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Everything posted by Dernagon

  1. TLDR see my last sentence. My main point got pushed to the side a bit there or was misunderstood. For $500 (roughly) I will be able to buy a brand new PS5 or Xbox Scarlett next year. A console that (short of a hardware failure) should last the next 5-10 years without ever touching anything again or spending any additional money for upgrades. Even if you could technically build a PC today for the same price (conveniently ignoring the cost of Windows and peripherals btw) it would barely run modern games decently. You'd easily spend that much again within 1-2 years just to keep upgrading it. During the life of the average modern console you would likely spend that $500 another 2, 3, 4 more times? For someone like me who is busy with very regular work travel I just want to come home and play a game. Not fuss with constant patches and upgrades. Spent most of the 80s, 90s, and early 2000s building gaming PCs and I switched to consoles for that reason. Hell for me the Nintendo Switch would be ideal except it doesn't really cater to my gaming genre preferences very much if at all. And no a laptop isn't particularly practical either. At least not a good enough one to actually game on for any reasonable price. Anyway, I'm not arguing that PC isn't superior in most technological ways, it absolutely is. I'm arguing that... well that point doesn't really matter. For me what little free time and or money I might have is better spent maximizing as much gaming as possible. Basically the typical PC argument is spend 3-4 times the price for higher quality graphics for some lesser amount of hours on actual gaming. I would simply rather spend less money and fuss time to play the same games (more or less) at admittedly lower graphics. Will I miss out on some amazing PC games? Yep most certainly. Do I care? Nope. Bottomline. The few hours when I'm not working, cooking, cleaning, or taking care of kids sure as hell isn't going to be spent on paying extra for the privilege of performing some mundane and never ending PC maintenance rather than in a game having fun.
  2. Pretty insulting and unprofessional comment from a moderator. Most off the shelf PCs that can run A18 even remotely decently are not going to cost $500. Perhaps if someone builds it themselves maybe they could pull it off. Not everyone is down for that. Console players also like their cold adult beverages. Doesn't mean they should have to build a refrigerator just so that they can enjoy a beer. Most console gamers like just having a machine they can turn on for 5-10 years and never have to mess with anything. Just look at the jump in spec requirements between A17 and A18. A cheap machine at $500 (still more expensive than current Gen8 consoles btw) could very easily require additional upgrades post-patch. Informed or not I personally prefer console gaming over PC because it is less fuss. My time is limited. My time is money. I don't get pleasure out of building PCs anymore. For the record I'm well informed, well educated, financially capable, and technologically savvy. I know this isn't a new argument to anyone here, but someone in a position of authority and addressing customers should know better. Bad form friend.
  3. To me this wording is very specific. Based on some of the rumors and speculation, I think that statement supports the theory that TFP did not succesfully purchase the console code during the auction. It's very possible that these new owners still retain the rights to the 7D2D console code, but can't do anything with it because TFP yanked back the "rights to sell, distribute, or support 7 Days to Die" after the TTG collapse. Which I'm sure was done on TFP's part due to some breach of contract clause and probably because TTG was broke and stop paying royalties owed to TFP. If all of that is more or less true then it really is a legal mess now. Especially if TFP has lost interest and/or faith in continued console support going forward. Or the new TTG as stated isn't interested in anything but story driven adventure type games. Although that would be odd since 7D2D was actually one of old TTG's better performers in sales. Very few titles actually made money for them; Walking Dead Season 1, Minecraft Story Mode, and 7 Days to Die were about all from what I understood. Either way. 7 Days to Die is definitely dead on consoles. At least for this generation. Maybe in a few years we might see a new release launch on PS5 and Xbox Scarlet. I mean does anyone seriously expect any new updates, patches, or content before Fall of 2020? In one year the new Gen hits, no one is going to start a new development project this late for the current Gen. And yes resurrecting even an existing game like 7D2D would probably be just as much work as starting a new game would be. Except with a much lower chance for a return on investment. Most people who were going to buy the game already did. What about paid DLC? That would help financially speaking a little bit but not much. Even in a very active game the player retention after 12 months is very low and this game is more than few years old. Furthermore the DLC purchase rate even among current players for any game is low. So fractions upon fractions of total lifetime buying players MIGHT buy a DLC. So it just isn't happening guys. 7D2D console is done. Link to the Telltale FAQ with the 7D2D statement: https://www.telltale.com/player-support/
  4. Not sure why I was quoted for most of your reply. I only agreed with Skillz that in all four examples proposed by Sylen that it is still better than complete silence. Perhaps I didn't clarify which part of his post I agreed with specifically enough. My bad. I hope I've cleared that up. Regardless. Yes a game is usually sold as is and TTG was the publisher. Understood. That doesn't mean that buggy bad releases don't get updates or even massive overhauls post release. No Man's Sky, Sea of Thieves, and currently Fallout 76 all have or are working on improving the games (not condoning or endorsing any of those games just simply using them as examples). Do they have to? No they could take the money and run. But it is usually better PR to try to fix things. I would say that they are not legally obligated, but that wouldn't be entirely true either. Depending on the circumstances consumers can and have pursued legal action. Anyway, none of that necessarily applies to TFP's situation. Except the fact that their name is attached to the product and well TTG left them holding the bag. It sucks for TFP, but I'm sure they care about their name so they do want to try their best to fix things. Whether they can or do or don't update the console. Lots of perfectly good reasons for however things play out, good or bad. I've never made a comment one way or another on the PC version status. Not sure why we are talking about half truths or what definition we are using for that term. The only statements from TFP that I said would be examples of good news updates to share with us (for example) are: Sherwood Partners is handling the TTG asset liquidation. (Fact. Full truth.) The auction will be on April XX date. (Fact. Full truth.) The auction has been completed on XX date. (Fact. Full truth.) The 7D2D console rights have been purchased by a buyer choosing to remain anonymous. (Fact. Full truth.) So no, I personally am not asking for half truths nor would I be pleased to receive them. All I've said is the complete silence is less than desirable. Just a little communication, even just basic simple fact sharing statements, would have appeased most of the (more rational) console fans over the last 6 months.
