them into my thoughts here.

 

I don't think boss zombies are something for the horde night. The horde night is all about mass. I see boss zombies more as guards of the big loot boxes in POIs.

[Cirion]

I don't think boss zombies are something for the horde night. The horde night is all about mass. I see boss zombies more as guards of the big loot boxes in POIs.

 

or high end quests

[Jugginator]

I'm a HUGE Borderlands fan and used to speedrun Borderlands 2. Grinding the "bosses" for "legendary weapons" was a ton of fun, I just don't see how it would fit in this game. To grind the bosses for the drops required many MANY restarts just to get the item you wanted. Not sure that has a place in 7DTD, but sounds like it's coming.

 

Damnit Poppa, you talking all this Borderlands is making me want to do another Psycho run XD But yea, I can see legendary items/mods being in the end of the large POIs worth going through rad-armies for. Not worth doing it for 12 rounds of 7.62, some duct tape, random mid-quality guns and maybe some extra ammo.