iamnuff
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Posts posted by iamnuff
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On 6/26/2023 at 11:02 PM, meganoth said:
Still you can get enough to start a farm, and then it is your decision at what size to stop
That's not really how it works.
You can only plant as many crops as you have seeds for. Sure, you can convert all of your crop into seeds and plant them all but if you need to do that for 4-5 full crop plantings, then your doing four or five full plant-and-grow rotations with zero actual food-gain, which is kinda @%$#ty.
On 6/26/2023 at 11:02 PM, meganoth said:After finding out its only 2 potatos you could have edited your conclusion as well: "That's great, 7.5 stews!"
7 stews from 40 harvest potatoes (because you needed to waste most of your potatos making seeds to replant your crops) is still way too low.
On 6/26/2023 at 11:02 PM, meganoth said:You should always afford to turn enough seeds into crops, otherwise your farm shrinks. And then the next harvest will be even smaller. Would that make long-term sense?
No, my point is that if you're planting enough potatoes thne even after convertring half of your crop back into seeds to replant them, you'll still have enough to at least make a decent amount of food.
But planting 20 potatoes (double my previous theoretical) with LOTL 1 would get you 80 crops and probably 10 seeds.
So you'd need to make ten more, which means using up 50 potatos.
So you're still left with a pittance. Enough to feed your group until the new crops are grown, I guess, but only a small fraction of your actual harvest.
It's not until you're getting 6-7 plants per harvest that you actually start making a decent returns for your seeds.
Hell, at LOTL:1, you any farm-plot that doesn't give you a seed back is a net-loss of one potato. (you get 4 on harvest and it costs 5 to make a seed)
TLDR: Living Of The Land level 1 isn't really worth it. Don't even bother making farm-plots until you've completely maxed the skill out.
Fortunately there's not a lot of levels in it so it's not a huge investment, but you still need to buy quite deep into the Fortitude tree.
Fortunately machineguns are really good, so it's a worthwhile investment anyway.
Punching is pretty good too, but I wish we had a second melee weapon like STR has with the clubs/sledgehammers option. I have no idea what another fortitude-based melee weapon would be. Shield?
On 6/26/2023 at 11:02 PM, meganoth said:Bacon and Eggs is one of the most inefficient foods in the game IMHO, because it uses 2 very expensive eggs for a rather low-level food. I may cook that in the first few days because of necessity, but each egg is much better used in blueberry pies. And blueberry pie is, if you can save up the eggs for it, a very good food without potatoes.
It is, but blueberries are also rare, and its a higher tier recipe.
By the time you can make it, you won't be needing/making bacon and eggs anymore.
It's basically the best 'Early Game' food, whereas you move onto stews and various other meals as quickly as you are able, which frees up your eggs for puddings.
Grilled meat is one of the easiest foods to make with meat being so easy to get, but it's fullness value is so low that it's pretty inefficient to carry around because you need to eat half a stack to fill yourself back up once you get hungry.
Boiled at least also gives water, but now that water is harder to get, even that feels like a waste.
On 6/26/2023 at 11:02 PM, meganoth said:Seeds are totally useless except for planting and plants have the chance to be used in a recipe. So even thrown out of context that sentence is objectively true.
Seeds might be worthless for anything else, but farm-plots are not. Given the resource cost (and attention-cost) of building/maintaining a farm, you want to ensure that you're growing something that's actually useful to you.
On 6/26/2023 at 11:02 PM, meganoth said:Mmh, I am not convinced either, I thought it was 6.
It seems to be six with a chance of seven, now.
On 6/26/2023 at 11:02 PM, meganoth said:Not sure what you are saying. If I have a handful of plots with some specific plant and want to enlarge that I convert everything I have to seeds. in the meantime hungry guys at my door have to eat grilled meat or pumpkin bread or dine at the trader.
My point is that growing a bunch of crops and then turning them into seeds which you plant and grow crops which you turn into seeds which you plant and grow crops which you turn into seeds leaves you planting and growing crops but getting no actual food out of it for a full in-game week.
So instead I was putting the potatoes that I harvested into the food chest and having my buddy actually make decent food out of them.