  5. In response to "TFP never promised a console update" (paraphrasing again) Seems to me that they actually did promise or at the least heavily implied: The Fun Pimps "In the weeks following, we've been working in good faith with the remaining management at Telltale to regain control over the console versions and allow us to provide support and updates on those platforms. So far, these efforts have failed." That is from the first post of the Telltale Update thread in the News section. Not sure how you guys are reading that statement differently. Sure we could break it down into semantics. Technically they didn't say that they ARE going to provide an update. Only that they want the ability back to provide one. That still implies some level of intention to continue support and updates. Otherwise why include any statement that references support and updates at all? Could've just said we want our console publishing rights back. Period. End of statement. There are pages and pages of people happy to hear that TFP has (at a minimum) the desire to TRY to support and update the console version in the future. So either TFP misspoke at the time or they actualy do/did have the best intentions of updating the console versions. I personally get the difference. That is why I don't ask "where is the update?" My questions still revolve around "who has the console publishing rights now?" After that is figured out, then I might ask the appropriate owner, "so do you intend to update the current console releases?" If they say yes, then after a reasonable amount of time, I will start asking, "where is the update?" P.S. sorry for the lack of direct quotes and formatting. Using my phone for this post.
  6. I will break this down one more time and condense my opinions for the sake of brevity. If you want more, my previous posts expand on most of these. Communication All I've asked for is a little more communication from the TFP team. Something as simple as sharing public knowledge when its available. In the past this could've been Sherwood Partners role, auction date, auction completed, anonymous buyer, etc. Not looking for any further promises or predictions or hopes for the future from TFP necessarily. Even a bare minimum of the facts from TFP would have gone a long way toward continued goodwill. Transparency I'm not looking for full transparency. I don't need TFP to disclose their entire business plan. They don't need to drop their drawers and show me their dirty underwear. There are a lot of sound business reasons not to tell us all of their plans. The console future could have a lot of moving parts. I get that. I point this out to make the distinction between "some" communication and full "transparent" communication. A lot of people seem to think when we ask for a little news that we need to know everything. Communucation doesn't have to be an all or nothing proposition. Anonymous Buyer As I said in the previous thread, this is a big red flag to me because there are only two possibilities. One the buyer was not TFP and they are either in negotiations with them or TFP doesn't know themselves who it is. Two the buyer was TFP and they've chosen to remain anonymous while they figure things out. Best case scenario is that they are shopping for a new publisher and can't talk further for legal reasons. Worst case scenario they will not continue console updates and just wanted their rights back and to collect residual sales. The reasons for not continuing support could be economics (totally understandable), lack of interest (its your IP I can understand that too), or fear of another fiasco like TTG. On that last one I can also totally understand. The TTG situation was/has probably been a nightmare and TFP simply doesn't want to go through the risk of another publisher soup sandwich. So its easier to just focus on the PC and maybe one day in the future re-enter the console market (or not). Red Flag Why do I say its a red flag that the buyer is anonymous? Well my personal opinion and gut feeling is that the buyer was TFP. Running all of the scenarios in my head that makes the most sense especially since they've been silent on the topic. Draw your own conclusions.
  7. I agree with Skillz. All four examples would be better and for all the reasons I've already stated multiple times. I also really hope that "uneducated console players" was just poor wording and what you meant to say was "the less informed console players". As in you are referencing the players who don't keep up with the latest news as frequently.
  8. Yes that was basically my point. Would've been better to not say anything at all and certainly not to make promises for continued console support. Unless they really intend to. Which they very well may have the best intentions to fulfill that promise. The lack of information since then, after getting people hyped that the platform just might not die, is why you see people angry. As I showed in my previous examples there is a lot of information that could've been shared. Shared without any commitments one way or the other toward the future. People would likely still ask questions that can't be answered easily. Perhaps legal ones. Perhaps TFP is still deciding whether console support is economically feasible to continue investing in. Perhaps they are in negotiations. All things I pointed out in the previous thread in defense of TFP. All things that they don't necessarily need to disclose. I'm a realist and can respect those type of decisions. It won't break my heart if the game remains as is. That's life. Speaking just for myself. Others might take the news far worse. As I said I'm fairly neutral on the issue. My comments collectively have displayed both sides of the argument.
