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iamnuff last won the day on August 23

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  1. Do plants grow underground? I tried to set some up in my basement and it wouldn't let me put the seeds in the plots. How much headroom do they need? We've got like 9 blocks, so it should be fine. Ended up having to put the crops on the roof of the building next door (our building is a target for vultures every 7 days)
  2. Bit slow to reply to this one, but I find Melee turrets completely inadequate for any purpose. If you build your base to have one entry through a narrow corridor, it could push people back, but it attacks so slowly that you'd probably be better off with multiple layers of ablative iron bars. The melee turret feels really cool to use (and can send other players flying, even with friendly fire off) bu it attacks too slowly, only hits one target at a time and doesn't do meaningful damage. It can't hold off a whole horde, and it can't kill individual zombies. It can knock a zombie down over and over, but unless you're fighting a single really powerful zombie, that's not really very useful compared to the ability to just kill it, which even a fireaxe can do better. I like the idea of a 'shove trap' that throws people into spikes or spinning blades, but this one just doesn't have the range. Both on the attack itself, or on how far it throws enemies.
  3. "If you put points in into your weapon skill, the weapon will do more damage and swing/reload faster. So also let you make better versions of the weapons you want. These are your most important stats. Stuff like Cardio can come after, as a quality of life perk." Then let them live or die by their own choices. If you're four waves in and nobody has invested into using any kind of weapon yet, then they probably deserve to all wipe. Especially if you've been explicitly telling when that they need to.
  4. If you're investing in Fortitude, then there's no reason to settle for an SMG, the poor-man's automatic. Go Whole Hog and put that drum-mag on an M60. My gun can hold basically a whole stack of 7.62 and rips dudes apart in two bullets. If you want to conserve ammo, the Tactical Assault Rifle accepts the single-fire receiver. Or put the drum-mag on an auto-shotgun, since you said you were going strength. Yeah, sometimes I wish I could invest points in weapon-skills without having to invest in that attribute too. I like hunting rifles, but a hunting rifle isn't going to save me on horde-night, so i'll have to prioritise fortitude for my machine-gun, and i'm the group engineer too, so I gotta go INT, with advanced engineering and grease-monkey. I'd like to go with a baseball bat instead of a brawling weapon too, but... well. I don't get the bonuses unless I invest heavily, so I'm better off with my fists. Oh well, at least steel knuckles will let me harvest meat without having to haul a machete around with me.
  5. I already run around the house enough just trying to find what i'm after, or grabbing stuff from this chest and that chest so i'm ready to go out, or come back in. The 'stack items from inventory into chest' option is nice, but I wish there was a way to lock some items to not do that, or lock specific slots to not do it. Twice now, I've accidentally packed away all of my food and ammo and then gone outside with nothing. Though now I've got an ammo box created, that's not so much of an issue. It's a really nice way to get all the car-parts out of my inventory after I go dismantling or something though. Makes packing random gubbins away a lot easier.
  6. That's awful. I can't imagine storing my food items in ten different containers. How do you keep anything organised?
  7. You 100% can gather iron with nothing but a stone axe. You could probably do it with your bare hands, if the game didn't require you to smash something to pieces before you're allowed to pick it up. I'd prefer to remove the stone tools entirely in favour of scrap, so... either start the player with a scrap-axe (like how you start with a torch and some chilli) or add a way to gather metal without any tools at all. Even that is only a problem because you have to 'break' metal items to get the metal out, instead of just picking up some junk off the ground. Signposts, car-frames, railings, barricades. There's metal everywhere and gathering it is only an issue because you can't just pull bits off until after you punch the item to death. Replace the 'scrounging for rocks on the ground' portion of the tutorial with 'looking in trash-piles for empty cans or cookpots that can be scrapped for iron' (Maybe add more scrappable iron items to go with the lead fishing weights and the brass candle-sticks and doorknobs?) Or just start us with a couple of empty cans or something. Have the implication be that we had more food but we used it all and we're now on our last can of chilli. Or just make it so that you can craft a quality 1 scrap tool with the amount of iron you get from a single tin-can, so you can start the game, eat your chilli and immediately be ready to go?