Because that's the entire reason I'd been planting crops in the first place.
Sure, I could have built up a huge farm while eating grilled meat all the time, but we didn't want to eat bad food. That's the whole reason I built the farm to begin with.
On 6/27/2023 at 2:30 AM, BFT2020 said:Pumpkin seeds and blueberry seeds are indeed valuable. Blueberries are obvious used in pies which give you 45 food. Pumpkins are used in pies and cheesecake which gives you 50/42 food back. And that worthless cornbread you mentioned, with meat and a can of chili, you now got a chili dog that gives you back 53 food. All which are similar to that meat stew you ate that gives you back 50 food. Don't get me started on Gumbo stew, Tuna Fish gravy toast, and spaghetti - none of which require potatoes and all are vastly superior to meat stew (Shepherds pie is also in this group, but requires 1 potato ----- 1 potato!!!!!!)
Pumpkin seeds are worthless because pumpkins are not the bottleneck on your pumpkin pie production. Eggs probably are. (and beer, but that's my fault for selling it all)
As for cornbread, I was talking about in terms of food that you cook for yourself.
There's no way to make tins of chilli, you can only find them.
I mean, with the much more common vending machines you can now probably get a decent stockpile if you want, but again, Cornbread isn't the important part of that recipe. You can slap together some cornbread whenever you happen to find a tin of chilli, but that's not a reason to cultivate corn or cook up a stockpile of cornbread in-and-of-itself.
As a meal on it's own, cornbread is worthless, and there's nothing you can combine it with that you can grown in a farm-plot or cook at a campfire, to make anything better.
On 6/27/2023 at 2:30 AM, BFT2020 said:And guess what, that chili dog cost you less ingredients in terms of crops as you only need 1 corn while the meat stew costs 2 corn and 2 potatoes.
Actually the chilli-dog cost you a tin of chilli, which provides more food and costs more dukes than anything that goes into a meat stew.
At the very least, it's harder to procure a steady supply of.
I guess part of the issue is that if i'm making food to take with me when I go exploring, I want a full stack of it so I won't run out.
Having one 'fish and gravy' item doesn't help me, even if it gives a lot of food. I want a stack of ten, but I have no reliable way to get ten cans of whatever food I need to make this food with.
With a big enough farmplot and enough ranks in LoTL, I can gather the materials to cook up ten meat stews for myself, and even ten more for my buddy to carry.
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On 6/24/2023 at 5:34 PM, meganoth said:
NOT AGAIN! This is wrong and I had hoped these false rumors were gone after more than a year
Lotl1 is perfectly enough to have a self-sustaining farm and making seeds out of plants will generally grow your farm. The only drawback is that with a string of VERY bad harvests you could be left without seeds eventually. But for that you have to also be so unlucky to never find any seeds in loot.
Only without a single point in Lotl it makes no sense to convert plants to seeds. Just put any seeds you find into your plots and grow them.
But if you have Lotl1 or more, you can just convert any plants you have into seeds and on average expect to get more out of the seed later. And mathematically it makes sense to start planting as soon as you have plants, there is nothing gained by waiting except if you plan to put more points into the perk later.
If people keep bringing this up, then maybe you need to re-examine it.
I set up a farm in my recent game in the experimental (about 10 farm-plots) and I had plenty of seeds to plant... but few useful ones.
Pumpkin seeds and goldenrod seeds are common loot in trash, but there's little point planting them. Corn-seeds can be gathered on-mass from bags in farm POIs, but then actual corn can also be gathered on-mass from farm POIs, so there's little need to plant them.
Potato seeds seem fairly rare, which is a problem because that's the most important crop in the game.
Lets say you have a 10-block farm. You somehow manage to plant every farm-plot with potatos.
With the first perk in LoTL, you get 40 potatoes and probably 5 seeds back.
This lets you spend 25 potatos (assuming you even have the seed-crafting level to make potato seeds) to craft the other 5 and replant your full row of crops.
This leaves you with 15 potatos to cook with.
That's, what, three stews? (Edit: apparantly stew is 2 potatos, not 5? According to the wiki anyway. I'm not my group's cook, so I dunno what it is in A21.)