  9. The mods actually do have my utmost respect. Dealing with difficult people every day would wear on anyone. Deserves even more respect when it is a voluntary unpaid burden. I agree that the customer is not always right. Bad customers might even deserve getting treated poorly. It depends on the circumstances. In this particular case I believe that the frustrated customers are actually in the right. Had TTG closed and it was left at that, there would be no issues with TFP. They chose to come out and make a statement that they were seeking to get the console publishing rights back. Well the auction is over. Did you get them TFP or not? Is a very fair question. Secondly they stated that they had every intention of continuing support for the console version. So now we the customers actually have a very legitimate interest in how things shake out. They can't get our hopes up and then ghost us. This is actually made worse because most of us had already given up on seeing any update at all. Even before TTG shutdown it was clear that chances were all but none. Then TFP comes riding in on their white horse and says "we got you. If it is at all in our power we can, nay, we will save the day!" Paraphrasing of course, but you get the point. Since that glorious day and the second coming of TFP... Radio silence. I think it is quite fair to lob some criticism where it is due. And unless a poster on here is truly getting out of hand I would argue that they are entitled to even a little level of outrage. My biggest fear with the moderators is that I can see their frustration. Their comments and replies are showing less restraint. I emphasize with them. Sure no one has been getting banned or anything yet, but its not a big leap to take that next step. For my part I do apologize to Roland for my comment last night. Upon reflection and rereading I don't feel he deserved that. Still think he could've left out that last sentence... but regardless I was inappropriate.
  10. No Roland I don't see your point. Why don't you spell your case out for us pleb console gamer "fanboi"s who have to just "get over it" as Sylen so eloquently put it. It doesn't matter if the lemon car I bought is a Maserati (aka PC) or a Ford Fiesta (aka consoles). Customer rights laws exist for a reason. Since you seem to implicate occasionally that you have inside knowledge on the inner circle of TFP, why don't you go ahead and give them a courtesy heads up that their behavior could be actionable. Should someone with the means and desire pursue that course. Pretty sure the smug responses would evaporate quite rapidly and everyone liable would wish pretty quickly that they had handled this situation differently. TFP is a small developer and it would not take much effort to drastically alter their future. As I said previously, I love 7D2D and TFP, but that doesn't mean our good will is infinite. Toss us a bone every now and then and more importantly show a little respect.
  11. I'm not a regular poster and despite lurking the forums for years I only recently joined in the discussion as I do have interest in the future of 7D2D console. I believe to date my posts have been fairly neutral and I've tried to be reasonable in my comments. However, I'm going to step in and defend the vocally frustrated. They are not turds and trolls. These guys have spent months or possibly years posting their questions, hopes, predictions, theories, and yes frustration. I can empathize with their position. They are clearly mega fans of the game and only want to see it improve and be the best that it can be or at the very least become a more stable experience (particularly Xbox owners). For the majority of the last six months they have generally defended TFP. It was not TFP's fault that TTG collapsed and put the future of 7D2D console was put in doubt. Most of us get that. However, it is very reasonable at this point to critize the way that TFP has handled their cone of silence approach. Do I need to be told weekly, "sorry no news" no I don't. However, they could've been at the forefront of some of the developments. Why did the fan base have to chase down information on their own? Such as Sherwood Partners is handling the asset liquidation, or that the auction would be in April, or that the auction has been completed, or that 7D2D console publishing rights and IG code was purchased, or that the buyer chose to be anonymous, etc. Those are details that TFP should've been the ones to release. There is no legal risk as it is public knowledge. They don't have to back up those statements of fact with any sort of promises or commitments. It's simply keeping the consumer aware of the situation. That is the type of "no news" that would at least convey to us the super fans, who are stilling playing the game, and taking time out of our day to care enough to continually visit these forums because we love what TFP has created. We are not trolls and turds. Close the News thread? Fine I get the reason. Should've happen months ago. Although in all fairness it really wouldn't have spun out of control if there was more official news transparency. So that culpability is as equally shared between the TFP team's approach as it is with the vocal dissenters. Lastly, Roland And Sylen are just about our only official conduit to TFP in this pocket of silence. I immensely appreciate their patience in dealing with a difficult sutuation. Having said that I would be remiss in not noting that some of the responses to the fanbase can come off as sarcastic at least lately. You guys do a great job but I caution keeping it above board and professional. We are just looking for news to a game we love. Again calling people trolls and turds because they ask questions isn't appropriate. Some of you might be content to sit and around and wait for an announcement that may never come. You do you. For myself I'm going to be more vocal, tactfully vocal than some I hope, but I'm going to ask TFP for a bone every now and then. I bought their product so yes they actually do owe me that much if they want to retain a repeat customer. That is Marketing 101. I work in Business Development and I guarantee that if I ignored my customer emails and phone calls, I would lose that business very very quickly. I owe my customers the courtesy of addressing them when queried. No different than TFP owing me, a buying customer, the same level of respect. That's all. My two cents. Thank you.
  12. We do that whenever the game host crashes. The connected players all start eating glass or jumping into spike pits until it finally boots everyone.
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