  8. The Yeet is fun, but the sound-effect is way too loud, and the visual effect is near blinding. Also, you can't even get a stun-baton until steel-tier loot starts dropping or being sold at the trader, because it requires parts to build. Personally, i'm looking forwards to seeing the other tiers of stun-batons when they finally come out. Originally I was thinking of 'stone age' as like... actual stone-age. Cavemen and stuff, but if the blunderbuss (and probably pipe guns) are going to need pipes to craft, then it's pretty much expected that you have to get a wrench before you can build anything, right? Use the wrench on a toilet to get pipes, then look for glue and cloth to make duct-tape for your pipe-gun, right? But if you have a wrench, you can get electrical parts, so you could have electrical tools at t0, so long as you don't need forged iron to make it. The forge should be the gatekeeper for iron tools and then the crucible the gatekeeper for steel tools. I want a little home-made taser for primitive. Like a fist-sized battery with copper prongs sticking out of the front. Then maybe the stun baton for iron, and some super-cool looking sword or axe or spiked mace with lightning pouring out of it for steel tier. The baton looks kinda lame. I want the final option to look as cool as the new steel-tier axe. I want something that lives up to the name "The Electrocutioner" and hits dudes like Mjölnir. Edit: I like the idea of putting burning shaft on the stun-baton for double status-effects, but the fire-effect is really ugly, and makes it hard to see.
  9. Yeah, like i said. This being the basic plan was obvious from a19, but I like the blunderbuss. Both for it's looks and it's ammo. It makes it a lot easier to scrounge up some ammo to use your t0 weapon when you don't need a forge to melt down brass and lead, or a workbench to assemble it into bullets. But conversely, the weapon itself is so slow and hard to use that making yourself huge piles of this primitve ammo isn't a good use of resources, because eventually you'll graduate to t1 and all that ammo will be wasted. If we kept primitive ammo for pistols, shotguns and rifles, they all used the same basic ingredients and scrapped to gunpowder (and were craftable in your basic inventory) then we'd be able to make do for a while on that alone, without having to scrounge up any proper bullets. Then again, A19 made ammo-loot quite a bit more common, though I don't remember finding much on the first week. I managed to get a stack of 9mm and a handgun ready by day 5, so I was able to hold off the horde with it, because a blunderbuss never would have worked.
  10. I didn't see the announcement, but I sorta assumed. You can tell by how the game treats the blunderbuss that it's being used as a T0 gun, and it wouldn't make sense for it to be the only gun that has a t0 version. Honestly, the blunderbuss makes a fine pipe-shotgun. I don't see any reason to change it. Sure, you could make it look less 'pirate' and more 'scrap-pipes assembled into something resembling a modern shotgun' but... I find it charming. Plus, muzzle-loading pebbles and gunpowder is probably the most primitive you could possibly make a shotgun. And again, i wonder what sort of 'pipe turret' will show up for the intelligence skill-tree. ... actually, now I kinda just want to get a pipe as a weapon. Not a pipe-anything, just a pipe. Bonk. Craft it from two pipes and maybe a bit of scrap-iron? It's probably two-handed, so it wouldn't count as a club. Could maybe replace the stone sledge with it. Or have the stone sledge and the lead-pipe be sidegrades.
  11. The fact that the Blunderbuss is useful again makes me happy, but it does kinda shoehorn early players into having to use shotguns, which is a problem. I hope A20 adds a pipe pistol and maybe a rifle, along with fixing the primitive bow so it doesn't suck so much. That way in the early-game we'd have ranged weapons for almost every build available in the 'stone age' Getting ammo for them would be a pain. Maybe if they all use something like blunderbuss ammo, which can be made without needing lead or brass? Oh, and blunderbuss ammo scrapping to paper instead of gunpowder feels like an oversight. The gunpowder is definately the most valuable ingredient in there. No idea what the stone-age intelligence weapons are going to be. Neither electrocution or robots lend-themselves well to caveman tech-levels.