Once you have a large farm and your income-per-harvest is much higher so you can afford to turn 25 crops back into seeds to replant, it's not such a bad deal. But when you only have ten farm plots, it's kinda ass.
I think part of the issue is recipe bottleneck though.
All of the good food recipies cost either cans of food (which are basically random) or potatos.
It genuinely feels like not enough cooking options use raw meat? Like... I hunted a couple of deer and rabbits and a bear or two and I have a chest full of meat that we're basically not using.
Because grilled/boiled meat gives like 10 fullness.
The only things worth making with it are Beacon and Eggs (Eggs are rare) Meat Stew (requires basically every vegetable in the game, potatoes are semi-rare) or Steak and Potatoes Meal (Potatoes)
Every good recipe that doesn't require canned goods that can only be found from looting also requires potatoes.
So all the other seeds you find in loot (and there sure are a lot of them) basically don't matter.
This issue has only been exascerbated by the change to how water works.
Now with water being much much rarer than before, you have to prioritize high-value meals if they require water to cook.
Meat Stew is worth making, even though it costs a jar of water.
Cornbread is not, because it also costs a jar of water, but provides like 12 fullness in return.
I suggest adding something like a Steak Sandwich recipe. Make it use cornbread and raw meat. Make it give 30+ fullness and some other miscellaneous bonuses.
Alternatively, Steak-and-corn-on-the-cob-Meal.
Basically, take corn-based products that suck and aren't worth making and make them part of another, higher-level recipe. So that we have recipes that we can cook good food with that don't all rely on the same vegatable.
That way "Just plant whatever seeds you've got and you'll be fine" will actually be useful advice.
As an aside, I've maxed out LoTL and i'm not convinced that it gives 7 crops per harvest. I've had this skill-rank for a couple of days now and that doesn't sound right.
I assumed it was 4 crops harvested per plant at maximum, not at level one.
I'll need to wait for my buddy to come online and bring the private game up before I can test it, but...
I've been getting about 40 potatos per harvest, but then i've never had enough potato seeds to actually full the farm with them to begin with. I've always been padding out the extra slots with aloe or something.
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They should add an autorun just on general principle.
You do a lot of running in a straight line here.
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5 hours ago, meganoth said:
But early ammo is scarce and pipe weapons use ammo very inefficiently, so many players mainly use them as "oh-@%$#" weapons. And then damage and magazine size are the only important characteristics.
I also use it like that.
You don't have enough ammo to clear a whole POI in the first week or so (usually) but if you keep a pipe-revolver on your hotbar with 5 shots loaded and you get cornered or a bunch of zombies all leap out at you at once, you can magdump them and run away. Buy yourself time to pick them off one-by-one or just reload and magdump again.
5 bullets will at least kill a couple of zombies, or knock a bunch of them over.
Actually, recently I ended up locked in a bathroom while zombies were banging on the door in my first Infestation mission. T3/4, I think. I dropped through the roof into a diner-room full of zombies and had to mag-dump to thin the herd, then run to get a door between me and them.
Fortunately it was a metal door, and even more fortunately as soon as it started taking damage, a convenient hole opened up at head height.
Plenty of time for me to reload and continue shooting before they battered the door all the way down.
Magazine size is important, but actually having bullets is much more vital.
Although I guess if I was speced into automatics, i'd probably have found more 7.62
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On 6/18/2023 at 3:03 AM, Zerginfestor said:
I personally prefer the turrets sort of remain the same, but the upgraded variants become tracked/hover, making them as sort of psuedo pets that always stay in range of your radius unless they get stuck, increasing their HP as you go up their tech path as well as their damage.
That would be cool, but given how the current robot-drone flies, I don't know if it's realistic to expect pets to be able to path around after us.
I'd love a Wall-E style robot with treads and a gun, but I don't really see it happening.
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7 hours ago, meganoth said:
Because nobody has lots of points in their own weapon perk in early game it really doesn't matter much which pipe weapon you use. Most players will probably craft a pipe machine gun or at max a pipe shotgun, or whatever ammo they have found. Sadly the pipe machine gun is so much better than any other pipe weapon there is no question what to take
Pipe Machinegun has the benefit of being full-auto, but 7.62 is a LOT rarer than 9mm early on.
