Some A17 thoughts

[Nexian]

No, I complain about getting too much loot from zombies. It doesn't make sense to have everything thrown at you at day 7. And why do people need rewards so damn bad for horde nights? I mean, you do realize that's what the main part of the game right? SUrviving the blood moon hordes? So how about you enjoy killing the zombies and defending your base without dying, and have gratitude/satisfaction in seeing the morning sun pop up and pick off the remaining stragglers, repair the damage and prepare for the next horde night.

 

The game isn't 7 days to horde 900 chests of loot. Its 7 days to die unless you counter the blood moon with your badassness/cunning.

 

But every other aspect of the game gives rewards for doing things.

 

- Looting a house gives loot for the risk.

- Killing a zombies gives exp for the risk.

- Gathering gives resources and exp for the time put in.

- Building literally gives you your base.

- Crafting items gives you a new tool to use.

 

- Horde night, on the other hand requires you to do everything above and risk your base and your life and put in more active effort than any other night. For nothing.

 

And yes, I stay on horde night anyway for the illusion of it, but why NOT have a reward? Every other experience in this game has one, but we just skip the biggest experience when it comes to rewarding it?

[Jugginator]

But every other aspect of the game gives rewards for doing things.

 

- Looting a house gives loot for the risk.

- Killing a zombies gives exp for the risk.

- Gathering gives resources and exp for the time put in.

- Building literally gives you your base.

- Crafting items gives you a new tool to use.

 

- Horde night, on the other hand requires you to do everything above and risk your base and your life and put in more active effort than any other night. For nothing.

 

And yes, I stay on horde night anyway for the illusion of it, but why NOT have a reward? Every other experience in this game has one, but we just skip the biggest experience when it comes to rewarding it?

 

Because you get loot from literally everywhere else. In A16 and before, you could just stay in your damn base for the entire game aside from some resource gathering. The only hitch people have with no zombie loot is they're used to it from previous builds. The reward is SURVIVING. not everything has to be a physical item for it to be a reward.

 

Accomplishment of survival is a reward.

[AtomicUs5000]

As far as building goes, I just keep one structure for hordes either next to my base or I make a tunnel between that and my base. Underground base is not a problem at all... just don't expect to sit there forever and avoid the hordes. It is still best to have something else to take them out. Once I started doing this, it was a relief to stop worrying about them destroying what I actually cared about.

[Thorne]

Because you get loot from literally everywhere else. In A16 and before, you could just stay in your damn base for the entire game aside from some resource gathering. The only hitch people have with no zombie loot is they're used to it from previous builds. The reward is SURVIVING. not everything has to be a physical item for it to be a reward.

 

Accomplishment of survival is a reward.

I should damn well be able to stay in my base if I want to. Don't nerf the experience to the point where I can't be self-reliant just because you don't have the imagination to simply and realistically limit the loot being carried by zombies to what a person might have been carrying before they succumbed to the virus, leaving the appropriate/bigger stuff to be looted in town or in the bigger city. And leave the damn corpses around for a little while so that I can get from them what we all know is there--bones! Not gonna mention rotten meat here, because I believe all it's good for as of this release is food, and I don't think this game needs an element of cannibalism.

[Jugginator]

Well, THrone, you can play Rust as a pacifist, or Goldeneye roleplaying a non-violent priest, doom as a demon sympathizer, but it won't work and you can't demand the devs to change the game just because you want to do something that the game wasn't made for.

 

Okay so let's make zombies drop ripped up clothing, some watches, a wallet. Maybe an oddball pistol. Is that really loot? So you don't think the game needs cannibalism, but want rotten flesh from human-zombies?

 

*shakes head*

 

It's not imagination, it's being realistic in keeping the game a survival game that has a goal of surviving the zombie blood moon hordes. They are not loot-carrying presents every 7 damn days. That's the game. Not a game that adapts to you specific desires to sit in a base and do nothing but collect loot from zombies. ANd, somehow, eat rotten human flesh and not be a cannibal.

[Thorne]

Don't make it personal to try to distract from the fact that it was a bad suggestion. Not impressed. Don't be so concerned with how I like to play, unless you're looking for a quarrel that we're not supposed to have in these forums. Getting loot from zombies is a pretty obvious thing. Terrible idea to nerf it. Gameplay is king, but realism is important too. Not getting anything from fully dressed undead folks aside from the very odd bag is a step down in realism. So is pretending that zombies don't have bones. Bigger/better loot at POI's than you would realistically find on a zombie's person is absolutely enough motivation to get people out and looting. It was a short-sighted argument.