  12. Don't the cabinets have a lot less storage space than the crates? Or do you mean that you make crates and paint them to look like cabinets ?
  13. Yes, but you have about the same chance of finding gun-parts as you do of finding a full (low-grade) gun, so that doesn't actually matter. Early on, the only weapons or items that will drop are stone tools and the occasional blunderbuss, and the only gun-based item you will ever find is gunpowder or blunderbuss ammo. By the time parts for other gun start dropping, those guns themselves will already have been added to the loot-table. Because living in a hole in the ground, looking for iron and lead and nitrate and then melting those all down in a furnace and then crafting the thing you need out of it will take a very long time and be really boring? Depending on where you set your base up, you might not find a vein of the ore you need until late, and you might not be able to arm yourself properly for horde-night. Look, it should never have been about 'crafters vs gatherers' That was a stupid concept from day one. You have to do both to make it in this game. Looting and scavenging should be for immediate short-term gain, and setting up your own mineshaft or farm should be for long-term sustainability. If I suddenly find myself desperately short on food, i'll go out and raid a food-looking building and see what I can find. Once short-term survival is sorted out, i'll see about setting a small farm up so I don't end up in that situation again. If I need a pistol for the first horde, then i'll go looting and see if I can find a gun in a toilet or at the trader, but if I'm already doing pretty well and I want to upgrade from my current mid-grade pistol to a top-grade one, then i'll set about making a long-term project to collect all the pieces I need for it. Same with materials. If I need a bit of iron, i'll go out and find some. If I need a lot of iron and i'm willing to wait a long time for a big pay-off, i'll dig a hole. For lead, you can smelt down batteries and fishing weights, or you can look for a lead vein. For ammo, you can find a fair bit out and about, to keep you afloat and maybe handle a horde or two, but if you want to arm up like you're looking to take over a small nation and prepare yourself for endgame hordes, you're going to need a coal, lead and nitrate mine so you can churn out 1000's of rounds of ammunition at a time. TLDR: Scavenging should be a reliable way to find low-grade tools and resources in common but small amounts, to keep you going without letting you stockpile overmuch. Mining, farming and crafting should be time and effort intensive methods that allow you you create huge amounts of food, supplies and top-tier weapons and tools. Currently it's the opposite. Investing enough into a skill to make a t5 tool can be made immediately worthless by just finding something better while you're out and about, and it's disappointing every time. It feels like an absolute waste of effort. The most satisfying loot is skill-books and schematics, because they increase the amount of things you can craft. Second is low-grade guns or steel tools, because they allow you to scrap them and build high-grade versions for yourself and your buddies. "Oh hey, I found yet another another crappy pistol. This means I can use the parts from this and the resources I already collected make my buddy that t5 revolver he wanted so he can threaten traders with it." "Oh, great. I found the pump-action shotgun schematic. We can finally break down all of those rubbish double-barrel shotguns we've been using for over a week and pop out a pair of pump-action shotties." "I like this hunting rifle I found at the trader, but it's only T1 so I can't put a scope on it" "Give it here, i'll scrap it and make you a better one." "Anything good in the chest?" "Nah, just some crap iron armour." "Take it anyway, we'll toss it on the forge. Can always use more iron." Give me crap loot, but make the crap loot valuable enough that I want to take it with me anyway. Either because the iron content is high, or because it's worth a bunch of dukes, or because it scraps into otherwise unobtainable weapon-parts.