A pipe revolver seems more useful in general because it's still a gun, it still kills at range and has multiple shots before it's very slow pipe-tier reload (unlike the pipe shotgun and rifle) but you can actually acquire bullets for it.
Personally, (and I've suggested this before) i'd like for the pipe-tier robot-turret weapon to be a projectile-weapon, (every other stat gets a melee and a ranged weapon. Robot-turrets being both means that Int is gimped early on here)
Something like a nailgun, perhaps? or a handheld dart-launcher? (using dart-trap ammo?)
Nerf it's function compared to the actual robotic turret. Maybe it can only shoot forwards and doesn't track enemies? (It detects enemies and shoots, but cannot swivel and aim at them?)
When held, make it like the robot-turret. Hard to aim, with no real sights, but make the ammo fairly cheap to make (cheaper than real bullets, but not trivial, changing junk-ammo to require lead instead of iron was a clever move. It makes it non-infinate, but still cheaper than real ammo.)
On a semi-related note, is anybody else holding off on making higher-grade low-tier gear?
To be clear on what that means, If I can make a tier 5 pipe rifle but only a tier 1 hunting rifle, i'd probably stick with the pipe weapon even though it's technically inferior.
It's supposed to be a straight upgrade, but the 'real' gun isn't actually noticeably better, it uses a fairly significant amount of resources (duct-tape mostly) and it doesn't have any mod-slots so I might not even be able to keep my stuff on it.
Overall, making the 'best' gun/armour/melee weapon/tool that you can make often feels like a poor move?
Maybe if the mod-slots were changed so that the tiers (junk, iron, steel) had diffrent amounts instead of it being determined by quality-tier (level 1, level 2, level 3)
Or perhaps the number of mods you could assign to a gun scaled with your skill level (weapon skill or magazines read?) That way the tier (colour) of your weapon would denote it's durability and damage-stats, but not how many scopes and flashlights you can clamp onto it?
(... we need better nomenclature than using 'tier' for both material (pipe, iron, steel) and colour. (grey, brown, orange, green, blue, purple)
Anyway, with some weapons the function changes enough that it's semi-worth it. (the lever action rifle is such a big upgrade over the hunting rifle just for it's magazine size that even a low-tier one is worth getting right away) but most of the time it doesn't.
A high-tier pipe machinegun is probably more useful than a trash-tier AK.
A blue/purple pipe revolver is almost as good as a grey handgun (especially if you have limited ammo)
T5 leather armour or T1 military?
T5 iron or T1 steel?
The military/steel has better stats than the previous tier of armour, but by the time you can make steel armour you probably have a lot of mods to put in it, which you can't now.
Basically, upgrading feels like a trade-off, and it doesn't feel like it should.
Edit: Idea. Create a system to allow players to directly upgrade a low-quality item into a higher-quality one by adding more material once you have the appropriate skill level.
So you don't have to hold off on building that Magnum just because you can only build a crappy one. You make your crappy one right away and as you gain more handgun skill, you can take the magnum that you have and pour more steel and handgun parts into it to improve it.
Have this be done through the modification menu, I guess.
This way you never need to hold off on making the best stuff you can, just because "I'll be able to make an even better version soon."
... I guess you could just make crafted items scrap for 100% of their initial material investment too, but that's a little boring.
... on second thought, this doesn't actually solve the mod-slot problem. It does prevent you from wasting materials tho.
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1 hour ago, BFT2020 said:
My comment was geared towards those that ignore game mechanics (i.e. removing POIs or just staying home building a base) but expect the game to be balanced towards those playstyles. Learning by Reading, you have multiple options to get the various crafting magazines to progress - loot POIs, purchase from traders, quest rewards, air drops. But if you remove most or all of those options while you are playing, it is not up to TFP to change the game to meet your playstyle, that is up to the player to mod the game.