[The Gronk]

<snipped for space>

 

You CAN play any decent RPG as a pacifist, that should be a basic option in a role-playing game.

 

Given that humanity managed to survive for millennia without technology I really should be able to struggle along without having to visit a city. I should be able to find potatoes and corn growing wild every now and again.

 

Technology improves our chance of survival but it's not necessary for our survival. People managed to till land before the iron age.

[The Gronk]

<snipped for space>

 

A zombie should have the same thing in their pockets as they had as a human, unless zombies are kleptomaniacs. That would be a few pieces of metal from coins and keys, a few pieces of paper from cash, and maybe a gun (this IS set in America after all).

[Thorne]

I would argue that maybe some would be carrying a little more for having tried to survive the onset of the zombie apocalypse.

[OnlyMeiya]

Hate to say it but, with that many hours playing 7d2d, it makes sense you find so much boring. Hopefully once the game goes gold there will be enough new changes to keep your attention.

 

My gut tells me most with that many hours will be done with the game by then.

 

Actually No, I still loved the fk out of the game 16.4 the issue for me was stability issues where buildings would just keep randomly collapsing despite proper building supports, I mean a hole just collapses from bedrock, what the hell ?

 

I got bored 16.4 because most of the people I enjoyed playing with, stopped playing, rivals went to other games. I enjoy base building a lot so I kept busy but with the SI problems I couldn't as stuff kept collapsing.

 

I get so bored with the game now because they increased across the board the amount of tedious and needless amount of work needed to accomplish anything simple.

 

3 Headshots per zed is tedious, Zeds shouldn't be surviving multiple head shots from gun and bows, but quality no longer affects damage and just affects durability, which is pointless really, I literally see no point to craft or obtain highest quality/BIS gear if that's the case.

 

 

We change things that are crude placeholders. Stuff that was hacked in with the meager engine capabilities of 2015-16. We always wanted this sytem, people just got used to to crude placeholder even though it was horrible. Who are these "more intelligent players"? Don't like it? Mod it out. I hate vanilla Oblivion leveling and used a mod that was way better IMO. You don't have to like everything we do, but if you like 60% of it and play for more than 20 hours, I think we did a great job considering all the 60 dollar turds out there people play for 10 minutes then delete and forget about.

 

 

Dont like it, mod it out.

 

Another rhetoric I tire greatly of. Its almost funny at this point as its the most go-to answer I get, modding out of a terrible mechanic or system isn't a justifying answer to leaving it like crap. Sorry.

 

Even though your "cruder" system placeholder was more fun and enjoyable than this chaotic mess of a current direction you keep taking,Artificial/Superficial difficulty, coupled with "HAH!GOTCHA!" moments everywhere and you rob the player of every basic ability down to bag space and leave us with only being able to cook a boiled egg, meaning the way I play the game my first play-through will pretty much be how I play on subsequent play-throughs, It boils down to a META linear build which everyone is forced to pretty much take with minor tweaks or adjustments along the way save for some small decision turns.

 

At the end of the day I wanted a game that let you talk about what build or class you created, and have a skill an attribute and perk system that let you play how you wanted to play not how to grind stone axes and what other exploits are the best cheesy way to cheese your way to being OP.

 

You can still have that, you can always still have that but the way I have to play is a tedious grind that bores the ever living crap out of me. (Insane difficulty, 9 Arrows+ per headshot to kill a zed, thats not HARD thats TEDIOUS, and Boring. Please understand the difference, make your boss understand the difference, this tedious early content stretching is dissuading players from the game and making it mandatory to circumvent whatever possible out of sheer boredom.

 

 

Its not that we don't care about the customer. A few squeaky wheels might not like this or that, but overall its much more entertaining than ever in most players opinions. There isn't one compelling argument that is convincing that A16 skill system was better. People need to play a long term game of 200 hours before judging. Sorry its not end game in 15 hours like A15 was. So until some time has passed we can't change anything or really get a clear picture about what is better or worse.

 

And this is off topic anyway, I wanted to talk about why players can't build what they want to build. The single land claim issue is noted but not easily solved.

 

Squeaky..Wheels? You're referring to your veteran players like we're dull/lackluster??

I have played your game since 2012, that makes me a squeaky wheel? Cute.

 

New players don't know anything different, anything new and different is seen in a positive light to them.

 

There is a compelling argument, I keep screaming it at you, over, and over and over.

 

TEDIOUS, ARTIFICIAL, DIFFICULTY. "WASTES MY TIME." I'm doing the same repetitive tasks over and over.

 

 

Who are these "more intelligent players"?