  14. What do yall use for storing your crap back at base? Standard Secure Wooden Chests were the go-to for a long time... but they're kinda boring. They all look the same, the wood look is kinda out of place in a lot of bases, and they don't hold a huge amount. Storage crates are the next step up. Takes nails to build, listed in crafting as 'wooden furniture/containers' and can be reshaped like wood frames to give you many different shapes. Most of the shapes are more-or-less useless, because they have rubbish storage capacity, but the crates are nice, have tons of space and can be painted with plenty of designs. Sure, you can make a gun-crate, a medical-crate and a food-crate, or you could paint a crate like a beer-cabinet or an oven. Because it's a 1x1 cube, it can be painted to look like pretty much any other block. A sink, a big chunky pillbox They even stack, which is nice. Hmm I wonder if I could use two to make a standing fridge? Anyway, I thought to myself "If the wooden furniture blocks can do all this, I wonder what the metal ones can turn into?" Well, that was a disappointment. You can make lockers, but they don't have much storage space in them at all, which is a shame. I would have liked to make a locker and store guns in it, or suchlike. Most of the other stuff just seemed like junk. There's also that green drawer that you can embed into walls, but it makes an annoying noise every time you use it. The safe and gunsafe exist too, but IIRC those are a bit small, given how many resources they take to build. So... what do other people use to store stuff? Ya'll got anything interesting or are you a bunch of boring Secure Storage Chest users?
  15. Honestly, making everything yourself is more satisfying because it's the product of your own efforts, instead of just opening boxes and seeing of RNG shines down on you today, but for basic stuff like tools, you kinda should be behind. You're mining an iron vein deep underground and smithing your own pickaxe, and the other guys are walking down the street to the tool-shop and grabbing random tools off the shelves. Yeah, they shouldn't be able to find m60's so easily, but iron tools should be available at the toolshop, otherwise why does the toolshop exist? It's a bit more complicated with guns, because you can't make a gun unless you already have a gun. Making gun-parts a lot more common than the guns themselves was a good step, because it allows us to loot, then use the things we looted to build the things we want. It does, however, require us to have a heavy skill investment in every weapon skill we want to try out. I like sniperrifles. I'd love to build a t3 or 4 hunting rifle to hunt deer with, or to pick off zombies from my rooftop. I need to put those points into Machine-guns instead though, because a hunting rifle won't save me on horde-night. That means that even if I learn how to craft a hunting rile (or a marksman rifle, or even a sniper-rifle) from a schematic, the versions that I craft will always be near-useless, because they'll be tier 1. Regarding the satisfaction of crafting though, it seems pretty clear to me that the 'Quality 6 tools and weapons can only be found, not made' idea is backwards. We should never be able to find max-tier weapons, we should only be able to make them. We should level up the skill, invest lots of points into it, find the blueprint for the best kind of that weapon (steel tools, m60s, sniper-rifles, machetes, ect) and then gather as many parts as we can from lesser tools that we've broken down, or loot-crates, or traders. And then we should create the greatest version of that item possible, which would never have been obtainable by random chance, without us putting this dedicated effort and resources into achieving it. You want a quality-6 steel pickaxe? Invest in mining skills and sacrifice ten or more quality-1 steel tools. You want the best pistol possible? you'd better be willing to break down every other pistol you own. You'll still need to loot to aquire these perfect tools, because you'll need to find the inferior items to break down for parts, or valuable items you can exchange for those parts at the trader. But you'll also need to actually be good at shotguns to be able to get your hands on a purple auto-shotgun. Not just randomly find it in a box one day. Crafting what? For tools, it's disappointing to open a crate and find a caveman's spare rock-breaking hammer instead of something useful, but for guns it's crippling. You can't craft guns until guns start to drop, because guns have guns as a crafting ingredient. If you want an iron woodaxe, you just need forged iron. If you want a hunting rifle, you need rifle parts. Which you only get from hunting rifles. The only exception to this rule is the blunderbuss, which can be made out of pipes and duct-tape, or the bow, which is just sticks, rocks and grass. A pipe revolver and a pipe rifle would ease those worries nicely, so long as ammo for them is as easily available as it is for the blunderbuss.
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