I have not once perked into Daring Adventure or Better Barter in both of my playthroughs (and really not planning to). I spec into both combat perks (knives, bows, pistols, stealth, etc) and first level utility perks (cooking, LoTL, salvage, mining, physician, etc) to survive as a lone player. And I haven't spent one minute thinking about Int players being strong with traders or Str players being strong with mining and melee combat. I work with the strengths of my build playstyle and counter any weaknesses that I have compared to other builds.
People play all the time without traders and have a great time doing so. They might have to change things because of that choice (for example, making solar panels a loot item or crafting recipe). You can choose not to visit any trader at all or just use them for basic supplies. Nobody is forcing anyone to use traders in this game. Heck, some people have removed all POIs from the game - but in those cases, if you removed those elements, you reduced where you can find crafting magazines; and it is up to you to figure out how to bring those elements back into the game.
7D2D is a great game where you have different ways you can play the game, but no game out there allows for infinite ways to play it. Every game has restrictions in it, no matter where they are on the Sandbox scale.
Personally i'd suggest making solar panels lootable. Or rather, make them harvestable at a low rate from destroyed solar banks.
Have Salvage skill give you better odds of getting them and/or getting better quality, like batteries from cars but rarer. (because destroyed Solar Banks are rare in and of themselves)
On that note: The new generators. The big ones with the Mo' Power signs on them?
Yeah they need tuning up. Salvaging them with a wrench gives very little. It feels like they have decent loot in them (iron, brass, ect) but spread out over way too much Durability.
Like how military trucks used to be before this patch where they'd give the same loot as a car, but take 10x as many swings of your wrench to get it.
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6 hours ago, spacepiggio said:
Yea...it didn't take long for me to figure out water & food updates & I didn't have a struggle with anything but the water filter. You have to buy it & my play style usually ignores the Trader after the beginning quest. I usually play a Nomad survival theme & live off the land mining & scavenging plus you are constantly fixing fortifications for hordes so I don't have time for quests.
Personally i've been running a game in which me and my buddy grab a quest each, knock them both out (thus getting us two rewards each) and then take two more before going back to base for the night.
We build/upgrade/repair at night and loot/quest during the day.
You get plenty of loot by raiding the building that your quest is at, and the quest-reward loot tends to be REALLY good. Either a crate full of skillbooks or occasionally just a full weapon a full tier ahead of what you can make yourself. (I could make Tier 1 iron knives when the dude just gave me a Tier 4 machete, which i've been using ever since) sometimes they fork over workbenches (forges, chemstations) or stuff like a Beaker, which might be hard to find on your own.
Plus, doing enough quests to get sent on a trade-routes mission gets you a bicycle early on and will quickly lead you to all the other traders (now that they have diffrent stock, it's important to know where they all are.)
TLDR: Pay more attention to traders. Getting a quest to raid a POI that you already want to raid anyway is basically like getting paid twice. And that's without even accounting for dukes and exp that you get as a quest reward.
Use the dukes to clear the trader out of whatever skillbooks are relevant to you and you're basically getting paid three times.
This does require setting up a base near a useful trader though. I've noticed that the guy in the pine forest always seems to have cook and toolbooks, which are nice.
The guy in the snowzone (in standard-gen navaz) seems to have gun-stuff and Jen obviously has medical books.
They're cheap too.
If you set up near Jen and do quests for her, you can probably learn how to make first-aid bandages in a day.
That's not bad at all.
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One collector (and regular missions and looting) is enough to keep two players alive for over a week in-game, since me and a buddy literally just did that.
We did find the recipe for Purified Mineral Water very early on and have been using that though, so, uh... without it you might be in trouble?
We couldn't use water for cooking either, we had to go for bacon and eggs every time, no water used to turn cornmeal into real food.
We also had no water for glue, but we didn't have a beaker until recently anyway.
As for dukes, that's super easy. Take both people to a trader, pick up one quest each in the same direction, go do both quests together, collect both rewards for both quests for both people (4x quest rewards)
Now pool your cash together.
You have plenty of Dukes.
Rather than Filters, duct-tape is the bottleneck.
Edit: Remember that you can just drink dirty water and @%$# yourself for a while. It's not the end of the world. Especially if one of you can make Goldenrod Tea.