 

Your players who've played for a long enough time that understand the game on a much greater level, your players who think outside of the box.Players that have experienced all your game modes, all difficulties, Single/Multi/PVP/PVE and experienced other survival games similar.

 

Whats hidden to most players isn't hidden to them.

 

The way you ask makes it seem like intelligent players can't exist or something.

 

And this is off topic anyway, I wanted to talk about why players can't build what they want to build. The single land claim issue is noted but not easily solved.

 

Yep, that's a huge issue, only having one claim block. The main reason I don't even want to play multiplayer because I can't build a properly large/defended base because I'm limited to only one freaking land claim.

Being confined to a smaller building area is a HUUUUUUGE disadvantage, because you need more space to hide your loot, if they only have one small room to work with and a couple other doors, you'll log into being cleaned out every day after work almost.

 

Us veteran players that do lots of raiding/pvp are very crafty and determined players, you pretty much have to make raiding your base still livable and workable, but strong enough to stop raiders from getting to far.

 

Your base has to be strong enough to by rule of thumb, strong enough to withstand 4 players augering for 10 hours, if your base can sustain that without being cleared out, your base is along the lines of "Better"

 

If you kill all 4 players and they cannot get their bags back, then your base is legendary.

 

Small bases also tend to get collapsed, more space = better if you can produce enough resources to maintain and upgrade it.

 

Since you love to build large castles (Btw that castle screen you shared was MAJESTIC I would love to explore that! )

 

If anything I would revert that to how it was in 16.4.

Actually its very easy.

 

Keep Land claims from 16.4 how they were and create another block that does just what you want which we can only have one of, remove the zombie anti-spawn from older land claim ect. Its really not hard if you think about it and I don't mind using two different blocks if I only have to use one of them once.

 

 

There is a bug in multiplayer that lets you see everyone else's claims.

Bad, Bad bad bad bad bad!

 

 

 

 

For single player Its not a big issue how I build as long as zed stay out of it, so resources I would grind repetitively for multiplayer was enjoyable because I was doing it to keep other players out, I don't have to do that in single player I build differently.

[The Gronk]

I would argue that maybe some would be carrying a little more for having tried to survive the onset of the zombie apocalypse.

 

What would be in your pockets during the zombie apocalyplse?

[Jugginator]

Thorne its not being personal. And it's not about bashing you for how you want to play, it's the fact youre saying the game is wrong for not tailoring itsself to how you want to play it. The game is meant how the people who made it want it to be. They want it to be a hard, challenging survival game mixed with awesome pois to explore with challenging tower defense, you cant have what you want mixed with what they want; that's why he said mod it in if you want it differently. They don't want you to stay in your base forever. They don't want the game to be like that. There's plenty of role playing aspects. How about you roleplay like that by looting POIs until you have a stash and then stayh in your base for a few weeks. There are plenty of other ways. And really, mentioning realism is crazy. The game is zero percent realistic, there's nothing real about it. Not even having loot on bodies is realistic, unless you mean wallets, maybe a watch, some car keys, a cell phone. Sometims a pocket knife. I highly doubt guns, since they are zombies now. They would have dropped their guns a while back, and if the gun fell out the holster the zombie wouldn't pick it up and carry it. unless, you didn't mean reallstic by saying realistic.

 

Yes it's an RPG. but RPG doesn't mean "a personally tailored game to the individual playing the game with AI that hard-codes the game to your specific likings". That's what modding is for.

 

There is a compelling argument, I keep screaming it at you, over, and over and over.

 

TEDIOUS, ARTIFICIAL, DIFFICULTY. "WASTES MY TIME." I'm doing the same repetitive tasks over and over.

 

Really? "WAAAH I FIND IT TEDIOUS SO THAT"S A COMPELLING ARGUMENT TO GET RID OF IT AND CHANGE IT TO WHAT 75-85% OF THE PLAYERBASE FOUND BORING WAAHHH!", that's your compelling argument? -.-

 

Repetitive? "Well ♥♥♥♥ I gotta level up my crafting tools... better craft 50,000 stone axes... ah hell gotta level up weapon crafting... better craft 50,000 wood bows... ♥♥♥♥ gotta level up mining before I can actually effectively mine... better whack nodes with an axe for several hours before I can mine effectivly... ah hell I suck with guns, better shoot my gun half a million times... I suck at looting, I better loot 200,000 times so I start getting better loot... I suck at building.... I suck at melee... I suck at science....I suck at blade skills..." That's rather reptitive to me.

 

Is is balanced perfectly? No, but it's by far better lol

[Thorne]

What would be in your pockets during the zombie apocalypse?