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The removal of glass jars is nice, and it actually makes water-gathering feel like something that matters, instead of just churning out 50 stacks of dirty water whenever you want out of nothing but sand and a lake... but it does feel kinda weird.
I'm currently holed up in The Harrison Residence POI, and i'm strapping dew collectors onto the roof to collect water so I don't die of thirst, but there's a whole swimming pool just outside of the house that I have no way of bottling.
Like, I can boil dirty water to make clean water (and most of my dirty water seems to be found bafflingly pre-bottled inside toilets) but I have no way to harvest water from my swimming pool, or the lake?
It's weird. I don't even have a suggestion on how to change it. If we could collect it, then water would be unlimited again, but since we can't, it feels weird.
The water is right there, but i'm not allowed to use it.
Speaking of Int-weapons, I agree that they need rounding out with more options. I don't see the need for a whole other weapon-type of blowguns, but the baton needs a Steel Tier
Honestly, the pipe-baton is so much cooler than the stun baton in literally every way, I hope that they replace the iron-tier with something that shares the baton-moveset, instead of being a glorified club with a stun-module on the end.
As for the Robotic-Turret weapon... You currently have the sledge and the gun-turret. They could do scrap-turret/iron-turret/steet-turret, but I like them all having diffrent uses. Maybe... sledge, blade and gun? With the blade-turret slicing zombie limbs instead of knocking them down? Like a one-armed blade-trap that you carry in your arms?
Or Sledge, Gun and Shotgun?
Honestly, you could remove craftable shotgun and SMG turrets and have the Int-based Robotic Turret Weapons replace them.
The simplest way to do it, I think, would be to make the Robotic Sledge a 'pipe' quality weapon, make the gun-turret an 'iron' quality weapon and then make the Robotic Drone a 'steel' quality weapon.
But that only works if you give the Robot Drone a gun.
Maybe a nailgun? Load nails into it as ammo? Or have it use Dart-trap darts?
... Actually, a full-auto version of the robotic turret that fires darts as projectiles would be really cool. Especially if you can fire it from your hands as well as deployed in drone-mode.
Edit: Make the nailgun an int-weapon, boost it's damage to make it combat-worthy.
It's a steel-tier tool anyway, so by the time you get one it won't be too unbalanced to have a gun that shoots non-bullet ammo and can kill zombos.
Basically like the junk-turret, actually, but without a sentry-mode.
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3 hours ago, faatal said:
Friday I started on bandits. I made the entity/sound xml and prefab. He runs around in the A pose saying mean bandit stuff, since we already have a bunch of sounds for it. None of the bandit meshes are skinned yet, but our new animator is working on it.
Skinless bandits running around A-posing while saying 'mean bandit stuff' sounds terrifying.
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My current solution for this is to just not carry steel while upgrading my base.
I don't feel the need to upgrade more than a few specific blocks to steel, and I don't have enough forged steel to do everything, so it goes into the box while i'm not using it.
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On 12/26/2021 at 2:56 PM, meganoth said:
Well, lets run the numbers. One corn and one pumpkin together with an egg, one animal fat and a glass of water gets you one punpkin pie rated at 50 food.
Two eggs would otherwise be best used in Bacon&Eggs rated at 36. It now depends very much on whether you consider one egg a rare resource or equal to the 5 meat or even something you can always get in quantities if you just drive around while hunting for animals or exploring anyway. Lets take the middle ground and rate them at 13 food a piece, and the 5 meat at 10 food as they are worth 10 as grilled meat. Animal fat is mainly used as cooking ingredient and should be in supply if you are hunting anyway. Glass of water is also not really worth mentioning.
So with that I would value 1 corn+1 pumpkin as 50 - 2x13 = 24 and you surely will agree that each is worth the same, so 12 food. One seed is on average say 3.75 produce, which means each seed is worth 45 food streched over its farm lifetime. While the typical can is worth 10 or 15 if you eat it.
Even if I just follow your initial argument to count it only as 2 produce and give some food value to animal fat it still comes out better than the best can even though the difference may be smaller (and I didn't even make the calculation with a top recipe like spaghetti which might look even better). But I can't see the reasoning for your initial assessment that seeds are only worth 2, you may have to explain that again. I would drop the "return to base" line at least, if you don't regularily return to your base anyway it isn't a base after all.
If you ask me, taking a corn seed home with LotL0 is totally worth it.
Food in general is weird.
You've got low-tier food and top-tier food and no real mid-tier stuff.
Like, I wanted to graduate from eating plain boiled meat because I had to eat like a full stack of it at once to fill up, so i looked into cooking and farming.
Beacon&Eggs is good, but there's no reliable way to get eggs.
Ok, so what do I need for the other foods?
Potatoes, corn, mushrooms.
Everything seems to require at mimimum two of these three, which means that you need a full farm and a bunch of seeds of each type.
Once you have all of those, you should be making stew anyway, so what's the point?
Like, Steak and Potatoes doesn't actually take meat and potatoes (a meat and one vegetable meal) it takes mushrooms too.
It also provides just as much food (50) as the meat stew.
So what's the point?
I'd rather if that meal literally just took meat and potatoes, and gave you 20 or 30 food instead.
A meal that gives you a decent but not amazing amount of food so you don't need to cook ten stacks of them, but actually doesn't require a full selection of every vegetable in the game.
Something to tide you over in the first one or two weeks while you're trying to get your initial farm set up and scrounge together enough seed-crops to actually get your corn, potato and mushroom farms going.
Cos that's the worst part. Having enough corn to start making 'proper' food, but not having enough potatoes, or enough mushrooms, so you're stuck eating boiled meat and the occasional bacon when you can find the eggs.
Nah, give me a real steak and potato recipe. Give me a steak sandwich (meat + cornbread) recipe.
Make them not great, but make them better than just boiling or grilling meat on it's own.
One vegetable is better than none.
As for the food that you make out of canned stuff... it's super situational, given the weird resources that they all take, and that there's no reliable source of specific types of canned food, so it's not really something that you can feed a whole group on. Plus, not every can is used in a recipe.
Setting up base in a building with a functioning vending machine is a pretty nice way to get a solid supply of food though.
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So where do yall put your farms anyway?
I don't want mine outside my base or on the ground floor in case zombies get at it, but I can't put it on the roof because on horde-night its a huge pile of acid-spitting vultures up there.
Can you plant crops underground? I could build a bunker, I guess.
Or put them on the roof and then build walls and a floor above them.
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The pipe weapons look delightful.
Very nice artstyle. Really fantastic.
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16 minutes ago, Kalex said:
I love to send them flying with my stun baton with the stun repulsor mod in it.
The Yeet is fun, but the sound-effect is way too loud, and the visual effect is near blinding.
Also, you can't even get a stun-baton until steel-tier loot starts dropping or being sold at the trader, because it requires parts to build.
Personally, i'm looking forwards to seeing the other tiers of stun-batons when they finally come out.
Originally I was thinking of 'stone age' as like... actual stone-age. Cavemen and stuff, but if the blunderbuss (and probably pipe guns) are going to need pipes to craft, then it's pretty much expected that you have to get a wrench before you can build anything, right?
Use the wrench on a toilet to get pipes, then look for glue and cloth to make duct-tape for your pipe-gun, right?
But if you have a wrench, you can get electrical parts, so you could have electrical tools at t0, so long as you don't need forged iron to make it.
The forge should be the gatekeeper for iron tools and then the crucible the gatekeeper for steel tools.
I want a little home-made taser for primitive. Like a fist-sized battery with copper prongs sticking out of the front.
Then maybe the stun baton for iron, and some super-cool looking sword or axe or spiked mace with lightning pouring out of it for steel tier.
The baton looks kinda lame. I want the final option to look as cool as the new steel-tier axe. I want something that lives up to the name "The Electrocutioner" and hits dudes like Mjölnir.
Edit: I like the idea of putting burning shaft on the stun-baton for double status-effects, but the fire-effect is really ugly, and makes it hard to see.