Definitely money, leather wallet, knife or multitool (steel?), watch, wouldn't be caught undead without my comb, snack, gun(s), ammo, glasses, cigar, a flashlight, the odd pipe bomb, and the clothes themselves of course (or at least cloth from the parts that aren't destroyed). If I were clever, I might have accessorized a pry bar for looting, so that's steel, maybe a hammer (I looted a hardware store when sh** went south, and I'm wearing a tool belt). Wearing a water bladder on my back, maybe some instant coffee in a pocked. Grabbed some seed packets while in the hardware store... Bear in mind I ditched the skinny jeans, which the zombies are drawn to because of the promise of an easy, if low protein meal, and looted some cargo pants and a jacket with a bunch of pockets.

[The Gronk]

money = a few small sheets of paper

leather wallet = not enough leather to do anything useful with

knife or multitool (steel?), pry bar, hammer = zombies will drop tools

watch = we already have a hud clock

comb = tiny amount of plastic, re; wallet

snack = I'm not eating anything I find on walking corpse

gun(s), ammo = zombies will drop guns unless holstered

glasses = tiny amount of glass and metal, likely to fall off a zombies face while walking

cigar = will fall out of zombies mouth

a flashlight = fair enough although easily dropped

the odd pipe bomb = fair enough although easily dropped

water bladder = I'm not drinking anything I find on walking corpse

instant coffee = I'm not drinking anything I find on walking corpse

clothes = I'm not wearing clothes that smell like dead guy and I'm not making bandages with cloth covered in corpse juice.

 

 

So, assuming you've had sufficient time to prepare, out of all of that stuff your value as a walking loot chest amounts to a handful of scraps and maybe a tool or gun.

[tharbedragons]

Totally this. For every "majority of" I have an even bigger "majority of". Majority of people you agree with lol. There is very little facts other than gut feelings and we feel we've knocked it out of the park with A17, once the performance and balance are there its a big win.

 

This +1....6K + hours since alpha 5 .... and this quote from MM is the 'majority' I am in...outa tha park! Any minor tweaks I can always go find a Mod that will change it to my inclination for that play-through...harder...loot gluttony...etc.

[Blackgryphon]

 

At the end of the day I wanted a game that let you talk about what build or class you created, and have a skill an attribute and perk system that let you play how you wanted to play not how to grind stone axes and what other exploits are the best cheesy way to cheese your way to being OP.

 

 

First, let me say that now that RWG is looking and functioning WAY better, I am starting to really enjoy A17. But.. If you really want people to truly have different builds/classes the skill system will really have to be expanded upon. I would say each branch would have to be at least doubled in size and options. The way it's laid out is great for having different builds, it's just in depth enough for that really. Of course, that's easy enough to do in the future when time permits, etc. though. Just don't go overboard like some games and make it so huge that it's confusing. lol

[Kalarro]

 

Please enlighten me as to how base building is a problem?

 

The main problem is they dont surround you anymore.

 

- It is cool to be surrounded by zombies pummelling your walls, instead of by a conga.

- It makes 95% of your base feel useless. If I build a perimeter with good mats, upgrade it, surround it with traps... but they only congaline to 1 point, it feels like a lot of wasted work

 

Another problem is that it's so easy to do a path exploiting base that working on a big strong perimeter base like we did before again looks like wasted effort

[hotpoon]

Its not that we don't care about the customer. A few squeaky wheels might not like this or that, but overall its much more entertaining than ever in most players opinions. There isn't one compelling argument that is convincing that A16 skill system was better. People need to play a long term game of 200 hours before judging. Sorry its not end game in 15 hours like A15 was. So until some time has passed we can't change anything or really get a clear picture about what is better or worse.

I think the poll you guys posted proves that 'most players opinions' are different to yours. Why post a poll if you already know you have no plans on acting on what the majority of people want? Why not just come right out and say "I'm making what I want to play. If you don't like it, tough ♥♥♥♥". At least that would be honest.

[Noctoras]

I think the poll you guys posted proves that 'most players opinions' are different to yours. Why post a poll if you already know you have no plans on acting on what the majority of people want? Why not just come right out and say "I'm making what I want to play. If you don't like it, tough ♥♥♥♥". At least that would be honest.

 

In this case I disagree

 

- For once, the forum has a far above average share of hardcore players, thus not representing the player base.

 

- We bought into an early access and the dev team has the right to go for their vision. Noone is obliged to buy into any early access game. That said, players like us, having probably 100s of hours in this game each,have got their money's worth, even though we might not like the current itineration.

 

Thus, I am no fan of the direction this game has taken with A17, but I respect the devs have taken the decision to go down that route. I have got my money's worth anyway and I think this applies to most of us posting here, whether we like A17 or not.

[hotpoon]

...I have got my money's worth anyway and I think this applies to most of us posting here, whether we like A17 or not.

 

This is true. I love this game though, and want to see it succeed.

[Aldranon]

What would be in your pockets during the zombie apocalyplse?

 

I carry my Zombie Apocalypse Beacon at all times, of course. The ZAB summons my fully equipped Hindenburg Sized Zeppelin.

 

Also, training the Swedish Bikini Team to fly the thing and in Special OPS, was not easy, let me tell you!

[OnlyMeiya]

 

 

 

Really? "WAAAH I FIND IT TEDIOUS SO THAT"S A COMPELLING ARGUMENT TO GET RID OF IT AND CHANGE IT TO WHAT 75-85% OF THE PLAYERBASE FOUND BORING WAAHHH!", that's your compelling argument? -.-

 

Repetitive? "Well ♥♥♥♥ I gotta level up my crafting tools... better craft 50,000 stone axes... ah hell gotta level up weapon crafting... better craft 50,000 wood bows... ♥♥♥♥ gotta level up mining before I can actually effectively mine... better whack nodes with an axe for several hours before I can mine effectivly... ah hell I suck with guns, better shoot my gun half a million times... I suck at looting, I better loot 200,000 times so I start getting better loot... I suck at building.... I suck at melee... I suck at science....I suck at blade skills..." That's rather reptitive to me.

 

Is is balanced perfectly? No, but it's by far better lol

 

Now you're just responding like a complete troll.

 

Yes its a compelling argument that no mater what crafted quality bow I craft or axe, or steel pick, its always the same damage, but the durability is higher.

 

I don't think you understand how stale things get when progression gets halted on the same tasks with the same speed, especially something like killing zeds, farming more rocks/wood/feathers to make arrows to kill more.

 

That wastes my time.

 

We don't have to craft 50000 stone axes anymore that was removed from A15 to A16 and it was a great addition, however learning by doing in combination was a great addition.

 

Sucking at melee? Doing more, getting better? That makes sense though. Same with blade skills, or science, or building. ect. Some of it made sense while some of it didn't.

 

So you're telling me its better that I instantly gain the knowledge to cook by slamming arrows into 30 zombies heads?

 

Previously if you started to increase your archery skill by using archery, you got better at it, and did more damage! That made sense, if you crafted better bows you would assume they have better tensile string strength and which would lead to more damage.

 

Now? I put 3-9 arrows into a zeds head and they walk around like Pin head from Hell Raiser. Thats tedious, we need a milestone where we are able to start fluently reduce how much ammo is consumed if we have the personal skills and mechanics to effectively take advantage of it.

 

This game has lost so much continuity. Quit trolling.

 

I never said to change anything back to the horsecrap it previously was, only a few things were better, Stop assuming, it will make you look less stupid.

[Ghostlight]

The main problem is they dont surround you anymore.

 

- It is cool to be surrounded by zombies pummelling your walls, instead of by a conga.

- It makes 95% of your base feel useless. If I build a perimeter with good mats, upgrade it, surround it with traps... but they only congaline to 1 point, it feels like a lot of wasted work

 

Another problem is that it's so easy to do a path exploiting base that working on a big strong perimeter base like we did before again looks like wasted effort

 

This x 100.

 

It is astonishing and heart-breaking to me that MM had to ask this and didn't know.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

I think the poll you guys posted proves that 'most players opinions' are different to yours. Why post a poll if you already know you have no plans on acting on what the majority of people want?

 

7 Days is the new Brexit.

[OnlyMeiya]

I think the poll you guys posted proves that 'most players opinions' are different to yours. Why post a poll if you already know you have no plans on acting on what the majority of people want?

 

Forums community consists of mostly your PVE/singleplayer casual players and some hardcore ones.

 

A lot of your players had an opinion about the game, you know what it was? Play something else. You don't get their opinions and they aren't on your forums.

[madmole]

As far as building goes, I just keep one structure for hordes either next to my base or I make a tunnel between that and my base. Underground base is not a problem at all... just don't expect to sit there forever and avoid the hordes. It is still best to have something else to take them out. Once I started doing this, it was a relief to stop worrying about them destroying what I actually cared about.

 

I've played that way since alpha 1 so I didn't have any huge problem. I use towers with iron walkways to the other towers with a sea of spikes down below and my main base will be connected to it with pillars and more iron walkways, like a suspension bridge. The first 7 days I'll only have one tower but I add another each horde night and move my stuff to more secure locations as time goes on and leave that first tower as my forge area.