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1 minute ago, Danidas said:
As Meganoth said in A20 it's already been confirmed that the Blunderbuss and its ammo are going away. In it's place will be a T0 pipe gun for each of the attributes that will use normal ammo. Such as a pipe pistol using 9mm, pipe shotgun using shells, pipe rifle and a pipe machine gun using 7.62, lastly we will hopefully get something for Intellect but that is not confirmed yet. The basic plan is to ensure that from day one everyone will have access to a basic crude gun no matter the build you intend to go with.
Yeah, like i said. This being the basic plan was obvious from a19, but I like the blunderbuss. Both for it's looks and it's ammo.
It makes it a lot easier to scrounge up some ammo to use your t0 weapon when you don't need a forge to melt down brass and lead, or a workbench to assemble it into bullets.
But conversely, the weapon itself is so slow and hard to use that making yourself huge piles of this primitve ammo isn't a good use of resources, because eventually you'll graduate to t1 and all that ammo will be wasted.
If we kept primitive ammo for pistols, shotguns and rifles, they all used the same basic ingredients and scrapped to gunpowder (and were craftable in your basic inventory) then we'd be able to make do for a while on that alone, without having to scrounge up any proper bullets.
Then again, A19 made ammo-loot quite a bit more common, though I don't remember finding much on the first week.
I managed to get a stack of 9mm and a handgun ready by day 5, so I was able to hold off the horde with it, because a blunderbuss never would have worked.
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28 minutes ago, meganoth said:
Probably you missed the announcement that makeshift pipe weapon will appear in A20 as T0 weapons, including a pipe shotgun that will replace the blunderbuss
I didn't see the announcement, but I sorta assumed. You can tell by how the game treats the blunderbuss that it's being used as a T0 gun, and it wouldn't make sense for it to be the only gun that has a t0 version.
Honestly, the blunderbuss makes a fine pipe-shotgun. I don't see any reason to change it.
Sure, you could make it look less 'pirate' and more 'scrap-pipes assembled into something resembling a modern shotgun' but... I find it charming.
Plus, muzzle-loading pebbles and gunpowder is probably the most primitive you could possibly make a shotgun.
And again, i wonder what sort of 'pipe turret' will show up for the intelligence skill-tree.
... actually, now I kinda just want to get a pipe as a weapon.
Not a pipe-anything, just a pipe.
Bonk.
Craft it from two pipes and maybe a bit of scrap-iron?
It's probably two-handed, so it wouldn't count as a club. Could maybe replace the stone sledge with it. Or have the stone sledge and the lead-pipe be sidegrades.
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The fact that the Blunderbuss is useful again makes me happy, but it does kinda shoehorn early players into having to use shotguns, which is a problem.
I hope A20 adds a pipe pistol and maybe a rifle, along with fixing the primitive bow so it doesn't suck so much.
That way in the early-game we'd have ranged weapons for almost every build available in the 'stone age'
Getting ammo for them would be a pain. Maybe if they all use something like blunderbuss ammo, which can be made without needing lead or brass?
Oh, and blunderbuss ammo scrapping to paper instead of gunpowder feels like an oversight. The gunpowder is definately the most valuable ingredient in there.
No idea what the stone-age intelligence weapons are going to be.
Neither electrocution or robots lend-themselves well to caveman tech-levels.
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Alpha 21 Dev Diary
in News & Announcements
Posted · Edited by iamnuff (see edit history)
This is something I noticed in the previous experimental versions. Where it didn't feel worth upgrading from a T5/6 iron tool to a T1 steel one, because the stat-diffrence was minor and you lost all of your mod-slots.
'Adjusted' is a bit sparse on details, but I've got high hopes for this.
I'm also running a perception build.
You get roughly 240 gas per car (intact cars only) with maxed out Salvage Operations, which is basically a drop in the bucket of a 4x4.
Mining oil-shale to make gas at a chem-bench seems basically mandatory.
I went out with a friend and I wrenched every car we found along the entire road to the destination, and every car in the carpark once we got there (twice) and by the time we got back to base again we were basically back on the amount of gas that we started with.
It wasn't a short drive, but I must have wrenched more than a dozen cars.
You used to get way waaaay too much gas this way (like a full stack of 6000 per car) but now it feels like too little.
For a minibike it's easy to keep yourself topped up, but the 4x4 is a real guzzler.